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Micro VGs on a Taylorcraft

Interesting question. What would you expect them to do for the Taylorcraft's performance?

I have almost zero Taylorcraft experience - three landings in a BC12 and a couple hours in the L-2. If you would like "Cub-like" landing performance, get a Taylorcraft in the flare and then pop the spoilers. The aircraft is placarded against that, but it shortens the flare by a hundred feet.

My Decathlon has a similar wing. A high angle of attack landing approach could result in damage to the main landing gear attach points.
 
Yes. Best mod for that sharp stalling wing in my experience. The leading edge is prone to forming a lift discontinuity at higher AOA. Never leave Earth without them. Below is what happens during the NACA 23012 airfoil stall. The VG's can reduce the abrupt LE pressure peak and loss of lift at that wing location.

"Dynamic stall experiments on the NACA 23012 aerofoil. J. Leishman. Published 1990. Engineering Experiments in Fluids.

An experimental investigation was conducted to examine the dynamic stall characteristics of a NACA 23012 aerofoil section at a Reynolds number of 1.5 million. Time-dependent data were obtained from thirty miniature pressure transducers and three hot film gauges situated at the mid-span of the wing. The static stall mechanism of the NACA 23012 was determined to be via abrupt upstream movement of trailing edge separation. Under dynamic conditions, stall was found to occur via leading edge separation, followed by a strong suction wave that moved across the aerofoil. This suction wave is characteristic of a strong moving vortex disturbance. Evidence of strong secondary vortex shedding was also found to occur, and this appears symptomatic of dynamic stall only at low Mach numbers. Some evidence of flow reversals over the trailing edge of the aerofoil were indicated prior to the development of leading edge separation and dynamic stall."

Gary
 
I had no idea - I had always heard that the T-cart was fairly benign.

I forgot - I got the chance to fly Bud Judy's single seat Taylorcraft in the early 1970s before my formal aerobatics training. Same wing - got me out of almost any trouble I got in - and believe me, it wasn't pretty.

The Decathlon, with a similar wing, is likewise benign, at least for normal and inverted stalls. I no longer do snap rolls, so hesitate to comment on that.
 
I never knew that there were any cublike aircraft with spoilers until I saw a couple of Taylorcraft at Lockhaven a few years ago. I’ve always wondered why small GA airplanes didn’t have them. I’m guessing they crashed a fair amount?? Enquiring minds and all…
 
I bought my first Taylorcraft in November 1974. Flew a 7ECA Champ to King's Lake AK. and ran flight tests with owner. One second flying, next nose down 30* looking at ground. Ok, I said, this I can still make this work on floats. Sold the Champ and flew the Taylorcraft for a year wheels, skis, and floats until I bought PA-18 N7777D. Cub mild stall/wing washed out 2+*, Champ less mild stall/flat wing, Taylorcraft Snap down even with 2* washout. The current Taylorcraft came with VG's. Mild stall with good aileron control and 1* washout.

The Taylorcraft does ok with CG aft and not overloaded. VG's are worth installing and perform as promised by Micro.

Gary
 
I went right from a '46' T-Craft to a RANS S-7, while I didn't have vg's on the Tcart, I put them on the RANS, and for that wing they were more than worth doing. I'm not going to quote Reynold numbers or anything but just eyeballing my 7's wing shows it to be real similar to the T's, airfoil wise, just a bit smaller. The 7 also can bite, if pushed hard enough, when it's done flying it's DONE, ask me how I know. Vg's on a Tcart would be a no brainer for me anyways.
 
The Taylorcraft stall via wind tunnel testing. No VG's. Note the steep drop upper right in left figure of Cl vs AOA of ~18*:

Gary
 

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This is a Piper Cub Forum, so all the above is otherwise. One thing I've thought about are the comment's that say the Cub's USA-35B modified some airfoil can be bad in a stall. If so, I suspect it's the outer wing's aileron portion that is the source. Loose that amount of the wing lift via aileron deflection, and the tip will also loose lift if the air flow above separates suddenly. Think about testing aileron deflection in level flight and in a turn. See if it's as suggested - a problem.

Gary
 
My first airplane was an F-19 Taylorcraft. It was a great airplane, and had a built in instructor (it would tell you when you screwed up). It did have an abrupt stall, and in hindsight I can see where it might benefit from VGs. The lack of flaps was a limitation, but it did have quite a large wing.

It is the same airfoil as on all the early Van's aircraft (up to the 8 at least). The last two digits, 12, or 15, etc. refer to the thickness ratio. Some people have experimented with VGs on those too, but the Van's aircraft have a different mission. Still, the abrupt stall is there.
 
Over half my flight time is in different models of the Taylorcraft. I had 900 in one clipwing and now almost 200 in the last one I built. It’s true that the stall is a little more dramatic than the Cub but it’s still predictable IMO. There is a point with that 23102 airfoil where the sink rate goes way up a few mph above stall. When I learned to recognize that, I was able to fly the Tcraft a little closer to it’s limits safely. The current clipwing has an IO-320 and 11’ wings. The wing loading is pretty high. It still stalls at less than 50mph and has the same telegraphed stall HOWEVER….. over the number at 60 is about all I’m willing to do unless it is very calm.

I owned a C-85 powered BC12-D on my 700’ strip and still say that when light I could go almost anywhere a PA-18 could go.

Not long ago I got to fly that same C-85 powered BC12-D with VG’s and did think they made a big difference. Stall was a non event and aileron control seemed solid slow. It is still very much so a rudder airplane.

With all that said, a PA-18 is king of off airport ops for a reason. I’m glad I can finally afford both!
 
Hi

I have installed Micro aero VG on a Auster 5 (British built Taylorcraft, and I found it to be a very good investment. I have not flown Taylorcraft.
Auster`s have a tendency to draging their tail when flying in cruise, but after VG installation is was much better and just cruised in air...
Can do the same take off as in a Cub...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/nilsmosberg/4848587764

Have you installed trick air skis on your aircraft, could you plese send me some picture of the weld on fittings, Thanks
 
Yes I have TrickAir skis and Baumann 1500 amphib floats. I was just interested in what VGs would do for me, not that I think I need them. Most concerned if they would cost me airspeed. I like passing all the Super Cubs. I done hundreds of spins and snap rolls so the stall event does not bother me. Later this weekI can post pictures on my ski mounts on this site.

Jim
 
Hi

in the Auster I think infact that I increased the cruise speed, as the tail become higher and it “surfed”. (Not much, but at least I didn’t lost any cruise speed),
This Auster is only equipped with a 100hp engine, and the airframe is quite much heavier than the taylorcraft…
 
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