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Just bought my 1st plane, PA-18-150, and looking for recommendations on IFR avionics

I recently purchased an A-1A husky that is IFR capable. When it goes on floats the nice thing will be to climb on top if I can IFR and not get my brains beat in down low. I probably will never fly an approach to IFR minimums but the ability to get to on top legally will be an advantage.

I would install
Garmin 430W
Garmin G5
at minimum ADSB out transponder

budget $15,000.00-$18,000.00
 
All you need for this would be a turn and bank, and a nav-com radio.

Well, sorta. The reg calls for navigation equipment appropriate for the route of flight. If he bases his airplane somewhere out of range of a VOR.....not gonna work. Then, he'd need an IFR approved GPS. With at least enroute authorization.

And, while 91.205 doesn't require a transponder for IFR, try getting a clearance without one.

MTV
 
Well, sorta. The reg calls for navigation equipment appropriate for the route of flight. If he bases his airplane somewhere out of range of a VOR.....not gonna work. Then, he'd need an IFR approved GPS. With at least enroute authorization.

And, while 91.205 doesn't require a transponder for IFR, try getting a clearance without one.

MTV
Not if he's only going to climb up to VFR on top. Where is Corcoran MN? Out in the boonies or not?
 
Without looking it up - navigation equipment suitable for the flight. That could mean a compass and a watch, and there are still places where one can legally fly IFR without a clearance.
 
IFR Bob? At least add needle, ball and airspeed along with compass and clock.:smile:
 
George,

As Web pointed out in an earlier post, said equine t must be installed and certified. And, yes, you can fly IFR in uncontrolled airspace, but let us know how that works for you below 1200 feet.

MTV
 
"Wouldn’t an iPad and AOA system meet all the requirements?"

No it would not. Portable navigation devices do not meet TSO requirements.

I have flown IFR in a 185 on floats no transponder with a single nav com. Yeah it can be done, not easy but possible. I have flown 6 legs in a 737 without an autopilot and I shot an approach on 3 of those legs. Legally it can be done, not easy, but it can be done. Point is this. Every mission is different and every mission requires an evaluation of what you are going to do, what is the required equipment for the mission, is that enough equipment to safely execute the mission and finally are you proficient enough to use that level of equipment. Nor is the required equipment sometimes clear. For instance, yes you can operate IFR with an approved GPS only, and you can shoot a GPS approach at your destination. HOWEVER if your destination requires an alternate (failure to meet the 1-2-3 rule) you MAY NOT predicate your alternate minima upon the GPS approach there UNLESS your GPS is WAAS enabled and approved under TSO C145 or C146. However the alternate approach must be based upon GPS LNAV only, or Circling minimums, not VNAV or LPV . That is not in Part 91 but is in the AIM and the approval certificates for your equipment. That is one example of "navigation equipment appropriate for the route to be flown". Thus if you were fly a mission with only a GPS approach at the destination airport (or all you had was GPS), and you had an alternate required and you could only execute a GPS approach there, if you are in a non WAAS situation either by equipment, NOTAM or RAIM, you cannot complete the mission. Careful evaluation is always required of the mission well beyond the regulations in FAR 91, 135 and 121 but down to the certification basis of your equipment and aircraft.
 
George,

As Web pointed out in an earlier post, said equine t must be installed and certified. And, yes, you can fly IFR in uncontrolled airspace, but let us know how that works for you below 1200 feet.

MTV

"Wouldn’t an iPad and AOA system meet all the requirements?"

No it would not. Portable navigation devices do not meet TSO requirements.

I have flown IFR in a 185 on floats no transponder with a single nav com. Yeah it can be done, not easy but possible. I have flown 6 legs in a 737 without an autopilot and I shot an approach on 3 of those legs. Legally it can be done, not easy, but it can be done. Point is this. Every mission is different and every mission requires an evaluation of what you are going to do, what is the required equipment for the mission, is that enough equipment to safely execute the mission and finally are you proficient enough to use that level of equipment. Nor is the required equipment sometimes clear. For instance, yes you can operate IFR with an approved GPS only, and you can shoot a GPS approach at your destination. HOWEVER if your destination requires an alternate (failure to meet the 1-2-3 rule) you MAY NOT predicate your alternate minima upon the GPS approach there UNLESS your GPS is WAAS enabled and approved under TSO C145 or C146. However the alternate approach must be based upon GPS LNAV only, or Circling minimums, not VNAV or LPV . That is not in Part 91 but is in the AIM and the approval certificates for your equipment. That is one example of "navigation equipment appropriate for the route to be flown". Thus if you were fly a mission with only a GPS approach at the destination airport (or all you had was GPS), and you had an alternate required and you could only execute a GPS approach there, if you are in a non WAAS situation either by equipment, NOTAM or RAIM, you cannot complete the mission. Careful evaluation is always required of the mission well beyond the regulations in FAR 91, 135 and 121 but down to the certification basis of your equipment and aircraft.

