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New ski dolly alternative -need advice

B

Bill Pourcho

Registered User
Pontiac, MI
I just muscled the super cub on Aero 3000 skis into the hangar and I need some help. No traction outside in the snow (grass strip). Troy at Aero Ski Mfg-very nice guy, sent me a print to fab a ski dolly. The left and right dollies have 2 wheels each- these are wide skis. I had another idea and would like some input.

I was wondering if anyone tried placing one long axle through both the ski holes and then using balloon inflatable tires on each end. You have to inflate and deflate each use - no biggy with my portable tank. The axle could be used for a tow bar when the wheels were inflated and thus the plane's front end lifted off the ground/snow/hangar floor.

The tires would have to be balloon type that would have a big foot print and once inflated would lift the plane up off the surface.
I don't know the exact height of the ski hole- maybe 7"? Finding the right tires and wheels is key.

Yes, I know that having the plane on ABW instead of skis makes this all go away. Any good ideas???? Thanks
 
do a search for ski dollies, there are some good ones out there that are less monkey motion that reinflating tires, and letting air out...

look at Dave Calkins photos, he has some nice ones pictured there also.

The subject has been talked about. One thought- the tow bar to pull/push the plane is as important as the dollie I think.
 
I think you would find yourself hard pressed to get the alignment needed to do this and if you could it would not be a one man opperation. Just my 2 cents worth.

Si
 
I agree with W1flyer, you would never get a long shaft to line up. Then it would bend when you tow from it. I tired a couple of cobbed up home made things and never really liked them. I bought a factory set on ebay a few years ago, and just used them last week for the first time. They are great. I am sorry I waited this long to get the right tool.
 
Buying these from Sled Dog or Ebay sounds a lot better than reinventing the wheel. A telephone number or manufacturer name would be helpful.

I will try the Brainered Chamber of Commerce.
 
Ski wheels

My problem with the wheels on the outside of the ski as pictured is that mine turn out just like those. They're cocked sideways and with both tires going different directions you still can't push it. As long as the ski is free to move around on it's bushing, they won't stay lined up. Jerry B. :(
 
Year's ago I was extending a grass strip with my pan and stopped to shoot the breeze with the owners son who was working on his cub in his hanger. I noticed a snatch block anchored to the floor directly behind the tail wheel. When I asked about it he told me his wife couldn't push the cub back into the hanger by herself . So he put the snatch block in so she could use a long piece of rope and the lawnmore to pull the plane in to the hanger. Personly I think a winch would work better, to each there own. Just a though.
 
Year's ago I was extending a grass strip with my pan and stopped to shoot the breeze with the owners son who was working on his cub in his hanger. I noticed a snatch block anchored to the floor directly behind the tail wheel. When I asked about it he told me his wife couldn't push the cub back into the hanger by herself . So he put the snatch block in so she could use a long piece of rope and the lawnmore to pull the plane in to the hanger. Personly I think a winch would work better, to each there own. Just a though.
 
We put winches in the backs of our t-hangars in FAI. On straight skis, I'd just hook up the winch to the tail spring, and winch it in. To go out, hook up the pickup truck with a towing bridle, and pull it out.

The Sled Dog dollies work fine, as well. They need to be proper diameter to fit the skis, though.

Lots of little winches around, and they can be either battery powered, or 110. Whatever works.

MTV
 
If your by yourself skis are a bitch, my hangar has a dirt floor and is grass in front of the hangar, but it's a slight 1 degree downhill into the hangar so if I shovel a little and keep it smooth I can lift the tail and run it into the hangar most times, but the wind blows the snow in front of the hangar daily and even with dollies sometimes it won't roll in the slushy goop and to much grass is showing for the skis to work, if you look in trade a plane and find the Allen Tool Co add they sell a winch setup that works great, it has a 75' cord with a switch on it so you can stay with the plane and GUIDE the tail into the hanger and have a full view of what's going on so you don't hit something, I,ve had it for 15 years and only need it a few times a season but your back will love it when it's needed

Glenn
 
The Allen Tool Co. winches are the ones we used. THey worked great, and we used them a lot. They hold up well.

MTV
 
These are double wheel dollies. They may put less stress on the gear/axle than the single units. A little more cumbersome perhaps but they worked well. They were home made using the Aero Ski drawings as a starting point.

Bill

Ski_Flying_013.jpg


Ski_Flying_015.jpg
 
Bill

Excellent post.
I am wondering how the two pieces are joined. Aero blue print has a 3/8 hole which passes through both pieces of tubing and I assume a cotter pin goes through both of these tubes once aligned.

Am I missing this in your pic, or do you have another means to connect the inside wheel tube to the outside wheel tube?

Very nice tread on those tires- you should easily get another 30,000 miles of use. Which tires and wheels did you use? The ones in the drawing have been discontinued.
 
Bill

I gave the Aero Ski drawings and some notes to a friend and he built and engineered these for me. They have since been sold so I do not have access to measure for you. The wheels were from McMaster-Carr. Part # 4997T14 I think. 10.4 X 3.4 X 4 centered hub ball bearings, two piece rim with tread pattern A. They were about 28 dollars each about 4 years ago.

Here are a few more photos that may better explain the design. The bolt that holds the two halves together is hidden in the same hole/tube that supports the over center bar. Over engineered for sure but I really liked them and will build up a similar set for my cub when I get to that point.

