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Bush Pilot’s Survival Kit

Perhaps some day you Remlin lever gun guys might graduate to a real lever gun in 500 S&W instead. How about a Big Horn Armory Model 89 with 7+1 of 50 cal. Medicine. Out of a rifle the 500 S&W is quite a performer. Big Horn Armory initially tried to marry the Marlin 1895 action to the 500 S&W and found the action couldn't take the pressure so they had to build one from scratch. FB_IMG_1603425524733.jpg
 

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N3243A said:
Big Horn Armory initially tried to marry the Marlin 1895 action to the 500 S&W and found the action couldn't take the pressure so they had to build one from scratch.
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Sounds like a good story but they actually just copied the Winchester 1886. The side plate behind the loading gate is a dead giveaway as is the vertical locking bars at the rear of the action.

They are good guns though no doubt about it.
 
Not a story. At the very first design trials they tried modifying an 1895 action in order to keep a flat top receiver. It couldn't handle the 65,000 cup of the 500 S&W. So yes they modeled their new design after the Winchester design. Their gun is ultimately a blend of the Winchester model 92 and 86... hence the model 89 and made from 17-4 stainless.
 
N3243A said:
Not a story. At the very first design trials they tried modifying an 1895 action in order to keep a flat top receiver. It couldn't handle the 65,000 cup of the 500 S&W. So yes they modeled their new design after the Winchester design. Their gun is ultimately a blend of the Winchester model 92 and 86... hence the model 89 and made from 17-4 stainless.
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Soft shooting tame recoil for sure :lol:

I speak from a bit of experience as I had a .378 Weatherby Mag for a long time, most of my friend who did shoot it only did it one.
 
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I took this picture last week. This is a Ruger American compact .22 WMR. It isn’t Bear protection but I wouldn’t hesitate to head-shoot a deer or an elk with it at bow range. And a box of 50 rounds is light and compact as is the rifle.
 

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Philly5G said:
On the one hand, lucky that the sling hadn’t been fitted, but if the bear was planning on carrying on running, like in the story above, seems very sad for the bear

#GuessWe’llNeverKnow


Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org mobile app
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Had the bear intended to escape, it would have gone a direction other than towards the people. Bears that come into people have intent, (unless in a fully crowded situation which it is surrounded). So a bear charging through a group is intending to put all of the people down before it begins chewing...

Also, bears will almost always give you the chance to back out. One that sees and charges has intent. They will often hold up at 10' or so, but not always. I like to put a shot in front of them and spray with gravel to give them more encouragement to turn. I have also been squeezing the trigger as they crossed the 30' line.

I never feel sorry for a bear that has attacked people. But my survival us generally not depended on killing a bear, but keeping warm and eating.
 
hotrod180 said:
Kills at one end, hurts at the other.
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Accurate comment at least in the beginning. It was Bitch to sight in on the bench, but standing offhand it was not a problem. BUT if you were inclined to flinch it would help you out. It was crazy accurate with 300 gr. bullets at 3000 fps which is a lot of energy, it would hold 1/2 minute of angle 5 shot groups. It was purchased for a Cape Buffalo hunt, I ended up hunting the buff with a bow though. I shot two Impala with it when we were bait hunting getting ready for a Leopard hunt. That .378 made mincemeat of Impala. Sadly never got the bow shot at the Leopard.
 
aktango58 said:
Had the bear intended to escape, it would have gone a direction other than towards the people. Bears that come into people have intent, (unless in a fully crowded situation which it is surrounded). So a bear charging through a group is intending to put all of the people down before it begins chewing...
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Not really, I disagree. You have to keep in mind that when we're in bear country, we often are traveling on a BEAR trail. I've had bears run past me in Kodiak because I was on a trail. Try to claw your way through alders, Pushki, and devil's club there sometime. And, if the bear was headed that direction initially, often they'll just continue on. Doesn't NECESSARILY imply intent to do harm.

