Stretched Tripacer 200hp

[Daryl Baker]

Hello Everyone, This is my 1st post. I frequent this web site a lot. Great site. It has given me lots of good info while building this project. Thanks. I thought the people here may want to read about my aircraft. Based at Windham Airport in Connecticut. I did see someone asking about the engine mount length. Aircraft was built by myself over 8 years for approx. $35,000. I have flown it 28 hrs and 20 flights. Is not hard to fly and handles well. Will post some photos. Would be happy to answer any questions.
Summary:

Bush Sport 200 Aircraft Project – N4625D Serial Number 21056
• 37 ft wing span. Dihedral and Washout same as PA18.
• 2 place with large baggage capacity
• Empty weight 1096 lbs. CG 11.25
• Gross Weight 2200 lbs.
• Cruise at 115 mph at 2300 rpm.
• Takeoff rpm approx. 2500-2550
• Takeoff run – Short!
• Climb rate – Excessive!

Construction (From Savaged 1952 PA22 Airframe)

Fuselage:
• Lengthened 2 ft using Javelin Aircraft Company plans. Gas welded.
• Univair STC conventional gear and Scott Tailwheel. 26 inch Goodyear tires.
• Fabricated toe brakes using Univair plans.
• Removed rear passenger door and framed in installing window. Duplicated opposite side.
• Installed Pilot’s side door entry. Duplicated opposite side.
• Installed skylight using plans from an approved FAA Form 337 PA22 installation.
• Installed double jackscrew trim assembly to add structural support strut to the stabilizers. Same basic design as Crosswinds STC Modification.

Wings:
• Assembled from PA22 wing parts and aluminum spar blanks bought from A & E Aircraft Services of Bellevue, WA. Spar blanks are the same dimensions as Piper spars 6061-T6 aluminum.
• Fabricated spars, lift strut fittings, jury strut fittings, leading edge. Front wing spar was reinforced at the lift strut fitting with plans from Javelin Aircraft Company.
• Extra ribs bought from Carlson Aircraft Inc. Piper STC replacement ribs.
• Wing is a close copy of the PA18 wing. Same rib spacing. Wing rib stitched.
• 3 aileron hinges and 3 flap hinges.
• Lift struts were fabricated from Wag Aero Sportsman 2+2 aircraft material kit. TIG welded by a 30 year aircraft welder.
• Micro Air design VG’s on wings and stabilizers.

Control Surfaces:
• Ailerons and Flaps were constructed from PA22 parts (1 and ½ sets spliced together). Ailerons are the same length as the PA18 and the flaps are approx. 6 inches longer (6 ft.).
• The PA22 tail surfaces were enlarged to be approx. the same size as the PA18’s
• 10 inch sections welded in to the center of the stabilizers and elevators. Internal sleeve method.
• The rudder had 4 inches welded in to make it wider (height not changed).

Firewall Forward:
• Engine is from a Mooney, IO360-A3B6D 200HP. Overhauled per the Lycoming engine manual. New D3000 series magneto, fuel pump. Light weight Skytec starter.
• Engine mount fabricated and TIG welded by 30 year aircraft welder. Same basic design as the PA22 Univair 180 HP conversion STC. Same engine offsets as the PA22 mount. Engine mount 10 inches longer than PA22 mount.
• Engine cowling fabricated. Nose bowl purchased.
• Engine baffles fabricated from Van’s RV plans. Oil cooler rear baffle mounted.
• Vetterman crossover exhaust system for Van’s RV aircraft modified with slightly longer tailpipes.
• Prop is a PA-25 McCauley P235 AFA8452 overhauled and re-pitched at 46 (AFA8446).
• Fuel system is similar to the Cessna with both wing tanks feeding at the same time. 36 gal of fuel in two 18 gal wing tanks. Weldon boost pump mounted on firewall.

 

[Ruidoso Ron]

Daryl, Sounds real neat! May we see pictures?

 

[Daryl Baker]

I posted some photos in the photo gallery section. Experimental Cubs.

 

[brown bear]

stretched tripacer 200 hp

I like the 1096 empty and 2200lb !
I,d Love to see some photos!!
Doug

 

[Dave Calkins]

Daryl, sounds totally cool.

What's the wing incidence?

What's the instrument panel like? i.e., how is touchdown spot visibility?

Another SC.org member is doing a project similar to yours and is wrestling with the question of incidence and also over-the-nose visibility on final, so I'm thinking of him as I ask you these questions.

Thanks, DAVE

 

[redrooster]

Awesome looking airplane, Daryl, looks like you did a great job. Did you keep the control yokes, or go to sticks? How about gear length, is the standard Univair 22/20 gear long enough for the required clearance for the 84" prop?

Rooster

 

[Daryl Baker]

The controls are the same as a PA22 with yokes and instr. panel is from the 1952 PA22. Most of my time is in a Taylorcraft so yokes were comfortable. Basic instruments nothing fancy. Small Microair radio. No transponder yet. The wing incidence angle (PA22) is not the same as the PA18. One reason for the 26 inch tires is for ground clearance. It is about 11-12 inches with the tail up and level. Touchdown spot visibility is not a problem. Better with full flaps. I installed the tail VG's after making a few flights. They made a difference seems like I can get the tail wheel to touch before the mains now.

 

[CaptAmerica]

Daryl,

Very cool plane, the sub 1100 weight sounds awesome, I'm the guy Dave Calkins was referring to as just getting into some of the decisions that you made on your bird...

