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Thread: Javron PA18 newbie

  1. #1
    tackdog's Avatar
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    Javron PA18 newbie

    Hi everyone, my names Damian and I live in Australia and have just ordered a PA18 Javron kit from Jay. Im fairly new to flying only starting aroud 9 years ago and we've owned an Australian designed 2 seat aerobat cruiser called a Victa Airtourer, followed by an Rv7A and now the old bus - the cessna 172XP. Im 6'2 and always felt like a praying mantis in the first two, and as much as we love the 172XP for big trips, its a boring bus to fly.

    I don't have great access to Cubs where I live, but after seeing my first - I was sold! After a few flights and seeing them in Oshkosh a few years ago I'm finally in a fortunate enough position to purchase and build. Whilst we wait our turn for Jay's production run, I'm taking this opportunity to purchase tools and setup my workshop as I have to almost import everything from the USA for this build. It's all a bit daunting not being able to see first hand half of the things I need to buy, however thanks to some wonderful online resources, trips to Kosh and communities like Supercub.org couple with a bit of good ole faith - I'm looking forward to this project.
    With the "Rona" lockdowns we are experiencing down-under, I also need to put some of this wasted time to better use.

    After considering the style of flying my wife and I do, together with destroying my back and a knee in an accident, this has steered some of our options. My wife will also likely learn to fly in this too!

    Other than all the normal mods, I've ordered a 4" wide fuse, 3" Gear with extra cross brace and fuel steps, extra angled fwd door post (for easier entry), inertia reel belts, ACME aero, Grove double puck heel brakes, 31'' ABW, standard round tip wing with Keller-PSTOL flaps, 2 x 24 US Gal fuel tanks, thrustline 2" lowered engine mount, overhead flap handle, larger baggage doors, standard split right door and full tilt shooters left window, electric elevator trim and 2 autopilot servo mounts. I've also decided to try the exhaust system Jays had made to suit the 0-360 with the lowered engine mount after reading about some of the interference
    points with this lower cowl. The goal is to fit a 0-360 with the ground adjustable composite whirlwind and I'm still looking into the Dynon HDX avionics after having success with these fitted in my RV. I'll definately sit on the fence with avionics as who knows what the next 2 years could bring with new products?

    I've already been reading through the Northland drawings, Cub TCDS, Backcountry build links and the parts manuals - and of course all of the awesome work that you have all shared.

    I'm trying put together some parts orders and was hoping someone could share some experience?


    • rather than purchasing each small rubber fuel line piece from univair-for the fittings between the tanks and the wing route fuel lines, can the same product be purchase in greater single lengths to cut yourself and any recommendations - or are some of these pieces formed / shaped?
    • what fuel line clamps are recommended for these connections? (I have the pipe flairing tool)and cant seem to locate many from the standard part no/s
    • is the standard fuel tank filler neck - cover rubber grommet that univair stocks - just a normal rubber flat grommet - or is it slightly conical shaped?
    • with the 2" lowered mount, is there much fabrication req. for the gascolator fitment? I'll use a Steve's A/C unit




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    Damian
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  2. #2

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    Hi Damian - I’m not sure what options you ordered with your kit, but mine came with rubber fuel line hose and clamps as part of the fuel system plumbing.

    Sam

  3. #3
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    Hi Sam. I ordered the fuel line kit yet I wasn't completely sure if all the fittings and fixtures were supplied. Thanks for clearing that up! I'm following your build too and thanks for taking the time to share your journey.
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  4. #4