But, they could. The cases I've been involved in, the bear just hauled ass past us and kept going. Couldn't see them or even hear them till it was way too late to get a gun in position. Biggest problem was getting back to a cabin for fresh undies.....

Overhanging alders on bear trails make "hiking" there an interesting ritual, and a rifle makes it more challenging.

MTV
 
mvivion said:
Not really, I disagree. You have to keep in mind that when we're in bear country, we often are traveling on a BEAR trail. I've had bears run past me in Kodiak because I was on a trail. Try to claw your way through alders, Pushki, and devil's club there sometime. And, if the bear was headed that direction initially, often they'll just continue on. Doesn't NECESSARILY imply intent to do harm.

But, they could. The cases I've been involved in, the bear just hauled ass past us and kept going. Couldn't see them or even hear them till it was way too late to get a gun in position. Biggest problem was getting back to a cabin for fresh undies.....

Overhanging alders on bear trails make "hiking" there an interesting ritual, and a rifle makes it more challenging.

MTV
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Glad it worked out for you Mike, but I have a number of friends in the last few years that the scars to prove the bear intended harm; one went off a 50' cliff in front of his wife with the bear attached to him by the teeth, one was being shaken like a rag when the father's rounds finally scared the bear off. Neither situation was a sow/cub situation, both were bears being aggressive. There are more, but I don't want to belabor the point.

378 Weatherby- my rifle coach had one. First shot he said was the only time he ever got 'scoped' from a rifle. Second shot he said hurt, third shot he caught the scope as it was flying over his shoulder after the shot. Sheared the mounting screws. He had the gunsmith over size the next set of screws.

My good friend shoots a 300 Weatherby. I shot it once, that was enough. A powerhouse for sure, to the game and your shoulder. I can put a bullet where I need with my 06. Accuracy for me is better than volume of lead. Good bullets also.

Isn't it great we have so many choices!! Heck, I even have a case of 556 waiting for me at the store to pick up tomorrow... 1,000 rounds. Who wants to go shooting?
 
I had a Whelend .35 Imp 40 years ago. I bought it used and it came with 5 boxes of ammo. I was puzzled because there were only 3 spent cartridges. 3 of us shot it one day and when I sold it a few years later with 5 boxes of ammo it only had 6 spent rounds. I would bet that there are at least 4 full boxes left today

Glenn
 
aktango58 said:
Glad it worked out for you Mike, but I have a number of friends in the last few years that the scars to prove the bear intended harm; one went off a 50' cliff in front of his wife with the bear attached to him by the teeth, one was being shaken like a rag when the father's rounds finally scared the bear off. Neither situation was a sow/cub situation, both were bears being aggressive. There are more, but I don't want to belabor the point.

378 Weatherby- my rifle coach had one. First shot he said was the only time he ever got 'scoped' from a rifle. Second shot he said hurt, third shot he caught the scope as it was flying over his shoulder after the shot. Sheared the mounting screws. He had the gunsmith over size the next set of screws.

My good friend shoots a 300 Weatherby. I shot it once, that was enough. A powerhouse for sure, to the game and your shoulder. I can put a bullet where I need with my 06. Accuracy for me is better than volume of lead. Good bullets also.

Isn't it great we have so many choices!! Heck, I even have a case of 556 waiting for me at the store to pick up tomorrow... 1,000 rounds. Who wants to go shooting?
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Well hell, you may as well shoot a 270!

I love my 300 Wby. Plenty of punch with acceptable recoil.... until you make the gun too light. And then it only hurts on the range. You never feel it in real conditions. I love love love my Wby Ultra Lightweight in 270 Remington. Rifles are like planes. Guys spend crazy money to reduce weight. A stock Weatherby ULW is a great gun for a good price.

My 2021 survival rifle is an AR-10! I’m more worried about people than animals!
 
