PA-14 Mods, STC's, Registration, Help!

[novice]

Ok, I need the vast knowledge of this body for advice. I am getting closer to buying the PA-14 I mentioned in another post but I have many questions. If anyone remembers the other post, it is in Ottawa Canada, I'm in Alaska so it is a stretch to say the least. There seems to be a little communication gap, the owner obviously speaks French primarily. I have been dealing mostly with his son. I have had them send me copies of some of the logs and a W&B that was done in 2005 at the time of the O-360 install. They only sent engine, prop, airframe logs that only go back to about 1987, I'm sure there is more to it but I think the communication gap is getting us here. There was a O-320 installed in 1987 and the O-360 in 2005. I want to find out from you if there are any "no-go's" at this point with the information I have before I spend the money to have someone go look at it for me.

OK, to the questions
#1 I am a little worried about the O-360 install. It was done in Canada with a 0-time O-360 A1A in 2005. It has only <150 hours. I can't find a FAA STC for an A1A install. The only one I can find is Charlie Center's for a -14. It looks like the work was done by Night Hawk Technologie and signed off by Aero Atelier, both in Quebec. I don't know what will transfer or if it will. I thought it might be good to find out if there was another STC that called for an A1A so in worst case the paper could be purchased? Any advice on this issue?

#2 the serial number ends in an X (14-123x). I can only find two Pa-14's that have serial numbers that end in X, both in eastern canada. I thought this might have something to do with it being experimental in Canada but both are registered normal and the owner has no idea what it means. I can't find it in a list of pa-14's but I don't have an official piper production list either. It seems to fit right in line, on all the lists I have seen 14-123 is missing but 122&124 are there.

#3 it has wing tips, they say "Booster Tips". I'm guessing these are Cub Crafters Plane Boosters? There is a -14 STC for these. Any opinions about these?

#4 The subject of my other thread was the McCauley 8443 prop (IP-235) I can't find an STC for this either. I know several guys on here said they were using it so it must be OK?

I guess what I am most worried about is getting it into the country and getting the new registration and airworthiness cert. It will not be used for commercial ops, at least not part 135, so I don't think everything needs to be perfect. We might use it for some guide work occasionally down the road under Part 91. How much of the above do I need to worry about?

This one seems like a very nice airplane for a good price, not to mention a very interesting model. If there are any other14's out there for sale that you know of, let me know.

As my name states, I am really a novice at all of this. I just don't want any surprises.

thanks

 

[cruiser]

I believe this was mentioned in comments to your previous inquiry-be advised that the current PA12/14 type certificate holder sold some modifications that are NOT recognized by the FAA. Buyer beware. Jim

 

[novice]

I believe this was mentioned in comments to your previous inquiry-be advised that the current PA12/14 type certificate holder sold some modifications that are NOT recognized by the FAA. Buyer beware. Jim

thanks Jim, I am aware of this and I have not seen any sign of this guy, I believe he is in BC? It look like all the work on this thing has been done in Eastern Canada, at least the engine work. That said, he was the first thing I thought of when I saw the "x" in the serial number.

 

[Paul Heinrich]

The aircraft must conform to the original Type Certificate
and any applicable STC, 337, and field approvals in order to be given an US airworthiness certificate.

Before it is exported, the exporter must provide you with a certificate of airworthiness for export which attests to the fact that the aircraft is in conformity with the TCDS, and that any modifications from the original Type Certificate are covered by a STC, 337, or Field Approval. The aircraft is then de-registered from Canada.

Upon entry into the US, the plane must have a conformity inspection to verify it is in fact in conformity with the paperwork.

Canadian STCs are not valid for use on US registered aircraft unless there is a corresponding US issued STC. (I may be wrong but I don't think Canada TC has 337s or field approvals.) Also, I believe the plane must have some documentation that it had, at one time, a US airworthiness certificate or certificate of origin or manufacture from Piper.

You must condition the purchase on the issuance of a US airworthiness certificate, and that any modifications necessary to get one is at the sellers expense. Furthermore, all, that's right, ALL of the purchase price money is held in escrow until the US airworthiness certificate is signed and in hand.