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    Hi Damian, great to hear you've ordered a Javron! I'm finishing off a Carbon Cub and think a Javron might be next. Maybe 2 in a shipping container might be a good cost saving. I'm in Brisbane.
    Cheers Nick
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  5. #5
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    Cool to hear of others building. I ordered my Javron kit about a month ago. Pretty sure a good friend is about to order as well and we will build them up together. New Holstein was an expensive fly-in for me! Already working on a 700' strip at my farm here in NC.
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  6. #6
    Bill Rusk's Avatar
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    • rather than purchasing each small rubber fuel line piece from univair-for the fittings between the tanks and the wing route fuel lines, can the same product be purchase in greater single lengths to cut yourself and any recommendations - or are some of these pieces formed / shaped? If I understand what you are asking, just use fuel line that you can get from your local auto parts store. Yes, get a couple of feet. This hose will also accept auto fuel to include ethanol. Having a few inches of flexible hose between the tank fitting and the hard line will also provide a buffer for vibration and movement
    • what fuel line clamps are recommended for these connections? (I have the pipe flairing tool)and cant seem to locate many from the standard part no/s
    • Just use the standard screw hose clamps that you use on car hoses again available from the local auto parts store. No need to create a flare, I've not had a leak from this area as long as the hose fits on properly and you shove to on for an inch or two.
    • is the standard fuel tank filler neck - cover rubber grommet that univair stocks - just a normal rubber flat grommet - or is it slightly conical shaped? I got mine at Home Depot in the plumbing section. Sometimes you may have to modify things a little but it will often work quite well, look professional and cost FAR less
    • with the 2" lowered mount, is there much fabrication req. for the gascolator fitment? I'll use a Steve's A/C unit Steve makes a great unit. You do need to be aware of placement, not only for engine mount clearance but also for floorboard, rudder pedal, and firewall X brace clearance. You will want it to be as low as possible but don't forget the floorboard thickness.


    Hope all this helps a little. Congratulations on the build. You are going to love it (and probably hate it at times) but the end product is well worth it. Next time you talk to Jay ask for the names of other Aussies that have, or are building, Javrons. There are several Javron kits over there.

    Good luck

    Bill
    Very Blessed.
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  7. #7

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    Auto Fuel injection rubber hose is about as good as it get for different fuels . Ethanol,oil resistant
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  8. #8
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    Thanks for the reply Bill, always helpful
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  9. #9
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    Hi Nick, great to hear some more will be arriving down under. I’ll send you a pm soon.

    cheers
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  10. #10

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    EQG did that live at Quirindi. I think I flew that yrs ago

  11. #11
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    I’m not sure, I bought it from a bloke who operated from his private farm about 5k to the north of the Temora aerodrome and he owned it for years. I think it was online near Bankstown decades ago before that.

  12. #12
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    Gear Safety Cables

    Hi everyone.

    What gear safety cables do I need to order for the Javron PA18 wide body with 3" HD taller landing gear?

    I was looking at Atlee's website and noticed they have the 3" taller OR the wide body cables - not both, or are people manufacturing their own for the experimental?

    Thanks again!

    Damian
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  13. #13
    Crash, Jr.'s Avatar
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    PA-12 (w/ PA-18 gear) 3" extended should work for that application. I'm pretty sure they make 4" wide body 3" extended cables for Airframes and Dakota fuselages but you might have to call Atlee on the phone to order them.
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  14. #14
    DJ's Avatar
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    I called Atlee and they made a set of custom cables for the Javron gear as it is slightly narrower than their certified gear. I believe there was a price break on Experimental as well.

    Sent from my SM-G965U1 using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of His hands. Psalms 19:1

  15. #15
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    Damian. I've built 3 early Backcountry Supercubs that were made by Jay and his prototype PA-12. I would opt for the square tip wing with the bigger flaps. It is not too late if you call Jay now and change your order. Slower approach speed and higher rate of climb with almost no noticeable difference in airspeed. If you haven't ordered your engine do it now as there are shortages of cranks. A friend just ordered his from Aerosport Power and he was down to 3 cranks with no idea when he was going to get any more. I also strongly recommend the Catto 84/43 prop for great performance. Also you might want to change to the 12. I love this airplane. A LOT more comfortable than an 18 and I was just talking to Jay this week about using the same aileron control set up as on the 18 to get rid of all the monkey motion of the 12 controls. The 12 weighs the same as the last PA 18 I did and performs exactly the same as both airplanes have the same engine/prop combo.
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  16. #16
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    Can anyone please recommend what fittings to use, for the firewall pass through and elbows to plumb a Steve's Aircraft SA300 Gascolator?

