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Modified Left Sliding Window

AirmasterC165

MEMBER
Walpole NH
I've recently bought a 1981 Super Cub from Netherlands that has a modified sliding window. This mod was done for the front seat pilot to slide open the window for photography.

The vertical channel was removed holding the triangle window in place and a larger window was fit that slides fore and aft encompassing what was the forward sliding window. The new larger window has aluminum stiffeners attached for side load strength. The modification was approved in Netherlands with lots of paperwork.

Now that it is back in the USA and time for a FAA Airworthiness to be issued. I like the window and would like to get a field approval for the modification. I would like to work with a DAR for the Airworthiness, but maybe this mod can only be approved by the FAA.

Has anyone else made such a mod? What suggestions do you have to get this window approved? Not having worked with the FAA for a field approval before any suggestions on how to proceed? I'm in Vermont and will be working with the Portland ME FSDO.

Thanks so much....

Bill
 
Aviat changed the Husky to that configuration several years ago. I would have the IA that is signing the annual read the definition of a major mpodification and decide if it even needs a field approval.
 
I know there are one or two other threads on this site discussing that very modification. I cant seem to post links today but go to Google and search super cub sliding window or super cub photography window. Seems to me that some guys got away with just a log book entry and others had a 337 done up.
 
Bob hit the nail on the head. First, find out if the Netherlands is signatory to JAA. If so, anything approved in the Netherlands is considered "approved data" by our FAA. That doesn't necessarily mean it's automatically approved in this country, but that approved data is a sound basis for a field approval. And, it SHOULD be a no brainer, since it'll be presented to the Inspector as "approved data", so his neck isn't out there much.

It's a great mod. As Steve noted, the later Huskys have this, and Bill Rusk is incorporating that into his experimental cub. If I were building up a cub, that mod would be high on my list of must do items.

As far as I know, that vertical post, normally at the front of the stock sliding window, is not structural, so this really should be pretty simple.

Should be....

MTV
 
This is good info guys. Having the window modification paperwork from Netherlands in great detail should make approval easy. The Dutch mechanics that did the modification agree that the vertical window securing member is non-structural. I like the idea of putting the paperwork through as a minor mod. Netherlands has a BAA bilateral agreement with the FAA and that should work in my favor too.

It is a good mod and I do want to keep it.

Thanks, Bill
 
Just imported a super cub from the Netherlands last week. DAR considered work done in the Netherlands as if it were signed off here due to the reciprocity agreements in place. Only thing that had to be signed off by an FAA A&P was a hundred hour inspection. There was zero issue or paperwork required for modifications done.
 
yup, minor mod...

we used to field approve lots of stuff that didn't need it...'just in case' now the FAA frowns on that....
 
Wasn't this mod done years ago by Supercub owner/photographer/author Russell Munson?

John Scott

actually, Russ was the one who talked Aviat into developing this for the Husky, which he was replacing his Super Cub with. I never saw Russ' Cub, but once he talked Aviat into doing it on the Husky, it's become pretty much standard.

MTV
 
If you have approved data you do not need a Field Approval. If it is a major alteration, the IA can sign the 337.

it is didferent if you have acceptable data - then the FAA must stamp and sign block 3, or you need a DAR. My FAA no longer even responds to Field Approval requests. They ignore them.
 
Some pictures here of one done on a covered airplane.

2012-06-19_20_07_07.jpg


2012-06-19_20_06_45.jpg


2012-06-19_20_05_50.jpg


and more here.
http://www.airframesalaska.com/fuselage-mod-full-slider-window-p/wolf.htm
 
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Thanks for the pictures! looks much better than original window. Looks like it has to be planned during recover - am I correct in that assumption?
 
If you have approved data you do not need a Field Approval. If it is a major alteration, the IA can sign the 337.

it is didferent if you have acceptable data - then the FAA must stamp and sign block 3, or you need a DAR. My FAA no longer even responds to Field Approval requests. They ignore them.

