ADSB Tail Beacon Mounting Issues

fhu667 said:

Orientation is as it would be on the tail.

The weather didn't cooperate yesterday, so I'll report back as soon as I have some information.

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Have you had a chance to fly and get a report on how this installation worked? Hope it worked out. This is a great idea for installation.

I know it's been a while, but I've run into an issue. I can't get the Tailbeacon to see my transponder. I haven't entered all of the information into the database yet to pull their report, but I do see my flights on Flight Aware. I don't know for a fact that my transponder is working correctly, and I probably should verify that first. I read an explanation somewhere about how the Tailbeacon sees the transponder's code through the electrical system. I'm a little skeptical about how that works, but if that's the case mounting it where I did shouldn't be part of the problem I wouldn't think.

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From the uAvionix website:
"The tailBeacon works with any existing transponder. uAvionix’s patented power transcoder technology seamlessly communicates with your existing legacy transponder over your aircraft’s electrical system."
Sounds like BS to me--
kinda like the gizmo they used to sell on late-night TV ads that turned all the wiring in your house into a super-duper TV antenna.
I think the tailbeacon must grab your txp signal out of the air.

Re your problem: the Tailbeacon will not see your txp until the txp sends out a reply to being interrogated.
If it is not where an ATC radar can hit it, your tailbeacon won't see it.
Turn everything on, including your set-up app, then turn the txp switch to "test".
I always thought that just tests the reply light,
but apparently it also sends out a ping.
The txp code on the app should change from blank to 1200.

It's pretty easy to see just what it's sending to ATC (or whoever monitors these things),
just fill out a PAPR request.

https://adsbperformance.faa.gov/paprrequest.aspx

i like the part of finishing the bottle of wine, I would have done that procedure first to allow me to control my nerves with that hole saw!:roll:

A dremel and 3 hours and a variety of tools, mainly a drum sander, round hand file . Takes time, I also hand filed the unit just a bit for a perfect tight fit. Be sure to run a ground all the way back to the power source. It isn't a perfect match for sure. Remember that it must go in at about a 10 o'clock position then turned clockwise (I think) so check this fit before you complete the install.

fhu667 said:

I know it's been a while, but I've run into an issue. I can't get the Tailbeacon to see my transponder. I haven't entered all of the information into the database yet to pull their report, but I do see my flights on Flight Aware. I don't know for a fact that my transponder is working correctly, and I probably should verify that first. I read an explanation somewhere about how the Tailbeacon sees the transponder's code through the electrical system. I'm a little skeptical about how that works, but if that's the case mounting it where I did shouldn't be part of the problem I wouldn't think.

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To verify the transponder, ask ATC. They should see your code ( i.e 1200 or whatever you are set for) and your pressure altitude. No code or wrong code is a transponder malfunction. No pressure altitude or wrong altitude is an encoder problem.

If the transponder is operating properly, check your 'Monitor' page. What info is it showing? Also, is the red LED on the beacon on steady or blinking?

Web

Instructions suggest that to “validate” your installation, you should fly it in “rule airspace” for about an hour, then request a PAPR. I don’t know whether the unit must be “validated” to be legal, though. I tried to validate mine just outside Charlie A/S, and it didn’t work. Climbed to 11,000 and drove around for 45 minutes, and voila! No idea if that was actually “required”.

But, be advised, the FAA IS monitoring these things. I got the dreaded call, twice.

MTV

Also. be advised that uAvionix has issued a service bulletin on the Tailbeacon & Skybeacon, to update the software to the 1.5.1version. The app can tell you which software version is currently in it.

I can't do the PAPR report yet. However I expect that it's going to tell me it doesn't see the transponder since the Tailbeacon doesn't see it.

I don't have a red light on the beacon. In the Tailbeacon software it just says it can't see the transponder code. I was going to contact approach yesterday, but they were really busy with all the traffic into DFW.