It's worth paying one of this site's experts to do a pre-buy before you do anything more.

Good luck.

 

[cub12]

is the plane in our home owner maint category? if so most #'s will be x-out and import my be difficult.

 

[irishfield]

If the serial number ends in an X... then the aircraft is registered in the "Owner Maintenance" category and you are wasting your time and resources as this aircraft can not go to the USA.

You obviously have the C-F or C-G letters for it.. go here http://wwwapps2.tc.gc.ca/saf-sec-sur/2/CCARCS/index.htm and do a quick search by entering the registration number. It will tell you if it's type certificated or in owner maintenance.

..like so... Basis for Eligibility for Registration: CAR Standard 507.03(6) - Owner Maintenance Aircraft

 

[novice]

If the serial number ends in an X... then the aircraft is registered in the "Owner Maintenance" category and you are wasting your time and resources as this aircraft can not go to the USA.

You obviously have the C-F or C-G letters for it.. go here and do a quick search by entering the registration number. It will tell you if it's type certificated or in owner maintenance.

..like so... Basis for Eligibility for Registration: CAR Standard 507.03(6) - Owner Maintenance Aircraft

Thanks Irish, Is owner maintenance, you may have ended my search. They said they have an "engineer" that will sign all the books. does this matter? I'm guessing an engineer there is the same as a Mechanic here? Are "Owner maintenance" airplanes stuck that way forever? Can they be returned to a normal category? You sounded pretty definitive in the "aircraft can not go to the USA" part of your statement.

 

[mike mcs repair]

#4 The subject of my other thread was the McCauley 8443 prop (IP-235) I can't find an STC for this either. I know several guys on here said they were using it so it must be OK?

we used to get that prop field approved for installation... but can no longer(last decade or so..)... and since it's canada, i doubt it is field approved on the plane... so unless something has changed? thats prolly not good....

 

[irishfield]

The original rules to go Owner Maintenance made you stamp that X on the engine serial number as well...and the propeller if memory serves me correctly. To go back to certified... which we were told at introduction of this category would be non-cost effective and insane to even try... would be a huge task to overhaul all components back to certified and verify all structure is per type certificate. Trust me, you don't want a "pen whipped" out of Quebec.

I'll contact a friend of mine.. Inspector at Transport Canada... and see what the latest rules are in regards to returning an OM to Certified Category.

..and yes we call ours AME's.. Aircraft Maintenance Engineers.. that do our annuals and such.

 

[novice]

The original rules to go Owner Maintenance made you stamp that X on the engine serial number as well...and the propeller if memory serves me correctly. To go back to certified... which we were told at introduction of this category would be non-cost effective and insane to even try... would be a huge task to overhaul all components back to certified and verify all structure is per type certificate. Trust me, you don't want a "pen whipped" out of Quebec.

I'll contact a friend of mine.. Inspector at Transport Canada... and see what the latest rules are in regards to returning an OM to Certified Category.

..and yes we call ours AME's.. Aircraft Maintenance Engineers.. that do our annuals and such.

Thanks, Well if anyone wants a nice OM PA-14 in Ottawa, I can put you in contact with them. It has about 130 hours since complete rebuild, new edo 2000 floats, wheels, skis, 180 hp, new prop, super clean from everything I have gathered.

It is a shame they let this situation happen to American classics!

 

[cub12]

like irish said it will only be pen whipped even the data tag has been x-ed. It's not impossible but it won't be feasible. if i were in your shoes i would walk away, my opinion

 

[cub12]

Novice, It is not so bad. For alot of people capable of doing their own maint ie, oil changes,covering ect it keep flying affordable and probably keeps alot of planes out of the scrap pile. The problem is that Canada and the U.S(or transport and the FAA which ever) have for some reason not lined up their categories. If the FAA had something similar to our OM you would most likely be able to import. ie amateur built and experimental works as they are recognized by both. rec permit and lsa don't as they are not.

 

[novice]

like irish said it will only be pen whipped even the data tag has been x-ed. It's not impossible but it won't be feasible. if i were in your shoes i would walk away, my opinion

Yup, I figured that after the first post about OM, too bad! It looks like a great plane, especially if you are a float guy!