https://turb.aero/product/ta200tp-turboprop-engine?fs=e&s=cl
I hope they’re successful. I wonder what the price point will be?
I hope they’re successful. I wonder what the price point will be?
The Future?
- Thread starter stewartb
- Start date
skywagon8a
MEMBER
SE Mass MA6
Interesting, the fuel flow is still about 2-3 gph higher than the recips we are using now. And the weight of the fuel is about 11% higher than gasoline.
Also notice they give the fuel flow at 12,000 feet. Turbines traditionally are more efficient at higher altitudes. So down at the levels where most of us operate, higher fuel flows would be expected.
Hopefully one day a turbine will be developed which can be competitive with gasoline powered aircraft engines.
Also notice they give the fuel flow at 12,000 feet. Turbines traditionally are more efficient at higher altitudes. So down at the levels where most of us operate, higher fuel flows would be expected.
Hopefully one day a turbine will be developed which can be competitive with gasoline powered aircraft engines.
Dave Calkins
Registered User
Anchorage, Alaska
neato. but probably lotsa comments about all the other small turbines that came before……..
Thanks for the link SB. price point would be nice to know. but lotsa other questions first.
fuel burn listed is similar to a Cont 470 230 hp. but yu gotta be at 10,000’ to get that.
how much fuel capacity does the SQ have? Would you do one if the price was, say…..150 percent the cost of a high zoot 4 cylinder Lyc?
I look forward to your comments SB, as always. Thanks.
Thanks for the link SB. price point would be nice to know. but lotsa other questions first.
fuel burn listed is similar to a Cont 470 230 hp. but yu gotta be at 10,000’ to get that.
how much fuel capacity does the SQ have? Would you do one if the price was, say…..150 percent the cost of a high zoot 4 cylinder Lyc?
I look forward to your comments SB, as always. Thanks.
Dave Calkins
Registered User
Anchorage, Alaska
I seat Pete joined in while I was typing and checking the brochure.
spool up lag and prop reaction might make flying this not as fun as a recip.
how many they can produce and the consistency of manufacture?
……..questions that we asked of Innodyne……..and got answeres that didnt work for us.
spool up lag and prop reaction might make flying this not as fun as a recip.
how many they can produce and the consistency of manufacture?
……..questions that we asked of Innodyne……..and got answeres that didnt work for us.
Formandfunction
MEMBER
That 12.6 gph at 75% is a guesstimate and it clearly states they can change that information at anytime. Only way to increase efficiency like that would produce Temps and pressures that would melt anything shy of million dollar fan blades.
john schwamm
SPONSOR
Anchorage, Alaska Carefree, AZ
What many do not see is a taildragger with a turbine is not the greatest machine. Turbines are great, but one cannot get into Beta very far without losing tail/rudder control. They swap ends pretty easily when the tail flow is blanked out with too much Beta thrust. Like a big pendulum, something has to give when prop is stopping perched out further up front with turbine pushing the other way. Works great in tricylce gear, like Caravan or Kodiak as one can go hard into Beta and be on brakes too. Try it in a tail wheel, like Siai Marchetti, Maule and one will go for a ride uncontrolled.
Other than that turbine is great replacement for piston. To me just not ideal for tailwheel aircraft, shortfield work.
John
skywagon8a
MEMBER
SE Mass MA6
Good point John. Once upon a time I landed a Seabee on a small grass strip covered in icy snow. Since the braking was poor, I placed the prop in reverse. The Seabee did an immediate 180 degree turn backing into the bushes. It was amusing with no damage done. I learned another lesson that day.
frequent_flyer
Registered User
Arizona, USA
Draco (Wilga with PT-6 and a few other mods) seemed to do quite well for short field performance. No idea how much, if any, beta was tried before it met its untimely demise.
john schwamm
SPONSOR
Anchorage, Alaska Carefree, AZ
Maybe I should have clarified landing distances with tailwheel turbine and Beta application are dicey and not totally predictable. Takeoff is not affected and can be really short. Of course launch with great turbine power can be a handfull too.
