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Thread: Naval Carrier Question for a good strategist

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    Farmboy's Avatar
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    Naval Carrier Question for a good strategist

    Suppose a decommissioned carrier was sold, and being towed by a tug to a new port.

    The tug is manned obviously but the carrier is completely unmanned.

    How many days do you need to plan _and_ execute, a stealth cub landing, photo shoot, and departure from this carrier?

    The clock is ticking.

    ….Asking for a friend.


    Transmitted from my FlightPhone on fingers…
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    About 4 minutes- land, kick out the photog, he films the takeoff, and subsequent landing, gets back in, and you’re gone. Cover up n-numbers, and you’d be done long before anyone made it aboard. Real question is how do you know it’s really unmanned?
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    Willie's Avatar
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    It's going to take the Kitty Hawk a long time to get through the Magellan Strait and into Brownsville. And I wouldn't assume that she is completely unmanned. Best bet might be to catch up with KH off Yucatan peninsula. Too many helicopters and small planes doing photo shoots as she transits down the west coast.
    "The sword of freedom is kept sharp by those who live on it's edge." - Scott Adams

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    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Farmboy View Post
    Suppose a decommissioned carrier was sold, and being towed by a tug to a new port.

    The tug is manned obviously but the carrier is completely unmanned.

    How many days do you need to plan _and_ execute, a stealth cub landing, photo shoot, and departure from this carrier?

    The clock is ticking.

    ….Asking for a friend.


    Transmitted from my FlightPhone on fingers…
    Long long ago in the land of Boston's outer harbor I spotted a carrier outbound under tow. Hmmmm? Yes? No? Yess! Line up on final approach, start to engage brain, Hmmm? What if there is a hole in the deck? What if there is an unseen cable across the deck? What would happen if I got stuck on the deck? Would anyone know? What would I tell the owner of the plane? If I ever made it back to shore? Were they just taking it out to sea to scuttle it? With me on board? Heck, just break off the approach as I approach the stern. Is 60 years beyond the statute of limitations for almost trespassing on a Naval ship?

    Every once in a while something reminds me of that day. Farmboy, you've done it again!
    N1PA

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    cubdriver2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    Long long ago in the land of Boston's outer harbor I spotted a carrier outbound under tow. Hmmmm? Yes? No? Yess! Line up on final approach, start to engage brain, Hmmm? What if there is a hole in the deck? What if there is an unseen cable across the deck? What would happen if I got stuck on the deck? Would anyone know? What would I tell the owner of the plane? If I ever made it back to shore? Were they just taking it out to sea to scuttle it? With me on board? Heck, just break off the approach as I approach the stern. Is 60 years beyond the statute of limitations for almost trespassing on a Naval ship?

    Every once in a while something reminds me of that day. Farmboy, you've done it again!
    Did you get out and take a picture Pete?

    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"
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    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubdriver2 View Post
    Did you get out and take a picture Pete?

    Glenn
    With my Brownie box camera? That would have been more entertaining had there been some of today's modern camera equipment handy. Like Farmboy's 360 degree swivel camera.
    N1PA

  7. #7
    Richgj3's Avatar
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    When the Intrepid was in NY Harbor before getting its berth an un named friend was flying his J3 on a city tour. He dragged the deck and then did a touch and go. He went home to get a camera and when he got back there were 55 gallon drums all over the deck. I guess there was somebody on board.

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    Call the ship breaking company. They could make some coin on that tow if they did it right.
    DENNY
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    aktango58's Avatar
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    Seems to me the only issue is trespassing as far as being on the deck. The FAA could go Careless and reckless.

    Note the wheels are/were secured on the top deck at the stern, so you will need to clear those prior to touching down. Also, the forward speed of the ship will not be military flight operation speed with a single tug up front, so your headwind will not be as high, if it is a headwind, as I would not expect them to take her into the wind for your amusement.

    When we going?
    I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!
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    Marty57's Avatar
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    You minding your own business, watching the tow down and to your left as you fly from the bow to the stern at 1000'...... and your engine monitoring systems all of a sudden shows no oil pressure ....... your back seater shoots a picture of the offending readings on your panel. What to do? Precautionary landing is about all you can do or ditch if it's real. Turned out, it was a loose connection. Back in the air in no time. Sure was good fortune that a floating, man-made island was nearby .....

    Marty57
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    Psalm 36:7 "High and low among men find refuge in the shadow of His wing"
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    wireweinie's Avatar
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    I'll chip in for bail.

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    aktango58's Avatar
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    I remember being about 5 miles east of Whittier on my way home from Herring, about 5,000' when my oil pressure went to zero!

    Not long after I was on the ground on their airport, with limited traffic pattern and overlook.

    Loose wire- back in the air in a short time and ok. Love landing options.
    I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!

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    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aktango58 View Post
    I remember being about 5 miles east of Whittier on my way home from Herring, about 5,000' when my oil pressure went to zero!

    Not long after I was on the ground on their airport, with limited traffic pattern and overlook.

    Loose wire- back in the air in a short time and ok. Love landing options.
    That is why I like a direct reading oil pressure gauge.
    N1PA

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    A true stealth landing on even a decommissioned vessel transiting from reserve fleet to public display is not very likely to be possible. I worked a one of the bases for the reserve fleet and every time one of those old ships was sent off, the deck was occupied by a dummy F18 - or two. So landing would seem unlikely. Additionally, it would make sense that even demilitarized, they are likely to be under surveillance. I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin' is all.

    But it is a cool idea and I empathize. Back in the 70's I was flying up the Delaware River and came upon a carrier bound for the Philly Navy Yard. If they hadn't had the deck covered with ( I presume the crew's) cars, I might have done something stupider than usual. Just seeing one of those things makes you want to land on it! Even if it's sitting still on the yard. But nowadays I'm too old to go to prison so I don't guess I'll ever get it done.