Out of curiosity, what is your tail weight? Do you find the tail weight supports a wheel landing with fair to hard brake pressure? And what would you say takeoff distance was at gross and a particular Density Alt?

Some Producers have a wing span about 38'-9", did you do any debate to get to your wing span of 37'?

Now that you're flying it, anything you'd do different?

I'm working with Steve Bryant up here in Anchorage to construct an experimental Producer, IO-360 200+ hp, considering D&E Riblett wings vs. Piper, considering moving the engine forward, matching a cub's AOI and overall trying to keep it very light, clean and simple. Any input would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance, again, cool plane...

Josh

 

[Daryl Baker]

Hello Josh,
My tail weight when raised up for the weight and balance was 54 lbs. It is heavier when down on the ground. I have felt the tail lift once when braking hard for a runway turn off. Do need to remember that. Another passenger or baggage weight would help. I am still flying off the restrictions so it is just me in the plane. During my flights the plane has been pretty light so it gets off quickly. Don't know yet what the takeoff run will be at gross. I am pleased with the way it handles. It has exceeded my expectations. I thought I would miss my 100hp Taylorcraft but this plane is also a blast to fly. It fells more solid at slow speeds than the Taylorcraft. No science in the wing span. The blank spars came in 17 ft. lengths and I used them full length. Things I would do different:
- My savaged PA22 airframe came with the Univair gear otherwise I would have built taller PA18 style gear.
- Would have welded on float fittings. I will use bolt on.
- Would use wing root fuel sight gages instead of the PA22 electric fuel gage. Simple less wiring.
- Don't need the landing light. I do not fly at night.
- Did not think about door stops. If you hinge in front like the PA22 the door contacts the bottom of the wing fabric. The PA22 had the stop on the lift strut but with the long wing it is out of the way. I could have incorporated a stop coming out of the bottom of the wing. Now I need to use some cable between the door frame and the door. Future project.
- Lessons learn and recommendation: Use mechanical gages/instruments wherever possible. Simple cheap no wiring and you don’t fry a bunch of instruments $$ if you have an unexpected power surge.
You can also contact me using my email if you want it is in my profile. I like to talk about airplanes. Later Daryl

 

[Steve Pierce]

I have seen some Short Wings with a pneumatic cylinder attached under the seat/carry-thru attached to the door. Looks like a simple solution. I will find the pictures and post.

 

[redrooster]

Daryl, any way to fasten some sort of door stop to a wing rib thru the fabric? Pneumatic/hydraulic cylinder-type affair isn't a bad idea but seems like it'd be in the way all the time, down at the location that Steve suggested. Better up high? Or maybe convert doors to top-hinged seaplane style?

Rooster

 

[Daryl Baker]

I will have to look at whether I could attached something to a wing rib. That might work. Might be able to rib stitch and glue a small rubber bumper. When you climb in the plane your foot goes close to the bottom hinge. Anything on the bottom of the door would be in the way. Up high would be best.

 

[CaptAmerica]

Daryl,

Thanks for the info, I'll send an email one of these days...

for a doorstop, I wonder if correctly mated magnets off a post attached to the wing rib and one to the upper corner of door would work, would have to be small enough and strong enough to add little weight...

Josh

 

[Daryl Baker]

I posted a few more pictures of my plane with some explanations. May give those building Stretched Tripacers some ideas.

 

[Steve Pierce]

Daryl, Thanks for putting the description with your photos. Really helps to know what and how. I am rebuilding my PA16, then my L18C and have been collecting parts to build an experimental stretched Clipper after that out of the several Tri-Pacer frames I have. Thanks for sharing your stuff, it gets my wheels turning.

 

[Bill Rusk]

Photos

 

[redrooster]

I will have to look at whether I could attached something to a wing rib. That might work. Might be able to rib stitch and glue a small rubber bumper. When you climb in the plane your foot goes close to the bottom hinge. Anything on the bottom of the door would be in the way. Up high would be best.

Daryl, I flew in a buddy's Pacer today. He has a (kinda phonied-up) door stop clamped around the (sealed) RH strut. But he also has a nylon "limiting strap" inside the door-- one end's fastened to the forward door jamb and the other end's fastened to the forward edge of the door inside panel. It limits the opening travel of the door--know what I mean?
It musta stretched or something, it's not really doing it's job now. Instead of shortening it as required, some previous owner just put on the strut-mounted stop. One thing about that one, it (sorta) holds the door in the open position-- the inside strap-type stop just keeps it from opening too far.

Rooster

 

[drew]

Thanks for all the great tips and help, Daryl! I was curious as to whether your struts are full-length PA14-style, or if you went with Javelin's short-wing struts.

I'm seriously considering picking up one of the many inexpensive Tri-Pacer projects out there and treating it like a quick-build Wag-Aero 2+2 "kit".

Drew

 

[Daryl Baker]

Drew,
The wings are a close copy of the PA18 with long lift struts and jury struts. 37 ft wing span. The distance from wing root to the lift strut fitting is the same as the PA18. I did not use the short Tripacer struts. I did beef up the front wing spar using the Javelin design installing two 3 ft aluminum bars center over the front wing lift strut fitting. The angle of the fuselage lift strut mount tab needs to be adjusted approx. 10 degrees. I heated and bent the tab. With my lift strut design you could probably put the 10 degree bend in the front lift strut lower end and leave the fuselage tab alone.