Helio Courier
- Thread starter Sikorsky
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skywagon8a
MEMBER
SE Mass MA6
What an ambitious project! I knew and worked with several of the original Helio workers in their original hangars at Canton Mass.
68Papa
Registered User
Chugiak, Alaska
This is so impressive and inspiring!! It's amazing to see a couple of young, ambitious men with a dream. I'm guessing there were so many "nay-sayers" along the way and only a very small handful that told them they could do this. It's one thing to want to do something like this, but to actually make it happen would seem impossible to most people. The complexity of reproducing these parts, the money it costs for materials, jigs, tooling, hanger space, heat, electricity, not to mention while at the same time, feeding your family, paying for a place to live - the list goes on, and on and on... I have so many questions and so much respect for these young men.
I was around Abe a little bit when he worked for Airframes and then a bit when he helped announce Valdez. You could see a hint of it in the video. The guy has a sharp sense of humor. He funnier than s&@t and appears to have been working out. He’s half the size he was.
Paul Heinrich
SPONSOR
Illinois & Wisconsin
About 15-20 years ago I received a letter from the Helio people inquiring about my interest in their line of airplanes. I'm guessing lots of other Beaver/STOL type operators received a similar letter and that our response was insufficient for them to bring any of their products back into production. I don't imagine much has changed since then, especially given niche market uncertainties - Cost of Acquisition/Ownership, AvGas, Liability, Economic, Political, etc.
bda
SPONSOR
Kenai AK
I would be interested in an Experimental version - If the price was right.
The motor choice was interesting.
I was thinking at one time of putting a Chevy LS-1 or LS-3 in a Helio, should be about the same weight as the 480, and plenty of power, but the gearbox is questionable.
The motor choice was interesting.
I was thinking at one time of putting a Chevy LS-1 or LS-3 in a Helio, should be about the same weight as the 480, and plenty of power, but the gearbox is questionable.
Paul Heinrich
SPONSOR
Illinois & Wisconsin
Hope this link to YouTube works. It is the original factory TV Advertisement done by the company.
There are lots of comments pro and con about the various makes and models. 160 mph is a big plus, talent is required to maximize potential. Later models had weight problems and there are reliability issue(s) with the thirsty geared reduction engine, etc.; lovely aircraft though. Resale values hurt, too. Get redbull pilot ms to land one inside an Olympic sized swimming pool and it will challenge a TopCub or Bushhawk, or standard helicopter and win.
There are lots of comments pro and con about the various makes and models. 160 mph is a big plus, talent is required to maximize potential. Later models had weight problems and there are reliability issue(s) with the thirsty geared reduction engine, etc.; lovely aircraft though. Resale values hurt, too. Get redbull pilot ms to land one inside an Olympic sized swimming pool and it will challenge a TopCub or Bushhawk, or standard helicopter and win.
Paul Heinrich
SPONSOR
Illinois & Wisconsin
Designed for the tropics; not North America, yes?
It seems to me that they are strictly warm and fair weather birds given the complex slats, spoilers, and flaps incorporated into Helio wings, or am I wrong again?
It seems to me that they are strictly warm and fair weather birds given the complex slats, spoilers, and flaps incorporated into Helio wings, or am I wrong again?
Designed with cooperation by MIT to serve rooftop and other short landing areas is the legend I’ve always heard. Impressive performers but not very popular in Alaska. An enigma.
hotrod180
FRIEND
Port Townsend, WA
There was a brief re-start or new start of Helio production back in the 1980's.
I have an old magazine with an article about it but it's at the hangar so I can't quote it.
They decided to use non-geared Lycoming engines, IO-540 & IO-720 as I recall.
This history page from the Helio Alaska website mentions that down toward the bottom.
I don't think they had a specific area of the world in mind when the designed the aircraft. They happen to fit the CIA/MAF missions well. The designers just wanted a great STOL aircraft started with a PA 17 and MIT backing went for it.
DENNY
mvivion
FOUNDER
Bozeman,MT
Tell that to Wright Air Service in FAI….
Southern Aero
SPONSOR
kcco/1ga2
Slats and spoilers actually pretty simple, not complex
aktango58
FRIEND
9aa9
Great question... but who would have thought a $600,000 cub would have over a years waiting list to get from the factory?
I don't have the cash to spend even what a good cub costs today, but I know people that do. Maybe they can work with some insurance companies to develop a 'factory' training program to reduce the insurance challenge- much like Lake's old program.
The Helio is a fantastic plane in the right hands. Nothing else will actually do what they do with that load, other than ones with the prop on the top.
mvivion
FOUNDER
Bozeman,MT
They own the type certificate, wouldn’t be any point in owning that unless they want to certify it. With that, all they need is to demonstrate conformity and get a production cert. Both of which are huge tasks, but look what they’ve done so far.
Oh, and have you noted the price of new carbon cubs?
Supporting the current fleet would be a reason. In any case, I’ve got no reason to argue against any more than any of you have reason to argue for this enterprise. I’m a businessman. I see P&Ls and balance sheets, not the romance of my imagination. I think it’ll be interesting to observe. Bottom line? I’m a slat wing owner and I have no interest in Helios, and that after coming very close to buying one.
