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Thread: Legal rear seat options

  1. #1

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    Legal rear seat options

    Looking at replacing the rear seat of the Super Cub and am wondering if the only legal alternative to the old rear seat would be the Atlee Safari Seat? The Safari seat seams fine, but I wonder if you could simply replace the springs with plywood or a sheet of aluminum? I have seen pictures of experimental cubs with that sort of setup, but wonder if you could do it on a certified cub.

  2. #2
    wireweinie's Avatar
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    It's legal. Replacing the springs with aluminum or plywood does not alter the structure of the aircraft. Don't cut or weld on structural items and it remains a minor modification, which means log entry only.

    Web
    Life's tough . . . wear a cup.

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    Good to know! If anybody has done this, is there a recommended thickness of aluminum/plywood?

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    wireweinie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanP View Post
    Good to know! If anybody has done this, is there a recommended thickness of aluminum/plywood?
    How much do you weigh, lol.

    I like aluminum, You can use thinner material and rivet angles to the bottom side to stiffen it up. Start with .063 or .071.

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    Life's tough . . . wear a cup.

  5. #5
    55-PA18A's Avatar
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    Mine came with a plywood seat when I bought it. Replaced that with the same plywood I used when I replaced the floor boards and floor of baggage area.

    What are you doing for the seat back? Mine had the tube frame with wire springs. I removed the wire and wrapped the frame with Ceconite, then replaced the padded cover. Made a considerable difference in weight.

    Jim

  6. #6

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    That is an interesting idea for the seat back. The goal is twofold: (1) make it so passengers can get in and out a little easier (I am fairly flexible and it is still hard to climb out of); and (2) to drop weight if possible. Wrapping in ceconite (or something similar) and then covering with a pad seems like a simple, easy fix. Out of curiousity, do you know offhand the plywood thickness? Leaning toward aluminum, but plywood would obviously be the easiest solution.

  7. #7
    mvivion's Avatar
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    I wrapped the front seat back in Poly Fiber as described above. Worked really well, and supports your back a LOT better than those stupid springs ever did.

    MTV
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  8. #8
    Charlie Longley's Avatar
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    I’ve done most of my seats with heavy polyfiber or ceconite.
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  9. #9
    KJC's Avatar
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    Here what I’m doing to the one I currently have in the shop......

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The under seat tool box is from Javron. Minor modification and is removable and not permanently attached to the airframe. The lid is .063 with 90 degree reinforcements. The back is similar to a Carbon Concepts back except .063 2024T3. The back is hinged to fold down and clear the rear stick cover. Also it’s moved back 2 inches for more rear seat leg room.
    PA-12 N418BS
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    Used .050” aluminum and required a hat section stiffener on the seat bottom to stop flexing.
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  11. #11

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    KJC and Lite Cub, both those setups look really nice. That gives me some ideas. The existing setup in our plane is from 1950 and, because of the sag, its hard to stand up out of. I appreciate the feedback!
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  12. #12

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    The rear seat is not structural. An IA can approve something as a minor alteration if it meets the required criteria. Here the third seat is installed. The second seat is narrow to allow the third seat passengers legs to go along side the second passenger. The seat back can be removed and stored in the under seat storage compartment or moved to one side to allow the passenger to sit close to the right side and a bike can be carried next to the passenger extending into the extended baggage. The removable cross bar goes through the bike frame. Click image for larger version. 

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    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by reliableflyer; 02-07-2021 at 04:09 PM.
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  13. #13
    TurboBeaver's Avatar
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    Before a third seat was rocket science, just about every Cub used for guiding in Alaska had a G.I. pack board for rear seat back. The assistant guides sat on the floor, or boat cushion at best;in the baggage with his legs laying beside the "sports" hips, in rear seat. A Piper seat back, was about unknown in Alaskan Cubs, in those days. Today when I see Cubs with no removable crossbar and the seat back bolted in, it is very obvious these folks never haul much of anything in their Cubs.

    Telling them about hauling your wheel skis
    In the back or hauling fuel in a drum, seams like a total impossibility for them.Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by TurboBeaver; 02-12-2021 at 10:50 AM.
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  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by TurboBeaver View Post
    Before a third seat was rocket science, just about every Cub used for guiding in Alaska had a G.I. pack board for rear seat back. The assistant guides sat on the floor, or boat cushion at best;in the baggage with his legs laying beside the "sports" hips, in rear seat. A Piper seat back, was about unknown in Alaskan Cubs, in those days. Today when I see Cubs with no removable crossbar and the seat back bolted in, it is very obvious these folks never haul much of anything in their Cubs.
    Telling them about hauling your wheel skis
    In the back or hauling fuel in a drum, seams like a total impossibility for them.Click image for larger version. 