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    Exclamation

    Quote Originally Posted by RedOwlAirfield View Post
    A true stealth landing on even a decommissioned vessel transiting from reserve fleet to public display is not very likely to be possible. I worked a one of the bases for the reserve fleet and every time one of those old ships was sent off, the deck was occupied by a dummy F18 - or two. So landing would seem unlikely. Additionally, it would make sense that even demilitarized, they are likely to be under surveillance. I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin' is all.

    But it is a cool idea and I empathize. Back in the 70's I was flying up the Delaware River and came upon a carrier bound for the Philly Navy Yard. If they hadn't had the deck covered with ( I presume the crew's) cars, I might have done something stupider than usual. Just seeing one of those things makes you want to land on it! Even if it's sitting still on the yard. But nowadays I'm too old to go to prison so I don't guess I'll ever get it done.
    If / when when they figured out who you are/were, and they would find you out, or hunt you down on YouTube, you would do more damage to GA than the idiot who jumped out of the Stenson in California a few weeks ago.
    Not worth the vacation as a guest a a federal facility.

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    Last edited by Cubus Maximus; 01-18-2022 at 05:26 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kahles56 View Post
    If / when when they figured out who you are/were, and they would find you out, or hunt you down on YouTube, you would do more damage to GA than the idiot who jumped out of the Stenson in California a few weeks ago.
    Not worth the vacation as a guest a a federal facility.
    That guy is an idiot but he did no damage to GA, no one outside of GA noticed. No one inside of GA without a youtube habit noticed. The one thing he did accomplish is bolstered the boring youtube genre of 'outrage aviation porn.' And I for one am outraged about the outrage that just spreads the original thing that everyone is outraged about leading to more internet aviation outrage. It's outrageous.
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    hotrod180's Avatar
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    They cooked Martha Lunken's ass for flying under a bridge,
    I imagine it'd be the same or worse for an unauthorized landing on an aircraft carrier -- decommissioned or not.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

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    Why not contact the salvage company that owns it and ask? Tell them you'd be willing to accept all liability if something goes wrong. All they could say is no, and there's even a (very) slim chance they'd be ok with it. Wouldn't hurt anything to simply ask, though.
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    courierguy's Avatar
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    Then there is the spillway on the failed Teton Dam, just waiting for some pilot to land it. The fact that it's posted with old signs (original, before the fail) saying KEEP OUT, by the Bureau of Reclamation, obviously does not apply to pilots. Asking permission to land it would be the obvious way to go, federal bureaucrats being known as they are for thinking outside the box and taking risks, pensions be damned, I'm sure it wouldn't be a problem.
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    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
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    How’s the old saying go, easier to beg forgiveness than ask permission


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    JWE's Avatar
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    Doing some things is fun. Doing some others is just stupid.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hotrod180 View Post
    They cooked Martha Lunken's ass for turning off her ADS-B, I imagine it'd be the same or worse for an unauthorized landing on an aircraft carrier -- decommissioned or not.
    fixed it for you
    Last edited by 180_jeff; 01-20-2022 at 02:17 PM.
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    Just tell them you’re in the market for a new yacht and you’d like to make a pre-buy inspection

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    wireweinie's Avatar
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    Hey. No XXX's at the end of this runway . . . .

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    Marty57's Avatar
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    "On 6 October 2021, Kitty Hawk and John F. Kennedy were sold for one-cent each to International Shipbreaking Limited"

    That makes it the private property of the shipbreaking company ......

    If 3 miles of shore, in international waters, how are maritime trespassing complaints handled ....... just wondering.

    Marty57

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    Cubus Maximus's Avatar
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    hotrod180's Avatar
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    About 10 years ago, a couple of floating bridges here in western WA were replaced.
    They floated some of the old bridge sections over to Port Gamble bay to store them for a while.
    A guy I know told me his son thought it'd be fun to land on one in his Aeronca Chief.
    It was supposed to be a hit & run but something went awry.
    I don't recall if they hauled the airplane off in a boat,
    or if a boat brought help / replacement parts,
    but apparently they avoided any repercussions.
    If the story was true.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

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    The old airport site at West Yellowstone MT is still ridiculously "airport like", grown in a bit but for a slow lander it's JFK. But do not try and use the excuse "it's an airport", as a certain Forest Service ranger (not IN the park, but it's FS controlled) is wise to that dodge, and will promptly inform you that it's been inactive since 1964! Responding with "so what", won't work. Then we both laughed like hell and I promised not to do it again. When he first approached, he made it clear HE had zero issues with me doing it, but technically it was not allowed, and some of his co rangers would really have a conniption, "my" ranger used to fly UL's so was flying friendly, lucky for me. Out of respect for him, I have not done so since, but the fact that snowmobiles swarm the site all winter with impunity sticks in my craw.
    http://www.airfields-freeman.com/MT/...tm#yellowstone
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    Quote Originally Posted by courierguy View Post
    The old airport site at West Yellowstone MT is still ridiculously "airport like", grown in a bit but for a slow lander it's JFK. But do not try and use the excuse "it's an airport", as a certain Forest Service ranger (not IN the park, but it's FS controlled) is wise to that dodge, and will promptly inform you that it's been inactive since 1964! Responding with "so what", won't work. Then we both laughed like hell and I promised not to do it again. When he first approached, he made it clear HE had zero issues with me doing it, but technically it was not allowed, and some of his co rangers would really have a conniption, "my" ranger used to fly UL's so was flying friendly, lucky for me. Out of respect for him, I have not done so since, but the fact that snowmobiles swarm the site all winter with impunity sticks in my craw.
    http://www.airfields-freeman.com/MT/...tm#yellowstone
    So you should self identify as a snow machine!


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