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Where to start removing weight

Last night I remembered a conversation I had years back as we were fighting the compass in a cub, no matter what it would read north due to the location and metal around it. The mechanic I was good friends with came into the conversation and started laughing, and reminded us that the compass was archaic and would always be a problem. "Put a hand held GPS in and don't worry about it!"

It made sense. We quit worrying about demagnetizing the plane, and all the other stuff. The GPS paid for itself in fuel over the next year, and was handy.

Today we pilots have a plethora of easy options for "Getting out of Jail" in bad weather. iPad Pro: $950, Strtux antenna: $250, FlyQ Electronic Flight Bag Subscription with IFR charts: $159/year (The sometimes do lifetime subscription deals also); For less than $1,500 you have more information at your fingertips than airliners had ten years ago, including ADSB and synthetic vision.

That is a whole lot less weight also than a full panel, GPS radios, antennas and coax. Best part is with a little velcro a guy can stick the iPad when desired to the panel and remove when not needed to help seeing out, and it is not installed equipment so the FAA does not care.

My iPad has actually lasted longer than my last vacuum pump.
 
I'm moving over from a 90hp Cessna 120, which is the nicest flying plane I've ever been in. Much more lively than the super cub on the ground, but the light control forces are so nice, a friend says they're lighter than an R22. I'm in SLC so I've quickly found the limit of how fast the 120 will get off the ground at places like Cedar Mountain, which is at 7000 ft. I'd like to get into all the Utah desert strips, and with Idaho so close, am planning to spend a week or two up there this summer bouncing around and seeing as many interesting strips as I can. The 120 would do lots of them, just wouldn't have the margin I like to do the more interesting ones. Part of the weight savings is some desire to stay legal on w&b, and I am considering the 2000lb gross kit. I like the AV-30 idea quite a bit and it would make the panel look a little less empty after the air powered stuff is gone.

Denny, what's the cold weather issue with the Sutton exhaust? I do lots of flying in the winter here, it's not crazy cold but I'm often flying in the teens. Hot rod looks like a good option.
 
alexstoll said:
I'm moving over from a 90hp Cessna 120, which is the nicest flying plane I've ever been in. Much more lively than the super cub on the ground, but the light control forces are so nice, a friend says they're lighter than an R22. I'm in SLC so I've quickly found the limit of how fast the 120 will get off the ground at places like Cedar Mountain, which is at 7000 ft. I'd like to get into all the Utah desert strips, and with Idaho so close, am planning to spend a week or two up there this summer bouncing around and seeing as many interesting strips as I can. The 120 would do lots of them, just wouldn't have the margin I like to do the more interesting ones. Part of the weight savings is some desire to stay legal on w&b, and I am considering the 2000lb gross kit. I like the AV-30 idea quite a bit and it would make the panel look a little less empty after the air powered stuff is gone.

Denny, what's the cold weather issue with the Sutton exhaust? I do lots of flying in the winter here, it's not crazy cold but I'm often flying in the teens. Hot rod looks like a good option.
Click to expand...


Alex, are you new to SLC and from WA? Reason I ask is we might have met at UT9 the day I solo’ed
 
A Sutton will work but A Hot Rod exhaust will keep you warm even well below O degrees. I have a dedicated defrost, normal cabin heat is ducted to back seat and that scat tube temp is over 200 degrees. Also have great carb heat. Coming from a low HP aircraft you are going to really like the 150hp cub. Prop will make a big difference so test fly a few if possible. A good test to see if spending a lot on lightweight mods is simple. Fill both tanks, fly for 1 hour (that should be about the 50 lb weight loss you want) now ask yourself if you notice any big change, do a landing, and takeoff. On a cub the three things than really make a difference are Borer prop, Bushwheels, and AOSS.
DENNY
 
Tennessee said:
I also want the weight and balance shifted more toward the front because that means less chance of a ground loop, so one of these days when i can get good advice on how to do it I want to get an under the seat battery.
Click to expand...
Don't be too quick to move the battery forward. The only advantage is to save 2 or 3 pounds of cable at the most. 150 Cubs are nose heavy in the first place. Set up a weight and balance program on your computer. Move a few weights around to different locations. Watch how the CG shifts. Too far forward coupled with an expedited braking action could mean a new prop and perhaps an engine. Piper put the battery back there for a reason.
 
The other thing to consider, with the EarthX, do you really want to be sitting on top of a Lithium battery? While the technology has improved, my EarthX EXT900 TSO will be forward of my firewall on my PA-16. Just not 100% convinced that there isn’t a fire hazard yet. Don’t want that possibility in the passenger compartment.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
skywagon8a said:
Don't be too quick to move the battery forward. The only advantage is to save 2 or 3 pounds of cable at the most. 150 Cubs are nose heavy in the first place. Set up a weight and balance program on your computer. Move a few weights around to different locations. Watch how the CG shifts. Too far forward coupled with an expedited braking action could mean a new prop and perhaps an engine. Piper put the battery back there for a reason.
Click to expand...

That is assuming, of course, that you replace the "standard" battery with an Odyssey or other light weight battery.

And, I agree that I wouldn't want a lithium battery under my seat, just yet..... But, the Odyssey works fine there or in original position.

MTV
 
I see, Denny. I assumed it had something to do with engine running to cold or shock cooling. The 120 has amazingly good heat, so I'd like to keep that going if possible.
 