Darn, I guess I forgot the smiley in my post.
 
And, yes, you can fly IFR in uncontrolled airspace, but let us know how that works for you below 1200 feet.

MTV
I could give you an example of this being done safely and legally but that might give some marginally qualified pilots the wrong idea which could get them in trouble. It does require that the pilot be intimately familiar with the "neighborhood".
 
Did Piper ever get the PA18 certified for IFR?


Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org

Here is one Piper did.
98940055_Large_.jpg
 

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Besides the Husky I also fly a Bonanza, my point about IFR on top is usually you will find smooth air and that 18 out of 20 flights end with a VFR approach.

yes I fly in the MSP class B airspace that will require ADSB out. The Husky will be used for going to the cabin in Ely MN or fishing in Canada. Right now I could fly the ILS or VOR approach into KANE then transition to surfside seaplane base. I would only do it if the airport was VFR. The husky will be on straight floats
 
7BF1AE93-4B1C-4A36-BACE-E41C8695BD25.jpgFirst point — given the current AOA thread, I am surprised you guys took my bait so easily.

Second point — I think instrument skills are enormously important. Tail dragger experience has made me a better helicopter and jet pilot, but instrument skills have made me a better off airport pilot. Instrument skills have also increased both my level of safety and ability to get flights done in the off airport/bush environment.

No experienced instrument pilot thinks a light wing loaded Cub or Husky is a great instrument platform, but I am sure many more pilots have met their maker trying to stay visual under clouds, as opposed to pilots that have crashed flying instruments in light planes. Some of my most terrifying flights have been in the back seat of a Beaver or Otter, with some VFR air taxi or lodge pilot trying to continue underneath when up was a far safer out.

I don’t think it pencils trying to make a classic Cub instrument legal, although every Cub or Husky I fly has one or two attitude indicators to give me options. I also don’t think some clapped out Cherokee with circa 1980 avionics makes sense as an instrument trainer. Better to learn in a G1000 rental plane, with a PFD/MFD, IFR WAAS GPS, ground prox, and an AP/FD. I took this picture this morning heading out to play in the desert, and while not instrument legal or sensible, it has close to the avionics capability of current jets.
 

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George,

One “wild card” which often limits the ability to “go up” is a phenomenon called ice. And it can happen at most times of the year in the north.

MTV
 
GeeBee - only six? I got so good at hand- flying the no autopilot 737 at 35,000 feet I could dazzle the new copilots! Once landed a 737-200 on battery only - legally dispatched, but the APU died. No generators! VFR, of course.

Again, I think we decided that the certification basis of the Super Cub allows instrument flight. Later lightplanes, like the Decathlon, cannot be made IFR legal without considerable expense and testing, but in Cubs and Stinsons, you just put the radios and gyros in.

As for IFR with just one nav radio - my first flight in a Cessna 180 was single pilot IFR out of Vero Beach with a single Superhomer. Good thing I had lots of Cub time.

And out west you can still find uncontrolled airspace that goes up to 10,000 feet. No clearance required.
 
George,

One “wild card” which often limits the ability to “go up” is a phenomenon called ice. And it can happen at most times of the year in the north.

MTV

From May thru the beginning of October, I fly countless trips between Homer and our remote cabin on Lake Clark. I get more ice in “the summer” over the west side of Cook Inlet at 10,000-12,00 feet, with an east wind, and over the Chigmit Mountans between Chitina Bay and Lake Iliamna and Clark, than anywhere else I fly in the US. Enough ice that it is more than a TKS Caravan can handle some days, and I have near run out a 21 gallon TKS tank on a 100 mile flight there. There are also many days when there is no ice. With experience, it is pretty easy to figure out whether there will be ice or not, and when you are wrong, a 180 degree turn, climb or descent to exit icing conditions is in order. I can’t remember a single day that I would rather be over fifty miles of Cook Inlet at 1,000 feet under a broken to overcast layer, rather than at 12,000 feet with glide to shore. That goes for a Carbon Cub, Husky, 185, Caravan or a Bell helicopter.

