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Thread: How to get a plane Registered?

  1. #1

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    How to get a plane Registered?

    I imported a pa-11 back from Canada Oct. 2019 it was disassembled so the Registry wanted pictures of the complete assembled airplane before it could be registered, by then it was stripped and in rebuild process I had requested the original N number. I also reserved a N number one digit off my pa-11. Feb 2022 I sent picture of the airplane complete except the engine wasn't installed I sent a letter stating the crankshaft was on backorder with this covid stuff going on and also had filled out a new registration form with the second N number. Again registration was denied because of no engine installed they also stated you can buy the piper data plates on the internet so I needed to contact Piper to verify it was a real cub, after a month dealing with Piper finally got a letter stating it is a cub. Sent pictures of a completed airplane and letter to the FAA and in the denial letters they reference the originally requested number that they have never issued. Just got a letter stating I need to resubmit all paperwork with a bill of sale from myself and wife to myself and wife for each ownership change for the plane that was never issued a N number by them. I think this explains why they are processing registrations from December 2021 right now. How would you handle this?

  2. #2
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Try a phone call to the number on the letter. They can't seem to handle multiple operations from one letter even though you may have clearly laid out the sequence as they send each operation to a different person which confuses everyone. This then generates multiple letters requesting information you have already supplied because the letter writer doesn't talk to the person at the next desk.

    A similar thing happened to me long ago. A phone call fixed it.
    N1PA
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  3. #3
    Bearhawk Builder's Avatar
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    Douten, I've been through this and I know it's frustrating but in the end the FAA person handling your case is your best friend. Ask specific questions of what you need to show to satisfy the FAA and then do that. Keep all correspondence in writing and use your case number when sending them information. In my experience once a case is open you are not put at the back of the line each time you submit requested information. I know they won't issue a registration until you show that the aircraft is complete so you have to have it all done before you submit those pictures. Also bills of sale back to the last registered owner is a requirement.
    I'm not following you on the second N number, did you apply for registration using two different N numbers? Why?
    You could also hire a DAR to help you through the process. Susan Fournier of AeroPro Inc in Freeport has helped me through the experimental process a couple times. Not cheap but she's good. Dale Johnson from the Bradley FISDO helped me through a conformity inspection of my supercub. I'm not sure by what you write but do you need an airworthiness cert also? Or just a registration? If it's just the reg it should be simple once you submit your completed photos.
    Hope this helps,
    Dave
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  4. #4

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    Dave, I applied for the original N number that was issued in 1948. During the rebuild I reserved a second number (one number off my pa-11) I called and talked to a person at the registry and was told I could change and wouldn't need to pay the fee again so this spring I sent the request for the second number instead of the original as it had never been issued to me. after all the hoops I've had to go thru so far it was a shock to get the letter yesterday stating I need to sell the plane to myself and wife to change the number from the number that has never been issued. Pete I plan to call today to try to talk with someone.
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  5. #5
    aktango58's Avatar
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    I have used AIC Title services for all my registration needs. Paperwork seems to get done and my planes get registered.

    Sometimes knowing who is better than knowing how.
    I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!
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  6. #6

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    Dave, I will need a conformity inspection also. I have been working with Sue as I am putting my amphibs on this plane will need a airworthiness certificate also. a problem is I can't get the 337's or anything else done for that matter until I have an airplane.

  7. #7

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    George may have to resort to hiring help just didn't seem like it would be this difficult. I guess I would have stuck the wings and engine back on when I got it home if I knew what it would entail.

  8. #8

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    FAA has been real sticklers lately at the registry. While registration has nothing to do with airworthiness, they have been holding people hostage if the airplane is not airworthy. They fall back to the definition of aircraft in 49 USC 40102. Seems this is only the case when applying for registration if the aircraft isn’t currently registered. I had a 3 year battle with them that went all the way to a a congressional Inquiry on my PA-16. When applying for registration NEVER indicate that the aircraft is not in a condition to fly! That will throw your application to the Special Investigation and Enforcement Team. Those guys are real hard asses and impossible to work with.

    Best bet is to use a title service and let them walk it through before you ever say anything to FAA.


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  9. #9
    frequent_flyer's Avatar
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    Was the original registration ever assigned to a different aircraft? It is my understanding that, once he aircraft had been de-registered for export to Canada, that original registration could have been requested for any other US aircraft.

  10. #10

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    The number I requested was the original number for this plane, Talked with them a little while ago seems when I bought it the bill of sale was in my name so when I applied in my wife and my name I needed a bill of sale from me to us. They hadn't issued the number but it was assigned to the serial number of thing in my hanger. So just filled out the application for the number I want and the wife and I sold it to ourselves again??? Hope this time it will satisfy them and I can move on to the next step. I'm a SLOW learner so hope it works out and I remember it.

  11. #11

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    Now expect to get state sales tax bill for both purchases!
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  12. #12
    Bearhawk Builder's Avatar
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    I did all my 337's based on the reserved N number. You just have to make sure you renew that number and don't loose it before you're done. They didn't get filed until after the reg was issued but they were ready to go.

  13. #13

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    The registry will likely return your 337s if the airplane isn't registered yet. You should hold on to them until you have the registration. Obviously, you haven't returned the aircraft to service, so your 48 hour window on the 337s hasn't started yet.
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  14. #14

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    dga I hope I can write off the 50-60 grand loss of selling it to the wife and I, second purchase was a good buy at $1.00 so I can afford the taxes on that. Felt like looking at my 401K.
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  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Douten View Post
    dga I hope I can write off the 50-60 grand loss of selling it to the wife and I, second purchase was a good buy at $1.00 so I can afford the taxes on that. Felt like looking at my 401K.
    The bad part is most tax authorities go by appraised value, or a value they pull out of the hat, not what you put on the FaaA bill of sale.


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  16. #16
    cubdriver2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Douten View Post
    dga I hope I can write off the 50-60 grand loss of selling it to the wife and I, second purchase was a good buy at $1.00 so I can afford the taxes on that. Felt like looking at my 401K.
    Show the FAA the picture of you riding around with that black bear cub in the cab of your chevy before it ate the dashboard. They won't mess with you.

    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"
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  17. #17

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    Glenn, Everyone messes with me.
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  18. #18
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    I have found few federal employees with common sense or who actually care. Very sad in my opinion. They cost us all hundreds of thousands of dollars and time. I have way to many first hand experiences that make you just shake your head.
    Steve Pierce

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  19. #19

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    FWIW I followed the instructions in the EAA experimental registration book and received my Bearhawk registration back in six weeks!

  20. #20
    cubdrvr's Avatar
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    Just try to get one registered after the previous owner sent the "totally destroyed" card in when it wasn't
    "Sometimes a Cigar is just a Cigar"

  21. #21

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    Think I'm on the right track now, needed to send in a letter as to where the plane has been for the last 2 1/2 years to get the first N number then the $10 to change from the first requested number that has been assigned but never issued so then they will send me a form to fill out when they ok the number change that I haven't been issued so I keep the paper with me until I get the ok to change the number that I don't have until I can put the number I want on if that makes any sense .

  22. #22

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    Well after a long hard battle got the plane registered with the original N number got the paperwork for the N number I decided I wanted. Did the conformity check all stc's and 337's done and the field approval for my Baumann 1500A floats done and my airworthy certificate then I could put the N number I wanted put on the plane while the process for the N number change and new airworthiness certificate is issued. Felt good to finally fly the plane today after a 2 year 8 month restoration. I think it's going to be worth all the BS and expense I've gone through.

  23. #23
    Farmboy's Avatar
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    Douten see you in Dover.


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