I went through this with a set of German wheel skis. I chased that question all over, and eventually wound up speaking with the Chief of the FAA Airworthiness branch. He stated clearly that, even though JAA approval constitutes "Approved data", it would still have to be field approved. The good news is, it should be (and was in the case of the skis) easy to get field approved. But,again, this gent specifically stated that a mere mechanic could not simply sign it off.

Makes no sense to me, but it is the FAA.

MTV
 
Thanks for the pictures! looks much better than original window. Looks like it has to be planned during recover - am I correct in that assumption?

Not correct---but much nicer if done at recover. The pictures Steve posted are of a cub that was modified while covered. You can see the remnants of the forward fixed window. Minor mod logbook entry no welding. I like it a lot but it is probably not for everyone.

Mark
 
Approved data is no longer ok without a Field Approval? That would seem to mean that even an STC would have to have an FAA stamp in block 3. I would like to see that in writing.

That sort of makes the difference between approved data and acceptable data moot.
 
Approved data is no longer ok without a Field Approval? That would seem to mean that even an STC would have to have an FAA stamp in block 3. I would like to see that in writing.

That sort of makes the difference between approved data and acceptable data moot.

Bob,

i too too couldn't believe what I was being told. His point was that JAA approval still must have SOME FAA signature. I told him that was crazy, and asked what if the FSDO refused to field approve it? He answered "You're screwed". He then suggested that perhaps in that case, I could try another FSDO......very helpful.

our FSDO guy approved it with no fuss.

MTV
 
While we can (and do quite often) debate the data, FSDO's, 337"s, etc. lets get back to the original question about installing the modified slide window.

The vertical that needs to be removed is a non structural piece. The window itself is fabricated from plexiglass. Cut and grind out the vertical piece. Peel the fabric back from the lower window channel area. Either replace or extend the steel channel that contains the felt for the window slide. Repeat this as necessary for the top window slide. Install a piece of the steel channel and window slide on the windshield post to form the new forward window jamb. Now fabricate a new window with the correct size and angles to fit. Patch the fabric in this area and paint/dope.

You are not dealing with any structural items and don't fall under the 'major modification' criteria in Part 43. Just sign it off in the logbooks a a minor mod.

Web
 
I found this 2014 thread in my search for a full sliding window for a Super Cub. I saw the pictures posted by Steve Pierce. I really like this window setup and would like to incorporate it on the SC I have being "restored".

Airframes Alaska offers this mod for $291. Can anyone offer any opinions as to why NOT to go with it.

Do you know if AA is offering an STC or is one needed? I can call them on Monday.

Do you know of anyone else who offers this?

http://www.airframesalaska.com/Fuselage-Mod-Wolf-Window-Full-Slider-p/wolf.htm

Wolf Window/Full Slider

Thanks,

Gary
 
Thanks. Do you have any pictures of yours? Is it basically the same as the way Airframes Alaska does theirs? When was it done?

Gary

I looks like the pics that Pierce posted. My plane was owned by Russell Munson, a well known aviation photographer. He had Jim Richmond do it during rebuild in 92.

Russell went to a Husky and had the same mod done.

Aviatt calls it the "Russell Mod".

I can take photos if you need them.
 
I looks like the pics that Pierce posted. My plane was owned by Russell Munson, a well known aviation photographer. He had Jim Richmond do it during rebuild in 92.

Russell went to a Husky and had the same mod done.

Aviatt calls it the "Russell Mod".

I can take photos if you need them.

I appreciate the offer but don't go to the trouble. I see Steve's pics and the one on Airframes Alaska. I will call them and Cubcrafters on Monday and try to get more info.

I don't like the post so I'm inclined to go with this mod.

Thanks again,

Gary
 
Off topic but speaking of left window mods, one of the best "little extra things" I did with my rebuild (at Pierce') was to have Oregon Aero make me a 1-inch wide leather pad about 10-inches long and 1-inch thick. When velcro attached to the top of the throttle cover it makes a far superior elbow rest than the window track/felt does and it works in the winter!
 
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