Cub "Clone" Kits

[Dave Prizio]

I am working on a magazine article comparing various Cub clone kit planes. I am especially interested in getting in touch with builders and/or owners of the Savage (Zlin) Classic and the RANS S-7 Courier.

I have more extensive information about the Texas Sport (Legend) Cub, the Wag Aero Sport Trainer, and the CubCrafters S2, but I am also interested in hearing from builders of those kits.

I am especially interested in hearing about your interactions with the factory, the quality of the plans or assembly manual, and the cost of the finished airplane if you have made it that far.

Since there has been plenty of discussion about what deserves to be considered to be a Cub clone, I would prefer to dispense with beating that horse again. My criteria for inclusion in my comparison are: 2-place tandem seating, qualifies for light sport either as E-LSA or experimental amateur built but complying with LSA weight and flight requirements, and Cub-like in general appearance. Thus, my list: Texas Sport (Legend), Cubcrafters S2, Rans S-7 Courier, Savage Classic, Wag Aero Sport Trainer.

Thanks for any help you may be able to provide. You can contact me directly at dave@prizio.com, or post here, as you wish.

Dave Prizio
Texas Sport Cub N114DE

 

[cub12]

i also built one called a super pup made by preceptor aircraft, it was a great flying and very fun plane, and would love to have another.

 

[Taildown]

Someone pointed Dave my way and he flew down for a look at my S7 project. He came down in his new experimental Texas Sport Cub that he finished only a short time ago. Seeing Dave's workmanship on the Sport Cub made me feel a little self-conscious about having him look over my work, but he was gracious and didn't make fun of anything (yet) and was careful of what he took photos of.

If anyone else is interested or curious about the RANS S7, I have my S7 project posted on the kitlog website, and have included a lot of photos of the various assemblies.

www.mykitlog.com/taildown/

I am closing in on getting the plane finished, and would like to think I will have it flying before the end of summer.

Mark

 

[gander]

Nice job taildown, I always liked those little planes. CUb clone kits that would be " idea robbing "

 

[jaypratt]

North Star

I have a Super Cub Kit made buy www.Customflightltd.com
Been flying it 5 years, 500 hours, good kit. Excellent plans. Good factory support.
Mine has a lycoming 180 hp engine. Read what is on their web sight. Its no bull. Explains what how about the North Star.

 

[lancef53]

Give us a heads up when the article is published, it should be a neat read.

Also, maybe some info on which of the kits has the most legroom, for those of us that are taller than the average 1946 person.

 

[crazyivan]

I have a question for those who have built some of these "cub-clones" such as Cub Crafters, TCOW, and the North Star. Are the price of the kits really worth it?

Take the North Star; almost $50 for the kit alone. The base TCOW SUper Cub is $40k. And over $60k for the Cub Crafters. When I look at the Rans S7 or Kitfox Super Sport, I say to myself "why would I spend $100k for a finished kit-built when the S7 or Kitfox are 1/2 the price with the same performance?"

What am I not seeing?

 

[pittsdriver]

I have a question for those who have built some of these "cub-clones" such as Cub Crafters, TCOW, and the North Star. Are the price of the kits really worth it?

Take the North Star; almost $50 for the kit alone. The base TCOW SUper Cub is $40k. And over $60k for the Cub Crafters. When I look at the Rans S7 or Kitfox Super Sport, I say to myself "why would I spend $100k for a finished kit-built when the S7 or Kitfox are 1/2 the price with the same performance?"

What am I not seeing?

The TCOW Cub has all of the Alaskan mods and up to 2300lbs gross weight. You can finish a pretty deluxe one for around $85000. I have seen well built TCOW/Smith Cubs sell for $150-185000. A Rans S7 or Kitfox will cost around $65000 to do a nice one and won't have near the performance or usefull load of a Cub. On resale you would be very lucky to get the cost of the kit and parts and they take about the same amount of work. Don

 

[behindpropellers]

I have a question for those who have built some of these "cub-clones" such as Cub Crafters, TCOW, and the North Star. Are the price of the kits really worth it?

Take the North Star; almost $50 for the kit alone. The base TCOW SUper Cub is $40k. And over $60k for the Cub Crafters. When I look at the Rans S7 or Kitfox Super Sport, I say to myself "why would I spend $100k for a finished kit-built when the S7 or Kitfox are 1/2 the price with the same performance?"

What am I not seeing?