  17. #17
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    Thanks for the advice, but I just love the classic shape of the PA18 and stock round wings. I discovered there is a world shortage of 0-360 Cranks too and the good team at Aerosport Power gave some great options for me to consider. I'm not 100% decided on a prop at the moment, and closely watching the sensenich ground adjustable v whirlwind discussion. I'll have some long distances to fly and I think having the flexibility of a ground adj. prop may better suit my needs. Also the team at Atlee advised the 3344-4W is the part no. for their safety cables, to fit the 4" wide fuse and 3" taller Javron landing gear.
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  18. #18
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Since you are planning some long distance trips, you may like this constant speed prop which originates from your part of the World in New Zealand.
    https://www.propellor.com
    N1PA

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by tackdog View Post
    Thanks for the advice, but I just love the classic shape of the PA18 and stock round wings. I discovered there is a world shortage of 0-360 Cranks too and the good team at Aerosport Power gave some great options for me to consider. I'm not 100% decided on a prop at the moment, and closely watching the sensenich ground adjustable v whirlwind discussion. I'll have some long distances to fly and I think having the flexibility of a ground adj. prop may better suit my needs. Also the team at Atlee advised the 3344-4W is the part no. for their safety cables, to fit the 4" wide fuse and 3" taller Javron landing gear.
    In a previous post I talked about my friend who ordered
    an Aerosport engine a couple months ago because they did have a crank for one. Now he got a call from them and there are no cylinders to be had and they won't get any until July earliest. I don't understand this whole shortage thing going on as it is everything. Mount your gascolator with the intake port facing straight back. Use straight -6 fitting and put a grommet around it. Or mount it with an elbow like in the picture. I have done it both ways. You can also see one of the pass through's. I have around 300 pictures of one of my builds on this link https://geared2survive.com/supercub . For a prop you can't get much better than the Catto 84/44. 105 cruise with 31" and fantastic take off and climb. I have done two with CS props. One O-360 200hp three blade MT9. Cruise 115 but not near the climb performance of the Catto. Another O-320 190hp two blade MT 110mph cruise and again not as much climb as the Catto. I hear good things about the Sensanich and I'd like to get my hands on one to put on one of my airplanes and compare.
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  20. #20
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    Thanks for sharing your link - geared2survive. Your attention to detail with that build is amazing. I served in the RAAF for decades and it was brilliant to see that.
    I've ordered the HD 3" Javron gear with extra cross brace and fuelling steps and will also be running 31" bushwheels. In the interest of making it as easy as possible for older passengers to get in and out of the rear seat, what step is the best option? Long step or the factory stirrup type?

    Looking at photo's the factory rear step looks easier and a little lower - yet it also looks like it could interfere with a bush pod's door? (I ordered a Carbon pod from Randy). Any recommendations?
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  21. #21
    pittsdriver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tackdog View Post
    Thanks for sharing your link - geared2survive. Your attention to detail with that build is amazing. I served in the RAAF for decades and it was brilliant to see that.
    I've ordered the HD 3" Javron gear with extra cross brace and fuelling steps and will also be running 31" bushwheels. In the interest of making it as easy as possible for older passengers to get in and out of the rear seat, what step is the best option? Long step or the factory stirrup type?

    Looking at photo's the factory rear step looks easier and a little lower - yet it also looks like it could interfere with a bush pod's door? (I ordered a Carbon pod from Randy). Any recommendations?
    There is no elegant way to mount a Super Cub. The Javron gear with the brace and steps is the way to go. With this setup the stock step just gets in the way and if you go with a belly pod gets eliminated anyway.
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  22. #22

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    The stock rear step does cause issues with a bush pod. You would have to notch the top of the pod and bend the door as you open it. The long step that most of us use works but it is an issue with older and not so fit crowd. I fly a lot of passengers 20 somethings have no problem when they get to 60 it is definitely harder. I am going to weld on a rear step about 4 inches or so lower than where my current long step sets so it will clear belly pod door and be easier to step onto. This is something to consider closely if you have older passengers a lot. DENNY

  23. #23

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    Does anyone know the wait time for a kit from Javron lately?