Alright, what's AOSS

DENNY said:
A Sutton will work but A Hot Rod exhaust will keep you warm even well below O degrees. I have a dedicated defrost, normal cabin heat is ducted to back seat and that scat tube temp is over 200 degrees. Also have great carb heat. Coming from a low HP aircraft you are going to really like the 150hp cub. Prop will make a big difference so test fly a few if possible. A good test to see if spending a lot on lightweight mods is simple. Fill both tanks, fly for 1 hour (that should be about the 50 lb weight loss you want) now ask yourself if you notice any big change, do a landing, and takeoff. On a cub the three things than really make a difference are Borer prop, Bushwheels, and AOSS.
DENNY
Click to expand...
 
DENNY said:
A Sutton will work but A Hot Rod exhaust will keep you warm even well below O degrees. I have a dedicated defrost, normal cabin heat is ducted to back seat and that scat tube temp is over 200 degrees. Also have great carb heat.

DENNY
Click to expand...

Have you flown behind a Sutton exhaust much? They kick out a pretty good amount of heat. The cub that I share with my brother has a Sutton and it'll keep you toasty even in the coldest weather. Equally as good as a hot rod exhaust IMO.
 
alexstoll said:
Yup that's me! Good to hear from you. How has your flying been???
Click to expand...

It’s been great, I got my license soon after the day we met. I am waiting on a maintenance item to transition from the S-20 to the S-21. Should be up and flying late this week.

Glad you are enjoying Utah
 
Crash said:
Have you flown behind a Sutton exhaust much? They kick out a pretty good amount of heat. The cub that I share with my brother has a Sutton and it'll keep you toasty even in the coldest weather. Equally as good as a hot rod exhaust IMO.
Click to expand...

I agree that a Sutton puts off a good amount heat. It’s enough to keep a coffee thermos hot or cook a chosen foot. What you don’t get from the Sutton but do from the dodge or LEE is the radiant heat coming off the firewall. The difference in the middle of the summer is substantial. The combination of a Sutton and disconnected heater box makes it tolerable.
 
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Also just want to comment on how fantastic this forum is. I came in with a question that I'm sure has been asked 6 ways already but not quite in the way I wanted, and people were all just happy to fill me in with their experience. Thanks folks
 
alexstoll said:
Thanks Jay! I'd love to trade rides down at west desert that S-21 looks like a great plane
Click to expand...


I have a 5 hour dual instruction (all one day in the backcountry) required for insurance and then it will be based in Heber. Come on over.
 
dgapilot said:
The other thing to consider, with the EarthX, do you really want to be sitting on top of a Lithium battery? While the technology has improved, my EarthX EXT900 TSO will be forward of my firewall on my PA-16. Just not 100% convinced that there isn’t a fire hazard yet. Don’t want that possibility in the passenger compartment.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

If that battery catches on fire it doesn't matter where its located, you have a serious problem. More than likely it will be fatal if you are in flight.
 
RaisedByWolves said:
Must be. George can you send me some of that money? I find it by working until 2 or 3 am.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

If you would start before 10 pm we might feel bad for you, but we know that as a married man you must take care of the cats, dogs and goats before you can go to work:p:):):)

Wait until you have kids, you will understand more. And we do realize your rebuild was prior to marriage... that helps.:oops:

We tease you because we respect how hard you have worked to be where you are today. Just remember we are warning you you will slow down with age...

Now, EarthX- remember that they don't charge very well if cold. I am moving mine into the cabin to get heat to it because it does not charge well in winter.

Any pound reduction under $100 is a good pound.
 
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aktango58 said:
If you would start before 10 pm we might feel bad for you, but we know that as a married man you must take care of the cats, dogs and goats before you can go to work:p:):):)

Wait until you have kids, you will understand more. And we do realize your rebuild was prior to marriage... that helps.:oops:

We tease you because we respect how hard you have worked to be where you are today. Just remember we are warning you you will slow down with age...

Now, EarthX- remember that they don't charge very well if cold. I am moving mine into the cabin to get heat to it because it does not charge well in winter.

Any pound reduction under $100 is a good pound.
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this old girl slowed me down. Changing a gear selector valve
4D8C2478-B002-49FA-8B91-BB256699D8FE.jpg
A17D8A34-0D4A-4CEA-8BD5-D082F55BD654.jpg
those fittings haven’t been out in a looooong time
 

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G44 said:
If that battery catches on fire it doesn't matter where its located, you have a serious problem. More than likely it will be fatal if you are in flight.
Click to expand...

Agreed. I keep hearing these claims about EathX, yet I only know of one incident and it smoked the first time it was powered up. THAT leads me to believe it had problems with the install not the battery. 'My brother-in-law is a mechanic and he says....'

Web
 
RaisedByWolves said:
this old girl slowed me down. Changing a gear selector valve
View attachment 54409
View attachment 54410
those fittings haven’t been out in a looooong time
Click to expand...

Had to swap that AC fitting for an AN I see. Warbird guys want all that AC stuff now to be completely original. Looks like an interesting project.

Josh Svennington was telling me about having a runaway EarthX in his experimental helicopter. From everything I have read I don't see how but he gets pretty worked up about them. I know plenty of people running them with no issues at all.
 
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