Avgas Coalition and AOPA...Avgas is an endangered species!

Formandfunction · Sep 3, 2022

skywagon8a said:
Where did you hear it was going to be a dollar more? $1 is more than slightly. Using local prices that would be a 15% increase. The article says: "the arrival of G100LL at airports means that the fuel will cost slightly more than leaded avgas."

The gami website says $.85 and I rounded it to a dollar out of anger. From my experience I have never ever once seen anything come to market as predicted.
From my experience I'm guessing it will come in at $1.00-$1.85 more.
However I don't see how big oil will allow a private patent holder to take any part of their business no matter how small. My prediction is that the oil companies will step in with their own fuel when it becomes a real issue. They haven't yet because 100ll has a higher profit margin.

skywagon8a · Sep 3, 2022

Formandfunction said:
However I don't see how big oil will allow a private patent holder to take any part of their business no matter how small. My prediction is that the oil companies will step in with their own fuel when it becomes a real issue. They haven't yet because 100ll has a higher profit margin.

I had a good friend (gone west) who was a retired senior Vp of research for one of the "biggest oil" companies. I wish he was still here so we could discuss this.

sj · Sep 3, 2022

Since there are several other folks working on the 100LL replacement, hopefully this is just the first of a few announcements in the coming years. I doubt Gami got into this with altruistic intentions, they are there to make some money (and have likely spent a fair bit getting it to this point - like any other STC holder). As for big oil, I suspect it won't be Gami producing this stuff - they will just be tacking on their own earnings per gallon for bringing the product to market. I'm not deep on what sets this fuel apart from non-ethanol car gas, but I suspect food coloring and stabilizer at a minimum.

Most of us won't use it until we have to, but the more we use it, (hopefully) the less expensive it will get.

sj

Utah-Jay · Sep 3, 2022

George Braley has stated Exxon is on board

Formandfunction said:
The gami website says $.85 and I rounded it to a dollar out of anger. From my experience I have never ever once seen anything come to market as predicted.
From my experience I'm guessing it will come in at $1.00-$1.85 more.
However I don't see how big oil will allow a private patent holder to take any part of their business no matter how small. My prediction is that the oil companies will step in with their own fuel when it becomes a real issue. They haven't yet because 100ll has a higher profit margin.

bcone1381 · Sep 5, 2022

I watched the video. I am supportive right now.

Sounds to me like they take a certain fuel stock and add GAMI's secret potion to it. It seems like this will make it easy to blend worldwide. This will open up general aviation to parts of the world that are now without, and then it will drive up demand and in the end improve economies of scale and decreased production on a per gallon basis.....so everyone can win. But I might be wrong, I often am. But Thats ok.

In the video George says The fuel blend will be priced competitively. It's been said that this is the most thoroughly tested STC thats come through the Wichita office. GAMI took a risk, paid for R&D, deserves to make pay off there debt, recoup cost, and produce income from this.

cubdrvr · Sep 5, 2022

To all the above 65 posts:
Crawl into a beanbag chair with a bowl of ice cream, turn the TV up loud, and don't think about it. :banghead:

aktango58 · Sep 6, 2022

My concern is the rapid degradation and moisture content of current fuels not sold for aviation.

If they will sell us a fuel with a shelf life longer than 30 days, that is not full of water I am on board. That is my reason for using 100LL in most things, including sleds, bike and chainsaw.

soyAnarchisto · Sep 7, 2022

Why do you have pipe dope, plastics and epoxy resins in your fuel system? Isn't that stuff well known to be a problem? My fuel system (certified admittedly) has rubber and aluminum lines and nothing else. Are you running rotax?

My local airport sells both ethanol free mogas and 100LL and have never heard them say anything about them being threatened about it. Most airports I ask about mogas are a) completely ignorant of it or b) dont' have another storage tank or vehicle to be able to offer it.

My problem with the replacements (now there's 2-3 more of them swift/gami etc) will create yet another type of fuel with more storage tanks needed and in the interim we will have 100LL and GAMI/Swift at the same time which will be a problem. Most of us with low compression engines would be happier with the CHEAPER with ethanol free mogas. That's been around and been running problem free for decades.

I think we all ought to have demanded ethanol free mogas be made available FIRST, since it's already here and demonstrated to be safe and reliable for all the low compression engines.

Cub Builder said:
MOGAS issues. The big oil producers have actively pursued running Mogas off airports. FBOs and fuelers that sell Mogas are threatened with having their supply of 100LL shut off if they don't remove the Mogas sales. I ran Mogas exclusively for 10+ years until I left NM and retired to AR using a 110 gal tank and fueling rig in the back of my pickup.

In AR, Alcohol free premium Mogas is readily available. However, all of the stations in my area now have an injector cleaner additive in the fuel that I have found to cause as much or more damage than alcohol contaminated fuels. (details of the damage and testing on my web site) The carb and engine was fine with it, but it will dissolve pipe dope from the pipe fittings and will break down epoxy resins and any plastics or rubberized fuel lines in the fuel system. The last station in my area that was carrying clean fuel without the additives lost his source of clean Mogas a few months ago, so I have no choice but to switch to 100LL for both of my planes for now. Mogas has always had an uphill battle getting onto airports and local supplies around the country, even at gas stations it is iffy at best.

-----snip

-Cub Builder

Avgas Coalition and AOPA...Avgas is an endangered species!

SE Mass MA6

Northwest Arkansas

Heber City, UT

Michigan

YKN(mother city of the dakotas)

18AA

Boulder, CO

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