  24. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by AndyH View Post
    Does anyone know the wait time for a kit from Javron lately?
    When I ordered mine in December it was 7-8 months, but when I talked to Jay in mid January he said he received quite a few orders after new years and the wait time was up to around 10 months. As for what it is currently I'm not sure.

  25. #25

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    Rc dude, thank you for the heads up! I guess I should order soon!

  26. #26

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    Ordered My Javron Feb. 2021, picked up from Jays in July 2022. Biggest problem Jay had was sourcing tubular steel for the fuselage at the height of the supply chain mess. The quality of the Javron kit continues to amaze me!

    Bill Mahoney
    Sherman, CT
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  27. #27
    cubdriver2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rv6ator View Post
    Ordered My Javron Feb. 2021, picked up from Jays in July 2022. Biggest problem Jay had was sourcing tubular steel for the fuselage at the height of the supply chain mess. The quality of the Javron kit continues to amaze me!

    Bill Mahoney
    Sherman, CT
    It will be great to see you in the J3 and Jake in the Javron flying side by side 😂

    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"
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  28. #28
    Scott A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirthog4 View Post
    Waiting 18 months and counting.
    Hmm, you ordered before rv6ator and are still waiting? Any word? I may have to rethink the deposit I just sent in last week, 1.5 years plus was not discussed.

  29. #29

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    Well worth the wait gentlemen!
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  30. #30

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    Place my order last month, it’s going to be a long year. Look forward to seeing your progress on this site
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  31. #31
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    Hi everyone. We made the huge journey to Airventure the other month and managed to spend some time with Jay at the show, followed by a drive up to Brainerd afterwards for a visit. It was brilliant being able to speak to so many other cub people and the camera sure got a work out. If things go to plan, we should have an aereplane arriving within the next couple of months. I'm about to place another parts order from USA and had a question about the rear seat heater kits that Atlee and Univair stock. If I recall looking at some of the Legend Cubs, they mount the rear heater control box up on the firewall between the boot cowl and the inner kick panel, (keeping it separate from the stock pilots heater box) and the tube sits along near the door sill on the floor. Some of them made a nice shroud / duct for this to keep it out of the way and I'm thinking of the same. (pictures below). If I'm running a Vetterman style exhaust and the heat muffs are already being used for carb heat and the front heater, would you just install a Y piece for this rear heater? I cant tell from the picture, but it looks like the heater pickup in the kit is designed to be clamped to perhaps a factory exhaust or carb heat shroud? Im not sure.....Any advice on this?

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  32. #32
    tackdog's Avatar
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    Oh - I forgot to post some other pictures! It was a mammoth week - spent an tonne of money and wrapped up a great week with a B17 flight.

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    David Pipers Javron - a great piece of work

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    Robbies Javron was just next door

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    Jay trying to educate me on rigging a cub

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    Patriot Cub

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    Awesomeness all round!

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    Jay sure keeps a tidy workshop

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  33. #33
    phdigger123's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tackdog View Post
    Hi everyone. We made the huge journey to Airventure the other month and managed to spend some time with Jay at the show, followed by a drive up to Brainerd afterwards for a visit. It was brilliant being able to speak to so many other cub people and the camera sure got a work out. If things go to plan, we should have an aereplane arriving within the next couple of months. I'm about to place another parts order from USA and had a question about the rear seat heater kits that Atlee and Univair stock. If I recall looking at some of the Legend Cubs, they mount the rear heater control box up on the firewall between the boot cowl and the inner kick panel, (keeping it separate from the stock pilots heater box) and the tube sits along near the door sill on the floor. Some of them made a nice shroud / duct for this to keep it out of the way and I'm thinking of the same. (pictures below). If I'm running a Vetterman style exhaust and the heat muffs are already being used for carb heat and the front heater, would you just install a Y piece for this rear heater? I cant tell from the picture, but it looks like the heater pickup in the kit is designed to be clamped to perhaps a factory exhaust or carb heat shroud? Im not sure.....Any advice on this?

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    The Vetterman exhaust system comes with 3 heat muffs. 2 for cabin heat and one for carb heat.

    Regards,
    Mike

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