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    I remember those pack boards. In my 12 which I had for 43 years I used to haul two bikes and a passenger. I built a very strong stick cover to cover my bobed stick and would haul heavy outboards with the power head on the stick cover against the back of the front seat and the lower unit in the baggage. With an extended baggage in a cub if you block up to keep from interfering with your aft right rudder you can haul 8 foot 2 by 6’s. You’ll have to climb over them if you take a number of them. If you have an open top on your extended baggage you can haul 8 foot lumber or long kayak paddles over your shoulder tied to the X bracing above your head.
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  15. #15
    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurboBeaver View Post
    Before a third seat was rocket science, just about every Cub used for guiding in Alaska had a G.I. pack board for rear seat back. The assistant guides sat on the floor, or boat cushion at best;in the baggage with his legs laying beside the "sports" hips, in rear seat. A Piper seat back, was about unknown in Alaskan Cubs, in those days. Today when I see Cubs with no removable crossbar and the seat back bolted in, it is very obvious these folks never haul much of anything in their Cubs.
    Telling them about hauling your wheel skis
    In the back or hauling fuel in a drum, seams like a total impossibility for them.Click image for larger version. 

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    With the big baggage door I can get a 3” extended gear leg through. It’s pretty handy


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  16. #16
    TurboBeaver's Avatar
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    Here is a standard load when we were setting up camps. 16 of 2x6" 8 per side,
    16 of 2x4" 8 per side. Of course the inside
    Was "loaded" as well!
    This is circa 1981 behind Valhalla Lodge in
    Non Dalton. The hunter helping me load was Jack Jonas of Jonas Bros Taxidermy
    in Denver.Click image for larger version. 

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  17. #17
    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
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    Guess a pair of snowshoes don’t make much of a difference on the struts haha


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  18. #18
    TurboBeaver's Avatar
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    Here is the GI packboard in place in my Cub. Rear passenger should be under 5/6" and 150 lbs, for extended flights. But I used to fly guides 6'/180 lbs on short trips, it's very uncomfortable for them because they will need to bend their head at quite an angle, as it will right against the headliner. If it ment staying behind they will always hop in! It saved us hundreds of "Extra" trips and thousands of gals of fuel over the years. Plus you always have a "pack with you" . It comes in darn handy to pack , gas, water, duffle bags full of anything. Of course meat if you have game down. I have used the GI packboard lots of times to carry , extra gear legs, and or propellers to someone who had wrecked, But I felt; there was a much better ( safer) place to land 1/4 mile away.
    EClick image for larger version. 

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  19. #19
    algonquin's Avatar
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    Stu your new cub is way too pretty to stuff oily, nasty boat parts in,lol. We will have to use my beater Husky.

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by algonquin View Post
    Stu your new cub is way too pretty to stuff oily, nasty boat parts in,lol. We will have to use my beater Husky.
    Tom my days of using my planes to haul lumber, cement, cases of canned goods and outboards are only distant memories, fond ones but long past.
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  21. #21
    WhiskeyMike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvivion View Post
    I wrapped the front seat back in Poly Fiber as described above. Worked really well, and supports your back a LOT better than those stupid springs ever did.

    MTV
    "those stupid springs." You can say that again! Like being on a trampoline. Ceconite works very well. A well made and well secured aluminum pan might save you some bodily damage from downward G force.
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  22. #22
    WhiskeyMike's Avatar
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    Once upon a time, aerial banners were folded and wrapped up and carried on 12 ft. aluminum poles along the side of the fuselage form the handhold and through the footstep. Much care was need to ensure that the cloth didn't unravel and become a parachute or blanket the tail. Letter banners were carried on the wing struts like this lumber - sort of like rockets. I wouldn't want to try it today. My dad always tied banners on the catwalk of his Stearman. Worked great, but once tried it on a Cessna Agwagon, which did NOT fly well (really unwell) with anything on the catwalk. Yikes. Ya' just can't beat a Cub. Often imitated, never duplicated.
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  23. #23
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    Here is what it looks like with a load of "freight".Click image for larger version. 

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    Actually precious cargo!

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    Last edited by TurboBeaver; 02-14-2021 at 09:16 AM.

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