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180/182/185 trim wheel options

hotrod180

hotrod180

FRIEND
Port Townsend, WA
I've been reading lately about trim wheel fixes for the 180/182/185 series-
specifically to eliminate play where the sprocket pins to the trim wheel shaft.
The most elegant fix is to install an STC'd QMI trim wheel

Solutions | QMI, Inc. | United States (cessnarepairs.com)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QN1YeUbd4GI

Another option was recently discussed on the backcountrypilot site & involves modifying the trim wheel assembly
by making a spacer & riveting all the way through the wheel, spacer, & sprocket.
In essence, this is the same configuration as the QMI trim wheel and the later model Cessna trim wheels,

FS: Cessna 180/185 pitch trim wheel bushings - Backcountry Pilot

Or of course, you can repair the stock set-up by just replacing parts as required.
There was a post on the 180/185 FB page about this

Cessna 180/185 (facebook.com)

which included this video.

Cessna 185 Trim Wheel Pin Repair - YouTube

I thought I'd post these links here because I think there's some good information on them,
and everybody here may not also on BCP or FB.
 
I always made a spacer and rivet through wheel.... simple, just make sure spacer is smaller near sprocket so chain clears...
 
The trim wheel is Bakelite correct? So my whole issue would be the legality of it all. He copied Bill Duncan's parts and installed them on the original trim wheel instead of an aluminum one. Curious how the rivets hold over time and it it will elongate the holes in the original trim wheel, I would bet it swelled the Bakelite up around them. The legality of it and the selling of parts might bite him in the ass.
 
Steve Pierce said:
The trim wheel is Bakelite correct? So my whole issue would be the legality of it all. He copied Bill Duncan's parts and installed them on the original trim wheel instead of an aluminum one. Curious how the rivets hold over time and it it will elongate the holes in the original trim wheel, I would bet it swelled the Bakelite up around them. The legality of it and the selling of parts might bite him in the ass.
Click to expand...

Actually, the stock bakelite trim wheel already has an aluminum "hub" riveted to it,
the hub is in turn pinned to the shaft.
So this mod would just have all three (hub, trim wheel, & sprocket) riveted together.
I'm told that the later model Cessna trim wheels are through-riveted like this.
It could be that he copied that design.
The only mention of the similarity to the QMI trim wheel was mine.

I can't see how making & selling parts could be an issue,
if they are not represented as approved parts or an approved mod.
The buyer is responsible for what he does with them.
Maybe this mod could be signed off as a "repair"? Or not.
 
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I've been thinking about this trim wheel business since reading these two discussions,
as my trim wheel has a bit of play in it, so I tore into it yesterday.
I figured the play would be where the sprocket pins to the shaft...nope.
It was where the trim wheel hub pins to the shaft.
BTW a tiny bit of play there results in a noticeable amount of play at the wheel itself.

It turns out that the hub was pinned in place using a solid pin,
rather than the correct 3/32" roll pin.
I cleaned everything up, tapped out the solid pin & tapped in a new roll pin, and reassembled.
Works great now, no play in the wheel.
I also took the opportunity to run safety wire through the two roll pins,
as suggested by some people in the discussion,
to prevent them ever working their way out.

Total expenditures: 25 cents for a new roll pin,
and a couple hours of (enjoyable) tinkering in the hangar when it was too crappy out to do any flying.
 
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Yea, glad that went easy for you.

However, the problem with the original set up is not only does the roll pin 'work' itself out, they also will break, rendering the entire system useless. (Don't ask How I know this).

So in reality, you have it repaired for now, but at some point in your travels you will reach down and spin that wheel only to find that though the wheel is spinning, but the stabilator is not moving.

This seems about every 500 hours, sometimes less depending on the flying. So the number of repairs you end up doing will be greatly reduced when you bite the bullet and get Bushwheel Bill's setup and install it.

My experience
 
hotrod180 said:
..
Total expenditures: 25 cents for a new roll pin, ..
Click to expand...

Obviously you used BOGUS parts if the roll pin was only 25 cents :) .... but i probably have a bag full of the real Cessna ones, if i didn't already give them away??(bought from Ying Ling in the late 80's or very early 90's..)
 
Trim wheel rolled pins....first time they sheared or fell out I was near Alaska's Pt. Barrow (now Utqiagvik) on floats. Hauling some loads and lots of T/O's into small lakes. I needed them but none available. We found an old wooden fuel box with small box nails on the shore and....got the wheel back until I could get parts after a couple of weeks. Next time the A&P wired in the hollow pins.

Gary
 
hotrod180 said:
.....
rather than the correct 3/32" roll pin.
I cleaned everything up, tapped out the solid pin & tapped in a new roll pin, and reassembled.

I also took the opportunity to run safety wire through the two roll pins,
as suggested by some people in the discussion,
to prevent them ever working their way out.
Click to expand...
THAT SAFETY WIRE IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT !

If you ever had the roll pin fall out accompanied by the trim spinning to full nose up RIGHT NOW At cruise speed ! You will know what I mean. A nearby landing spot becomes very important.
 
Grant said:
far 21.9
Click to expand...

The parts being made are not "aircraft parts".
The buyer is the one who decides to use them as such.
Is the hardware store busting the regs when somebody buys hardware grade nuts & bolts & uses them on his airplane?
 
mike mcs repair said:
Obviously you used BOGUS parts if the roll pin was only 25 cents :) .......
Click to expand...

That was a guess at the roll pin price, I got one from my mechanic for free.

Man, this is a tough crowd.
I decided to post about this because I thought some other 180/182/185 guys might (like me) find it interesting & useful.
If I'd known people were gonna rip into me about it, I'd wouldn't have bothered.
No good deed goes unpunished I guess.
 
Don't take it as a rip. There are serious concerns when you make and sell parts to install on an airplane. Lawyers, FAA etc. Sure he has an argument that he is selling pieces but it is all out there on the world wide web and it is a control system that makes it even more serious in the eyes of the Feds. I have no doubt that he has made nice parts and is well intended. I also know what it takes t get stuff like that approved and what it feels like to sit across the table from the FAA, the Justice Department attorneys and a widows attorney. Just the way I think since the experience.

I did look at mine and from the appearance of the interior fabric over the screws does not look like it has been apart. It does have the three rivets like you described and mine has a solid pin that is staked in place on either side.
 
Solid pin here, too in my '58. If you look at your IPC, they call out 0761205-3, which supersedes to the hollow NAS561 roll pin. I agree with the fat, tired pilots youtube video - if the part was good for 60+ years, why not just replace the worn bits with the McFarlane PMA parts? Plus, I really don't like the look of the Bush Bill trim wheel (nor the cost).
 
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