Used to be a cleaver gunsmith in Anchorage named Will Fowler ( machinist for Alaska Railroad) . Lots of guides used him to cut down rifles to Carbine lengths. He converted many dozens of pre 64 model 70 Winchester'sThat were in 30/06 into the hard hitting 35 Whelen. He simply bored out the original barrels to 35 caliber and used his ancient P&W rifling machine to hand cut the groves! Over the years I was around numerous guides that used them as backup guns on bear and it works fantastic!With stout handloads it's within 100fps of my .338 WM with 250gr bullets. Wicked caliber.....
 
I used to live up the street from Norman Brown, who mede the Brown and Whelen. Nice guy. My neighbor, a disciple of Brownie’s, came up with a 375-06. That was the most unimpressive gun I’ve ever seen.
 
The other issue with the .444 was proper factory bullets weren't initially available. They'd fragment quickly as they used common handgun bullets initially. Later speciality loaders like Cor-Bon, Garrett, Buffalo Bore, Underwood either reinforced the bullet or made it solid. Factory loads also improved. I was quite the compact carbine to carry.

Gary
 
@aktango58 and @stewartb

The .300 Weatherby Mag was my all-round rifle, I put a KDF recoil reducer on it and it felt like a soft .270 but had all the benefits of a 180gr. going 3000fps. My .300 was a Remington chambered in .300 WBY MAG in a synthetic stock. The last hunt it went on was in 1994 on a Dall Sheep hunt in the Alaska range. I was glad to have the light synthetic stock attached to my 80# backpack for 10 day hunt on that nightmarish climb in AND out.

Win-Win

Edited to add:
Day off work here (Nairobi) and I am tying flies looking out over HKNW watching Caravans come and go as well as student pilots coming in too fast and ballooning and bouncing :-? Besides loving being around airports, it is not a glamorous view.
 

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TurboBeaver said:
Used to be a cleaver gunsmith in Anchorage named Will Fowler ( machinist for Alaska Railroad) . Lots of guides used him to cut down rifles to Carbine lengths. He converted many dozens of pre 64 model 70 Winchester'sThat were in 30/06 into the hard hitting 35 Whelen. He simply bored out the original barrels to 35 caliber and used his ancient P&W rifling machine to hand cut the groves! Over the years I was around numerous guides that used them as backup guns on bear and it works fantastic!With stout handloads it's within 100fps of my .338 WM with 250gr bullets. Wicked caliber.....
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"Reboring" used to be a pretty common practice, back in the day--
maybe because labor was cheaper then?
About 25 years ago, I had a Model 70 carbine rebored from 223 to 250-300 Ackley -- shot great.
The magazine mod wasn't done too well though, that & the minimum-taper case made for fussy feeding.

I've always thought that a "338 Whelen" (30-06 necked up to 338) would be a good caliber-
lots of good .338" bullets available.
I haven't followed new cartridge development in quite a while, so maybe one of the factories is making those now.

Speaking of "new cartridges", it's very interesting to read PO Ackley's "Handbook for Shooters & Reloaders" circa 1962.
Alot of the "new" factory cartridges marketed since the 1960's were first developed years & years ago as wildcats.
 
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You mean Ruglin?
Glad this happened. Whatever one’s thoughts on Bill Ruger’s commentary re: magazine sizes, they’d likely agree that Ruger continues to make fine firearms for decent prices.

https://www.alloutdoor.com/2020/09/30/long-live-lever-gun/

N3243A said:
Perhaps some day you Remlin lever gun guys might graduate to a real lever gun in 500 S&W instead. How about a Big Horn Armory Model 89 with 7+1 of 50 cal. Medicine. Out of a rifle the 500 S&W is quite a performer. Big Horn Armory initially tried to marry the Marlin 1895 action to the 500 S&W and found the action couldn't take the pressure so they had to build one from scratch. View attachment 54858
Click to expand...
 
