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Thread: Does the O360 Fit inside a standard 150 HP Cowling

  1. #1

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    Does the O360 Fit inside a standard 150 HP Cowling

    I realize there are lots of 180HP PA 18s, but was curious what mods if any are required to install the O360 into the standard 150 Cub with regards to fitting. Sutton Exhaust if possible but could go with an alternate exhaust system. Experimental build with a stock factory cowl assembly, conical mount. Thanks MT prop
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  2. #2
    wireweinie's Avatar
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    You'll need to bulge the doors out more than with the stock O-320. At least I did.

    Web
    Life's tough . . . wear a cup.
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  3. #3

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    Yep bigger doors cheeks should increase 1-2 inches there is a thread somewhere.
    DENNY

  4. #4

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    Nose bowl can be the stock bowl but the cylinders on the o-360 are taller. Mount can be either type conical or dynafocal. Are you planning to shorten the mount?


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  5. #5

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    Putting an o-360 on my -12. I’ll have all the old cowling up for sale come Feb. Using a new aluminum stock -18 nose bowl with new cowling.


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  6. #6

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    Thanks for the input. I will check out the other related thread. I haven't purchased the motor mount yet. This an experimental conical application so i would think the motor mount is ready to go and not requiring any mods. The cheeks are an easy fabrication and otherwise using a serviceable stock super cub cowling group.

  7. #7

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    If you shop nose bowls isn’t the 360 version wider than the 320? I recall it being an inch wider.
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  8. #8
    wireweinie's Avatar
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    Looking at the old Jensen/Johnson 180 hp STC, (the easiest, simplest STC) they use the same nose bowl. New doors and new lower center cowl peice.

    Web
    Life's tough . . . wear a cup.

  9. #9
    mvivion's Avatar
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    Randy Rubbert just pounds out a bump on each side cowl door to clear the aft cylinder head. Not the prettiest, but it works.

    MTV

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by mvivion View Post
    Randy Rubbert just pounds out a bump on each side cowl door to clear the aft cylinder head. Not the prettiest, but it works.

    MTV
    Anyone ever use those sheet metal dimples similar to the Cessna 170/O-360 Doyne conversion to allow for the added width of the O-360? Probably a little cleaner look than pounding out a dimple.

  11. #11
    mvivion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bubb2 View Post
    Anyone ever use those sheet metal dimples similar to the Cessna 170/O-360 Doyne conversion to allow for the added width of the O-360? Probably a little cleaner look than pounding out a dimple.
    Sure seems like that would work, if you can find a set.

    MTV

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by mvivion View Post
    Sure seems like that would work, if you can find a set.

    MTV
    They come in various sizes on Ebay.
    Large 7 1/2" by 4 1/4", Aluminum Formed Blister, Aircraft, Cars, Toys, Boats. #5 | eBay

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by mvivion View Post
    Randy Rubbert just pounds out a bump on each side cowl door to clear the aft cylinder head. Not the prettiest, but it works.

    MTV
    I don’t think he dimples it. I am getting ready to install the o360 on my bird and none of the pics show a dimple to clear the cylinder.Click image for larger version. 

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    The cowling keeps a clean traditional cub look with a stick nose bowl.


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  14. #14

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    Whose 360 STC you use will determine the cowl. Anyone know what Univair (the old Dans’s STC) uses for the nose bowl? I recall Penn Yan provides a new nose bowl with their PA-18 180hp STC. I’m pretty sure Carbon Concepts has a +1” nose bowl for 180hp installations. Mine’s +2” for the 390. With a short mount and Cub-style cowl nobody would recognize the nose bowl width.

  15. #15
    mvivion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by akmarty View Post
    I don’t think he dimples it. I am getting ready to install the o360 on my bird and none of the pics show a dimple to clear the cylinder.Click image for larger version. 

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    The cowling keeps a clean traditional cub look with a stick nose bowl.


    Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    I was discussing Randy’s personal 180 hp Cub, didn’t mean to imply customers cubs. Your plane almost assuredly has larger cowl doors.

    Sorry, didn’t mean to confuse.

    MTV

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by bubb2 View Post
    These are easy to make. Carve out the size and shape you desire in a block of wood. Clamp or screw on a piece of soft aluminum and beat it with a soft round mallet or ballpeen hammer starting around the outside edges working toward the center. Sand the outside smooth. Polish or paint as desired.

    This one is handmade. Click image for larger version. 

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    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    N1PA

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by mvivion View Post
    I was discussing Randy’s personal 180 hp Cub, didn’t mean to imply customers cubs. Your plane almost assuredly has larger cowl doors.

    Sorry, didn’t mean to confuse.

    MTV
    MTV, I didn’t think you implied anything. They sent me a whole passel of pictures and none had a dimple. I’ve never seen Randy’s plane. The pic is just one of the pics they sent me. My is still sitting in a hangar waiting for the engine.


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  18. #18
    cubpilot2's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=wireweinie;835861]Looking at the old Jensen/Johnson 180 hp STC, (the easiest, simplest STC) they use the same nose bowl. New doors and new lower center cowl peice.

    Web

    I’m familiar with the original Dave Johnson conversions created for his glider towing operation. He used the original cowl but hammered out the bulges on the side doors. Not very pretty but effective. He also had trouble with overheating and had dual coolers mounted on some. He may have cleaned up the design in later renditions.

    I used the Penn Yan kit for my cub. They provided a new standard sized, closed off nose cowl intended for using a small starter and rear oil cooler. The lower cowl and carburetor air box was made by Rubbert. (Very nice quality!)

    The side cowl design was left to the installer. I made new side doors; rolled to get adequate engine clearance which ends up with 3 - 3 1/2” opening at the aft end compared to the original of 2 - 2.5 “
    I soon realized that this opening resulted or contributed to a very cool running engine. Cylinder temps avg 360 and oil temp rarely above 160 without covering the cooler.
    To the contrary I have a 150 horse cub with the exact same configuration but with the original tighter side cowl clearance and is a “warm”running engine.

    I said all of this to recommend making new side cowls avoiding the temptation to bulge out the sides. They will look much better and may result in much better cooling.
    Ed
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  19. #19
    wireweinie's Avatar
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    I used cowl bumps riveted onto standard sized doors. The nose bowl was 'standard' and had no holes for oil cooler or starter. Seemed to work well for me.

    Web
    Life's tough . . . wear a cup.

  20. #20
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubpilot2 View Post
    The side cowl design was left to the installer. I made new side doors; rolled to get adequate engine clearance which ends up with 3 - 3 1/2” opening at the aft end compared to the original of 2 - 2.5 “
    I soon realized that this opening resulted or contributed to a very cool running engine. Cylinder temps avg 360 and oil temp rarely above 160 without covering the cooler.
    To the contrary I have a 150 horse cub with the exact same configuration but with the original tighter side cowl clearance and is a “warm”running engine.

    I said all of this to recommend making new side cowls avoiding the temptation to bulge out the sides. They will look much better and may result in much better cooling.
    I have no interior in my 180 hp Cub. When I place my hand against the inside of the fabric next to the door, it is very warm and I do believe it contributes to heating the cabin. For the inside of the fabric to be this warm there must be a lot of warm air coming from the 2-1/2" opening of the side cowls. My CHTs are like yours.
    N1PA

  21. #21
    supercrow's Avatar
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    Plan on installing my new 0360 in the Crow in the spring is possible. I think I may be able to make it as is but it will be close for sure. I use a Pitts nose bowl which is a little large to start with and I can easily build new side cowls if needed. Because I use a J-3 boot cowl I have very large side openings and have had no engine heat issues even with a 10-1 compression ratio. I could use cowl bumps if needed but will try to do it a little more cleanly. Still on the fence about trying one of the prop balancers.

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