Are these guys taking deposits yet? Line up!
hotrod180
FRIEND
Port Townsend, WA
Here's a link to the 1984 Flying magazine issue, you have to scroll down quite a ways to the Helip article.
Flying Magazine
books.google.tt
Back then, the re-start outfit used 350hp TSIO-540's & 400hp IO-720's.
john schwamm
SPONSOR
Anchorage, Alaska Carefree, AZ
I have owned a few Helio Couriers over the years, best ones are with the GO-480 295HP and 96" prop, lots of thrust to yank it off short. The straight drive 0-540 250HP versions were lighter, but lacked the thrust of the GO-480 motors.
I bought hull #1 H 800 when they restarted production, had the Lyc 720, 400HP, was on amphibs as they had not certified the new composite spring gear yet. Without the geared motor thrust, just not a performer in comparison. And spring type gear was not good compared to the oleo strut originals, plop it down and no bounce, could land brakes locked if needed, no nose over with the gear forward and heavy tail.
Helio is great float plane when dealing in rough water, maybe bang one wave and airborne, vs 185 banging through several waves before lift off, same on landing, plop down short on floats too.
Flew one H-295 from Anchorage to Acapulco and back one year, landed on beaches, parking lots and short stuff all thru Mexico. Nothing performs like the Helio if one wants to carry a load and have room for more than 2 people. Slightly slower in cruise than 185, but about 12-13 gallons per hour fuel burn. With the long range tanks, 120 gallon it gives one longer range than needed for most.
Had 3 Widgeons over the years too, they had the GO-480 motors, same type thrust, yanked them out of the water quick.
I bought hull #1 H 800 when they restarted production, had the Lyc 720, 400HP, was on amphibs as they had not certified the new composite spring gear yet. Without the geared motor thrust, just not a performer in comparison. And spring type gear was not good compared to the oleo strut originals, plop it down and no bounce, could land brakes locked if needed, no nose over with the gear forward and heavy tail.
Helio is great float plane when dealing in rough water, maybe bang one wave and airborne, vs 185 banging through several waves before lift off, same on landing, plop down short on floats too.
Flew one H-295 from Anchorage to Acapulco and back one year, landed on beaches, parking lots and short stuff all thru Mexico. Nothing performs like the Helio if one wants to carry a load and have room for more than 2 people. Slightly slower in cruise than 185, but about 12-13 gallons per hour fuel burn. With the long range tanks, 120 gallon it gives one longer range than needed for most.
Had 3 Widgeons over the years too, they had the GO-480 motors, same type thrust, yanked them out of the water quick.
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TR Dunn
FRIEND
The economics of operating large piston engines with superchargers and/or gearboxes for working aircraft is well documented in the Ag industry. With the cost, lack of new parts and frequency of overhauls (downtime), the solution for most operators is simple and proven, the turbine.
I operate two 985’s and one 1340. Feeding and maintaining these antiques is not for the faint of heart and requires not only a special skill set but a sentimental devotion to what I deem near living pieces of machinery. These engines make you earn the right to run them and you have to want it. I believe the GO-480 is in this same category.
TR
I operate two 985’s and one 1340. Feeding and maintaining these antiques is not for the faint of heart and requires not only a special skill set but a sentimental devotion to what I deem near living pieces of machinery. These engines make you earn the right to run them and you have to want it. I believe the GO-480 is in this same category.
TR
I overhauled 2 GO435s that now have 1200 hrs on them in a Widgeon. The owner wanted me to do it again but now parts are hard to find. He found the only shop to do it and they have enough parts for 2 motors as long as we can supply some spare parts from our surplus cores. 480s are getting to be the same. If you can find parts and anyone to overhaul them you had better bring a lot of money.
Jim
Jim
s09.mmcdonald
FRIEND
Any updates? Did they end up displaying one at this year's airmen convention?
TurboBeaver
Registered User
Northern Maine
Big presence among Alaskan guides and lodges in 1960s/70s/80's.
Ray Loche; Rainbow King/ Bob Curtis; Tickchik Narrows / Dennis Branham; Finger Lk/ Rainy Pass brother Bud. Kirk Gay; Sea Airmotive, Valhalla. Just to name a few ..... I think these boys have a great idea with their high torque low rpm idea! Will still need to couple it with a BIG prop to get outrageous STOL performance they are after. Wishing them the best of luck. ( Won't be surprises if someone like Paul Clause; buys ser# 1......
Ray Loche; Rainbow King/ Bob Curtis; Tickchik Narrows / Dennis Branham; Finger Lk/ Rainy Pass brother Bud. Kirk Gay; Sea Airmotive, Valhalla. Just to name a few ..... I think these boys have a great idea with their high torque low rpm idea! Will still need to couple it with a BIG prop to get outrageous STOL performance they are after. Wishing them the best of luck. ( Won't be surprises if someone like Paul Clause; buys ser# 1......