That's a fact. Ruger has long been a pretty incredible maker of guns of the neatest designs at a reasonable price. After all who else would make a miniature garand action 223 or a falling block big bore rifle still these days? I'm sure glad they bought Marlin. Hopefully Marlin's name will mean a quality build again.
 
Well friends! Survivalgear does not contain only camping gear. What is you are going down land safe on a gravel or something else and need only a srew, a peace of wire or else. Had that kind of occasion not only once. And I was happy not only having a nice camp but also could repair and fly out my cub safe
 
Crash said:
It's true! Me and my brother talk all the time and to no end about "woods guns" or what to carry with us when flying ect...but that's all the fantasy of gun guys looking for a reason to buy another gun. It's the same as a "truck gun" "end of the world gun" or "zombie guns". Just another niche to buy a gun for and leave it in the safe.

Most trips afield are done with either a Ruger Single Six for ptarmigan that might stray into the trail or a Super Blackhawk 44mag if it's the right season for bears to be wandering around. As far as survival, the Single Six 22lr lives in the plane with a couple hundred rounds because that's what's going to put food on the table.

The reality of a survival situation is being able to feed yourself for a while on small game which the 22lr is great at. You can pack a ton of ammo and shoot grouse/ptarmigan/rabbits. If you not only crash but then are set upon by a gang of angry bears then I would think that luck is just not on your side and no amount of hot lead is going to bail you out.
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3 weeks to starve to death; 3 days to die from thirst and about 3 hours to freeze to death. I know what my priority is for survival equipment! (But I do keep a 2-piece Ruger 10-22 and couple hundred rounds of .22LR in back of plane for just the reasons you’ve specified)
 
I have the Alaskan take down rifles in both 44 and 357. I bought the 44 for a single caliber thing. I had so much fun shooting pistol cartridges I bought the 357 for my dad.
 
JohnnyR said:
3 weeks to starve to death; 3 days to die from thirst and about 3 hours to freeze to death. I know what my priority is for survival equipment! (But I do keep a 2-piece Ruger 10-22 and couple hundred rounds of .22LR in back of plane for just the reasons you’ve specified)
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Yep, read “Hey I’m Alive” by Helen Klaben. No guns, no food, and they survived a couple months in the Yukon.....in winter.

MTV
 
I’m surprised no mention of Thompson Encore as a survival firearm.
It can be configured in a variety of calibers, compact and versatile.
Pistol grip configuration with an iron site 44 mag barrel. Can be quickly swapped out for a 14” EER scoped .243 barrel for long range work.
 
Nice gun but too limited of utility. If you need a 44 then you also need decently quick follow up shots as well and the single shot doesn't do that. If you need to harvest game then a .22 is the choice in a survival sense so a Contender or better yet a small revolver is better there.

Don't get me wrong, I love the Contender (and the Encore too I guess) but a dedicated gun or two that really excel at what they do are better than a dedicated hunting handgun. A 44 revolver and a 22 revolver cover the bases while weighing about the same as an Encore with a spare barrel and scope.
 
Crash said:
7.62x39 is equivalent to 30-30
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True with .30 Carbine not far behind... I mention this because the "Carbine" is not seen by the general public as an "evil black gun." Grandpappy carried one during THE WAR.

Crash said:
don't know but I would assume 123gr steel core armor penetrating bullets make a convincing argument against large angry animals.
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Think about the mission. Steel core is a military round designed to penetrate Kevlar and the like. What you want when you are facing a big bear or such is to leave every bit of the kenetic energy in the target. Hornady makes nice bullets for x39. They offer complete cartridges for those who don't roll their own. Ain't cheap but what do you need? Maybe one box or two. Even .223 Gold Dots leave all their considerable energy behind, while X193 might (it will shred if traveling fast enough that forces overcome band tension) and M855 will just blow right through.

If you want an unpopular choice, try 5.45x39. Ballisticaly at high velocity those hollow noses have a lot going for them.
 
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