Hope this helps. There are other threads on dollies here at SC.org and also on the skiplane site
Skiplane.org

Best of luck

Bill

Ski_Flying_0191.jpg


Ski_Flying_0201.jpg


Ski_Flying_021.jpg


Ski_Flying_022.jpg


Ski_Flying_023.jpg


Ski_Flying_024.jpg
 
A little off topic here but i just wanted to give a that boy to Aero Mfg. I have a set of 3000 skis that are 34 years old and the tunnels are starting to crack so i called the factory about replacement tunnels and for a little bit more money they would exchange my skis out for a brand new set. That is product support you dont find in aviation. Perhaps some other manufacturing companies can try to match these standards like ECI or Landis. Hats off to Aero for making fine products and excellent support for the life of there product. :D
 
Just returned from my 2nd flight on skis. Winching the plane back into the hangar is not that easy. The tailwheel (no tailwheel ski) wants to dig into the snow. Perhaps securing the tailwheel up and out of the snow would be the best-especially in wet snow. I don't have enough room to go in prop first.

I don't see why anyone would want less flotation than the 3000 I have on my Pa 18 180. I would like to be able to turn sharper- maybe a deep "v" tailski?
Until I fab or buy some dollies, 24" pieces of 1" pvc act as rollers every foot. I used 5 per side which got me into the hangar without desecrating the aluminum.
I agree- Troy at Aero Ski Mfg is the real deal. He sent parts BEFORE I paid him. I offered Visa over the phone but he works on trust-old school.
 
ski dollys

Does anyone have a set made for Landis. If you do could you post some pictures. Thanks
 
Bill Pourcho said:
Just returned from my 2nd flight on skis. Winching the plane back into the hangar is not that easy. The tailwheel (no tailwheel ski) wants to dig into the snow. Perhaps securing the tailwheel up and out of the snow would be the best-especially in wet snow. I don't have enough room to go in prop first.

I don't see why anyone would want less flotation than the 3000 I have on my Pa 18 180. I would like to be able to turn sharper- maybe a deep "v" tailski?
Until I fab or buy some dollies, 24" pieces of 1" pvc act as rollers every foot. I used 5 per side which got me into the hangar without desecrating the aluminum.
I agree- Troy at Aero Ski Mfg is the real deal. He sent parts BEFORE I paid him. I offered Visa over the phone but he works on trust-old school.
Click to expand...

Hi Bill, are you flying the tail then you turn, most times it will reduce the turn radius if the tails not getting dragged around in the snow.

Glenn
 
The double ski dollies will not fit on Cub style gear as the inside wheel will interfear with the shock strut. I have made both types and pictures posted in the photo gallery as well as a tow bar that works very well.

Litecub
 
IMG_0604.JPG


IMG_0611.JPG


Aero's drawing is inaccurate. The inboard side of the dolly must be lengthened from their blueprint dimension to provide clearance for a Cub shock strut. Also, the "over center" angle provided in the drawing is not enough.

With a few tune-ups, and disregarding their use of a bolt to pin the sections, and using the handle to pin it instead, it is a workable dolly solution. I have used them on Cubs and also loaded C-180's with wide plastic.
 
Glenn,

I was not flying the tail. I was taxiing in a narrow grass strip. I think I can turn better with with more power and tail up, as you say, but I don't want to get going too fast because my brakes are no good on skis!

I will practice in an open area.

Dave- Thanks for the pics and advice on the Aero modifications

Bill
 
Bill,

Use ONLY very short blasts of power. Push hard forward on the stick, then a very quick blast of power, then back out of it (power). Repeat. This affords maximum turn for minimum forward acceleration.

As to one vs two wheels on the dolly, just like Bushwheels, a larger dolly wheel/tire makes it easier to move the plane. I've used both Sled Dog's set up, and similar ones homemade, both with larger wheels and tires than those pictured with the "duals" and they worked fine.

Nothing is going to permit you to shove one of these airplanes through a bunch of obstacles and deep snow, though. A little bit of prep work to smooth the snow and pack it helps, and you may have to cut down ice ridges with a spud or??

Nobody said ski flying is easy :angel:

MTV
 
Bill, my strip is only 50' wide, if you can do all your turns to the left if your strip is level if not it will turn better turning up hill, just like on floats if you first do a little turn in the opposite direction [ button hook ] it will make you turn shorter, it lets the ski on the side you want to turn sink in and make more drag then the outside ski and keep the tail up, and comitt to the turn if you try to nurse it through slowly it won't work as well, my strip is narrow with a 4' drop off and the above has worked for me so far.

Glenn
 
Here are my el-cheapo dollies for by Federal 1500's The 2"x3" square tubing is 6.25" long...there is a 1" dia hole drilled and a 3/4" dia hole drilled 4" on center....then I welded in 1" round stock for the ski hole and 3/4" roundstock for the wheel barrow whee (on sale for $10 ea at Tractor Supply) Then I welded a 3/4" pipe at an angle so it cams over....som pvc slipped over so it stops and viola...el-cheapo ski dollies. Be careful...the 1" roundstock fits in one of my sets of skis...but the other one only has a 1" dia hole in the ski pedistal....measure your first.

 
I don't know how well it would work for a plane as heavy as as cub, but for my challenger I bought a set of snow machine trailer guides. The guides are mounted to a couple sheets of plywood and after kicking a little snow on them the plane slides easily in and out of the hangar. With the Challenger, I can do this with one hand, they're pretty slick against the ski bottoms.

Phil
 
I have used a dozen pieces of conduit to roll the plane around on skis. It works well to move short distances.
 
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