John
frequent_flyer
Registered User
Arizona, USA
I clipped this image from a Patey video. The dust cloud seems to show beta in use during this STOL/Drag landing. I have no idea what advantage it gave in stopping distance or how close he was to loss of control so not disputing the generalization on use of beta in tailwheel aircraft.
Attachments
frequent_flyer
Registered User
Arizona, USA
I have used max beta in both the Garrett and PT-6 Otters several times. The Garrett turns the 'wrong' way, so the torque is opposite. I never had any difficulty maintaining directional control (the locking tailwheel helps a lot). One needs to be judicious in its use, and to reduce power while slowing to avoid FOD (see Draco pic).
Farmboy
MEMBER
Middlebury, VT
It’s not a turbine but CC is coming to OSH with something bigger under the cowl, so they are getting closer to that price range.
Transmitted from my FlightPhone on fingers… [emoji849]
Rob
MEMBER
AZ06
Flying a turbine precisely, as opposed to airport to airport just requires different skill sets, and thought processes than a recip.
Outside of that it's still just power / energy management.
Over 90% of my turbine time is in a t/w, and beta is frequent and full use is not uncommon. Having said that, there are better ways to use a wing than lading hot and jamming it in to reverse.
Dave, lag? You're a turbine jock... lag is a concern for the new or uninitiated for sure. After a bit in the seat you simply learn to think further ahead. Or you stick to recips...
If acquisition costs and fuel burn were just a little bit more reasonable, I'd do one in a heartbeat. I have a larger turbine (that needs repair), that I would like to use on something like this;
https://www.nf-aircraft.com/
Take care, Rob
Outside of that it's still just power / energy management.
Over 90% of my turbine time is in a t/w, and beta is frequent and full use is not uncommon. Having said that, there are better ways to use a wing than lading hot and jamming it in to reverse.
Dave, lag? You're a turbine jock... lag is a concern for the new or uninitiated for sure. After a bit in the seat you simply learn to think further ahead. Or you stick to recips...
If acquisition costs and fuel burn were just a little bit more reasonable, I'd do one in a heartbeat. I have a larger turbine (that needs repair), that I would like to use on something like this;
https://www.nf-aircraft.com/
Take care, Rob
Rob
MEMBER
AZ06
Yup, sooner or later you gotta come back over the gate, and most rigging / turbines, yield a slight surge when it does, often negating the efforts. But it's magic when you do it right or need it . 8)
Cubus Maximus
Registered User
Beta in the Husky seemed to work pretty well:
RaisedByWolves
FRIEND
Tx
Beta in the Husky seemed to work pretty well:
If I remember right during swamp stol it was gusty and wind down the runway, he said he won’t use it in those conditions. Must be a good reason. He was pretty good with it
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Dave Calkins
Registered User
Anchorage, Alaska
As to lag, I was thinking of the beauty and “crispness” of the Garrett in the Otters. and the “softness” of the PT6 in the Caravan.
Full reverse in a properly rigged Garrett Otter on floats is impressive. and most people wont believe a statement of what short landings are possible.
Full reverse in a properly rigged Garrett Otter on floats is impressive. and most people wont believe a statement of what short landings are possible.
john schwamm
SPONSOR
Anchorage, Alaska Carefree, AZ
On floats one essentially has a 'nosewheel', so no issues on beta with tail trying to come around. Floats and the instant response on Honeywell/Garrett engines are impressive. Aerotwin did our Caravan with one too, float takeoff time cut in half.
John
Rob
MEMBER
AZ06
I liken the turbine lag concerns to 2 stroke vs 4 stroke, or diesel vs gas topics. Most of the time the operator skill level , proficiency and experience matter more than the source of motivation.
I like the Garrett just fine in the air, but can't stand them on the ground. Hot loading / fueling is just less than user friendly. I guess if you shut down for everything, (almost never happens in our world) the fuel savings and straight shaft response could be enticing.
I like the Garrett just fine in the air, but can't stand them on the ground. Hot loading / fueling is just less than user friendly. I guess if you shut down for everything, (almost never happens in our world) the fuel savings and straight shaft response could be enticing.