Or you can just buy a very nice supercub for 65K-90K and it will hold its value. Spend your extra time and money getting an A&P license.

Tim

 

[jaypratt]

not even close

No comparison

A Kit Fox or Rans 7, or Highlander is not even close to a Super Cub or North Star or TCOW Cub.

They are smaller lighter, have little engines, they won't do what a cub will do.

 

[Bill Rusk]

Crazyivan

The single biggest difference between the Supercub kits and all the other cub clones is useful load and capacity. If you really want to go camping and fishing (or hunting) you will need the capacity. It is very easy to rack up 100 pounds of gear and supplies for remote camping. Where could you possibly put 2 sleeping bags, tent, food, water, clothes etc in the Cub clones. They simply have no capacity.

Don't get me wrong, I love the J-3, and some of its derivatives are wonderful airplanes, but the best way to describe it is.......

Its a great point A to point A airplane.

Bill

 

[Dave Prizio]

Cub Clone Kits

This is a very fair criticism. The typical Cub clone kitplane (light sport compliant) will have an empty weight of around 850 pounds -- a few less, some more. By the time you subtract out 20 gallons of gas you have about 350 pounds left for everything else. This leaves you with a plane that can carry two people, if they aren't too big, or one person and a bunch of gear.

This problem pretty much goes away if you can escape the clutches of light sport, but if you can't the utility of your plane will definitely be limited.

 

[crazyivan]

Dave - I hope I didn't hijack your post. Hopefully it's some good discussion you can use in your research.

As far as the Kitfox Super Sport, It'll weigh around 800 lbs empty. If you aren't looking for LSA then the max gross is 1550lbs, or a 750lb useful load and a 150 lb baggage compartment capacity. So with full fuel, full baggage, and two 200 lb people you still have 30 lbs left over. Short takeoff, short landing, 120mph cruise. I'd argue that the Kitfox SS outperforms the super cub in overall performance.

You guys are right, a Kitfox won't bring the resale value near what a SC brings. Go ahead and blast me here, but the Super Cub has is a niche market because of its enduring reputation and therefore it (and its clones) brings in the big bucks. I tread lightly on this forum when I opine that Super Cubs are....eeeek....overpriced. Here's where I duck and weave while I run away from the murderous Super Cub mobs.

 

[Steve Pierce]

You just need to fly one Dave, then you will be sold as well. :lol:

 

[courierguy]

Dave,
I am flying my second S-7, (216 hrs TT) my first was a '94 short tail, (1300 hrsTT) and my second the long tailed S7-S. EVERYTHING was in the crate, not one item backordered or missing, only other kitplane builders can appreciate the rarity of that! The company is great to deal with, no BS. I enjoy 100 mph cruise at 4 gph, and slow flight at 60 mph at less then 2 gph. I have a total of $42,000 in it, and less then 1000 hrs building time. The baggage area is very similar to a SC or a Husky volume wise. The S-7 has been in kit form since '87, none of the others mentioned have been. Many different Cub drivers have gone up in mine, and all have felt right at home right off the bat. Short field performance is superior to a Cub (shields up), at 715 lbs with a geared 70"prop thats no suprise, I see the advantage going to the Cub at high gross weights, no question there. Visibility is especially nice, even at high angles of attack. Mine is operated out of a 400' long strip at over 5,000 ASL, VG equipped I typically use less then 200' to land (I do have a 12 % grade to help out). Hey, we'd all like a SC with all the mods, but for 42 K this is a lot of bang for the buck. Tom Simko


I am especially interested in hearing about your interactions with the factory, the quality of the plans or assembly manual, and the cost of the finished airplane if you have made it that far.

Since there has been plenty of discussion about what deserves to be considered to be a Cub clone, I would prefer to dispense with beating that horse again. My criteria for inclusion in my comparison are: 2-place tandem seating, qualifies for light sport either as E-LSA or experimental amateur built but complying with LSA weight and flight requirements, and Cub-like in general appearance. Thus, my list: Texas Sport (Legend), Cubcrafters S2, Rans S-7 Courier, Savage Classic, Wag Aero Sport Trainer.

Thanks for any help you may be able to provide. You can contact me directly at dave@prizio.com, or post here, as you wish.

Dave Prizio
Texas Sport Cub N114DE[/quote]

 

[Crash]

If one were to rank the kits by pure performance the S2 Carbon Cub would have to be #1

Crash