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Thread: Trent Palmer’s Pilot certificate suspended for going around at an off-airport landing site

  1. #281
    Grant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvivion View Post
    We've done a few formation flights since ADS-B, and I specifically inquired of ATC if this procedure is still required. Yep. It was interesting to note last year that EAA specified that Transponders should remain ON while close to Airventure.....doubtless due to ADS-B. In past procedure was transponders off within some specified distance.

    MTV

    The procedure is still valid.... It's just an FAA "Right Hand" / "Left Hand" thing.... My point is, that some algorithm is looking to see that an aircraft landed at KABC but took off from KXYZ.... The algorithm says "wait a minute, how did the airplane get from KABC to KXYZ? Then an automated report gets fired off to a FSDO inspector who has to follow-up...

    What I'm really getting at is not about the formation thing, but more providing a warning to those who think "I'll land at airport A, turn off my ADSB transponder and fly low level to airport B. Just know that if you take off from airport B with your ADSB transponder on you will be flagged for flying from airport A to Airport B with your ADSB transponder off.

  2. #282
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    The procedure is still valid.... It's just an FAA "Right Hand" / "Left Hand" thing.... My point is, that some algorithm is looking to see that an aircraft landed at KABC but took off from KXYZ.... The algorithm says "wait a minute, how did the airplane get from KABC to KXYZ? Then an automated report gets fired off to a FSDO inspector who has to follow-up...

    What I'm really getting at is not about the formation thing, but more providing a warning to those who think "I'll land at airport A, turn off my ADSB transponder and fly low level to airport B. Just know that if you take off from airport B with your ADSB transponder on you will be flagged for flying from airport A to Airport B with your ADSB transponder off.
    Yep, there are some really dumb policies in place right now.

    MTV

  3. #283
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    The 500' rule....,what if one approaches and lands an area much further away than 500', but than slowly taxis closer to " man made structures etc." think I know the answer. Asking for a friend.

  4. #284
    Gordon Misch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by courierguy View Post
    The 500' rule....,what if one approaches and lands an area much further away than 500', but than slowly taxis closer to " man made structures etc." think I know the answer. Asking for a friend.
    And - what if that structure is one owned by the pilot on that pilot's private property? Sounds like we might have a mutual friend?
    Gordon

    N4328M KTDO

  5. #285
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    Quote Originally Posted by courierguy View Post
    The 500' rule....,what if one approaches and lands an area much further away than 500', but than slowly taxis closer to " man made structures etc." think I know the answer. Asking for a friend.
    "91.119 Minimum safe altitudes; general Except when necessary for takeoff or landing, no person may operate an aircraft below the following altitudes:"

    I believe that "operate" holds the answer to your question. You can find the definition of "operate" in 14 CFR 1.1. Hint - you don't need to hold a pilot's license to move an aircraft on the ground.
    Thanks courierguy thanked for this post

  6. #286
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    Oh, man, now we’re getting into Philadelphia Lawyering…….

    MTV
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  7. #287
    Grand Pooh Bah soyAnarchisto's Avatar
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    Again, that's only if you are on the ground in controlled airspace, ie delta or echo to the surface at an airport. There are actually very few of those situations where you are within range of an adsb tower while on the ground in the middle of hangars. I'm inside a mode c veil, but class g on the ground and pretty sure not within receiving distance of an FAA tower. So unless someone is doing the SJ thing and privately recording your very intermittent initial send before you hit the ident button you still have a lot of privacy before you are in the air. It's not zero, but it's ain't nothing either.

    Far easier to track you using your pocket computer (ie cell smart phone). I find it really funny that pilots tweak about this stuff while happily walking around everywhere. A lot of anonymity is still more than zero. Perfection is the enemy of good.

    Quote Originally Posted by Formandfunction View Post
    Faa records and stores all flight data in controlled airspace and 978&1090 contacts. When your 978 initially pings a tower that tail number is stored and can be connected to a anonymous flight. So no,it is not setup for anonymity on 978.
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  8. #288
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    .... For example, I know of a certain aeroshell T6 team that did that from Point A to Point B. When one of them flew from Point B back home by themself, with transponder set to ALT they got a call asking how they got from point A to point B.... The person calling had no idea they were a professional airshow team member. He was just calling based on a computer generated report of people who may have broken the rules......
    I'm sure glad they have inspectors spending time doing stuff like this,
    instead of processing field approvals (11 months for my last one)
    or doing airworthiness / repairman certificate inspections.
    I'll sleep better at night knowing that.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!
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  9. #289
    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hotrod180 View Post
    I'm sure glad they have inspectors spending time doing stuff like this,
    instead of processing field approvals (11 months for my last one)
    or doing airworthiness / repairman certificate inspections.
    I'll sleep better at night knowing that.

    they fired two local DPE's over some BS. They are spending time chasing after supposedly un reported accidents then they are doing anything else. We are from the FAA and are here to help

  10. #290
    ScaleBackcountryPilot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by courierguy View Post
    Evel's jump site is (you can still see remnants of the ramp, and it will make you pucker up just looking at it) is within a mile or two of the bridge. Totally legal to leap off it, as long as you have a parachute anyway, not sure about the suicidally inclined, that may be illegal and they could get in big trouble. I do have to hand it to the city fathers, welcoming all base jumpers, I hear it is a world wide destination site for those so inclined, they rent motels, buy food, and then leave afterward (one way or the other), a perfect source of income for the city.
    It would have to be a hard leap! I've hiked up that a few times and the ramp's remnants are maybe about 150 feet from the canyon edge (google earth claims 161 to be exact.)

    As for flying under the Perrine, did people do that? I've never seen or heard of it in my 12 years in the area but that's likely because the BASE jumpers are there pretty much every good day.

    I'd watch it if someone wanted to do it

  11. #291
    courierguy's Avatar
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    Of course no one EVER flew under it, even before base jumpers started calling from it. That would be wrong.

  12. #292
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    Quote Originally Posted by soyAnarchisto View Post
    Again, that's only if you are on the ground in controlled airspace, ie delta or echo to the surface at an airport. There are actually very few of those situations where you are within range of an adsb tower while on the ground in the middle of hangars. I'm inside a mode c veil, but class g on the ground and pretty sure not within receiving distance of an FAA tower. So unless someone is doing the SJ thing and privately recording your very intermittent initial send before you hit the ident button you still have a lot of privacy before you are in the air. It's not zero, but it's ain't nothing either.

    Far easier to track you using your pocket computer (ie cell smart phone). I find it really funny that pilots tweak about this stuff while happily walking around everywhere. A lot of anonymity is still more than zero. Perfection is the enemy of good.
    You might be suprised at the faa tower coverage and it just takes one quick ping to create a record. In my case being less than ten miles from a military base every ping,call and radar is recorded. I have knowledge of them connecting a seaplane incident to the corresponding radio calls and radar for a complete flight path record. Only way out of that is to eleminate the radio,adsb or fly behind the mountains till they lose track of you. Not that it matters because I don't fly within 500 feet of anything. Not people,houses,cows or hunters during season.
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