If handling the worst conditions possible is our criteria, pretty soon we will only be in a hot wing jet, flying runway to runway, on days without runway contamination, or just staying on the ground. Back to the original post, it is best practice, even in backcountry flying, to have current instrument skills and enough equipment in whatever you are flying to open up more of the sky for routine or emergency operations. Hopefully this new Cub owner will acquire those skills.
 
So after summer 18' on the East coast and spending three different days scud running at 1000' to try to get somewhere, I too have thought about how nice it would be to be able to file and climb on top when the ceiling is 1000' over. I have a standard VFR panel with a small compass centered in the panel and a vacuum turn and bank below. I plan to remove the turn and bank, move the compass to a remote location, maybe on top of the glare shield and put in an Aspen Evolution Pro in the center two holes. Then change out my old GPS for a used Garmin 430. I am pretty sure I am then legal for IFR. I would limit my IFR to daytime 1000' ceilings and have the IPAD with the Stratus AHRS and Foreflight
as the emergency backup. Not that I really want to fly the SC IFR it provides some options to get out or in when everyone else is sitting around. Would have surely helped me out this past summer.
 
Hi,

I just closed on my first plane yesterday, a 1983 PA-18-150. It has a nice VFR panel, but needs an upgraded radio and a transponder with ADSB-out. So, I'm considering putting in the right avionics for addressing those issues, but also making it IFR compliant. Any reasonably affordable recommendations would be appreciated. For the IFR, I was thinking about getting a used GNS 430, but am open to other ideas/newer lower-cost GPS avionics. Also any recommendations on radio and ADSB would be good too. I want to take advantage of ADSB-in, so one idea was getting a Stratus 2 or 3 to go with a Transponder with ADS-B out.



Ok, so now that you know where the dog pooped on the lawn, wipe your toes off in the grass and tell us about the cool Cub you just bought. We also like pictures. Great group on here but it's like growing up with bigger brothers, some days your going to get some noogies. Where is home so some of the locals can help you discover flying like no other flying carpet can?

Glenn
 
So after summer 18' on the East coast and spending three different days scud running at 1000' to try to get somewhere, I too have thought about how nice it would be to be able to file and climb on top when the ceiling is 1000' over. I have a standard VFR panel with a small compass centered in the panel and a vacuum turn and bank below. I plan to remove the turn and bank, move the compass to a remote location, maybe on top of the glare shield and put in an Aspen Evolution Pro in the center two holes. Then change out my old GPS for a used Garmin 430. I am pretty sure I am then legal for IFR. I would limit my IFR to daytime 1000' ceilings and have the IPAD with the Stratus AHRS and Foreflight
as the emergency backup. Not that I really want to fly the SC IFR it provides some options to get out or in when everyone else is sitting around. Would have surely helped me out this past summer.

1000' in the North East is considered a CAVU day ;-)

Glenn
 
So after summer 18' on the East coast and spending three different days scud running at 1000' to try to get somewhere, I too have thought about how nice it would be to be able to file and climb on top when the ceiling is 1000' over. I have a standard VFR panel with a small compass centered in the panel and a vacuum turn and bank below. I plan to remove the turn and bank, move the compass to a remote location, maybe on top of the glare shield and put in an Aspen Evolution Pro in the center two holes. Then change out my old GPS for a used Garmin 430. I am pretty sure I am then legal for IFR. I would limit my IFR to daytime 1000' ceilings and have the IPAD with the Stratus AHRS and Foreflight
as the emergency backup. Not that I really want to fly the SC IFR it provides some options to get out or in when everyone else is sitting around. Would have surely helped me out this past summer.

Read up on the installation instructions for that Aspen. Most IFR installations require a vacuum gyro as backup to keep the STC legal.

Web
 
Got this a couple days ago from the FAA. Not sure if it is the same model Aspen Evolution.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using SuperCub.Org mobile app
 

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I have been in situations where I have filed enroute and climbed above clouds or descended to get below. Very handy in a cub, especially if you can jump into the wailing tailwind 4K feet above you.

Original poster-

I would add a Garmin 650 & an aspen or two G5's.

The beauty of a 650 is that you can remote mount your transponder, so it is not taking space in the panel.

Tim
 
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