My transponder does a test when powering up, and it doesn't throw any errors. Also, I can see it replying to queries on the indicator. I just don't know if it is actually transmitting.

I know the ADSB is working since I can see it on Flight Aware, but I realize there are some thresholds that it must pass that I can't see on Flight Aware.

My next day off is Thursday. If the weather is good enough I'll give it another shot.

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hotrod180 said:

Also. be advised that uAvionix has issued a service bulletin on the Tailbeacon & Skybeacon, to update the software to the 1.5.1version. The app can tell you which software version is currently in it.

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Thanks for the info. I'll be sure and check that.

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If you turn off the power to the Tailbeacon you should get a normal transponder out signal. If ATC verifies that, you'll know that the transponder is working. If you don't troubleshoot this, you'll just be guessing.

And Flightaware can track with just a transponder not just with ADS-B.

Web

wireweinie said:

If you turn off the power to the Tailbeacon you should get a normal transponder out signal. If ATC verifies that, you'll know that the transponder is working. If you don't troubleshoot this, you'll just be guessing.

And Flightaware can track with just a transponder not just with ADS-B.

Web

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I didn't think about that. I'll be sure and not turn on the ADSB when I test it out.

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fhu667 said:

I can't do the PAPR report yet......I don't have a red light on the beacon. ....I know the ADSB is working since I can see it on Flight Aware....

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1) curious why you "can't do the PAPR report yet"? You don't need to fly in rule airspace, or for any specific length of time.
A quick 15 minute flight should work, if you're in an area of good adsb coverage.
And I wouldn't worry about raising any FAA red flags by doing a PAPR--
if your ADSB output is not up to snuff, that's already raising it's own red flag.

2) The Tailbeacon has a red "pilot light" on the RH side, it should blink when you first turn it on, read the Tailbeacon paperwork.
FWIW there are about 4 different paperwork items you should read:
there's a flight manual supplement, an installation manual, a user's manual, & a user and installation guide.
I wish they'd just put all that BS into one file, but it is what it is.
FWIW there's also a service bulletin to update the software to version 1.5.1, I believe it has to do with improving the GPS performance.

3) I don't know about Flight Aware, but Flight Radar 24 doesn't track 978 UAT ADS-B devices-- only 1090's.

wireweinie said:

And Flightaware can track with just a transponder not just with ADS-B.

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I have never seen any of my flights on Flightaware before I installed ADS-B, so that may be a sign that the transponder is not working. However, I'll be sure and ask ATC with the ADS-B off to see if they can see me.

If you read Flightaware's info, they say they can track a transponder only equipped aircraft with a system they call 'MLAT'.

Web

I just checked flightaware for my own flights-
it sez " this aircraft is not available for public tracking per owner's request".
I don't actually remember doing it, but apparently I opted out of tracking a few years back.

P


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wireweinie said:

If you read Flightaware's info, they say they can track a transponder only equipped aircraft with a system they call 'MLAT'.

Web

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• Flight Aware supports both ADS-B and MLAT.
• MLAT is a technique to find non-ADSB aircraft by triangulating mode-S transponders. https://flightaware.com/adsb/mlat/
• The ADS-B receivers that Flightaware sells receive 1090 Flightaware ADS-B and MLAT signals, but not 978MHz UAT signals. uAvionix Tailbeacon is 978MHz.
• Users/feeders can roll their own receivers that support both 1090 and 978MHz - some of these will see uAvionix.
• Flightaware also receives some ATC data, but it is kinda murky what they get.

The net of all this is that Flightaware is not a good way to check uAvionix Tailbeacon or Skybeacon installations. In my local area outside of Boise class C airspace, it works for me at altitudes above 6000', but not reliably below that.

Getting back to fhu667's question:
You can check if your uAvionix unit is receiving the transponder by opening the Skybeacon app on your phone - it will provide the status once it receives the transponder info. You must have already installed the Skybeacon app to program the unit with your N number, etc. Be patient. You have to wait long enough for the encoder to heat up and provide altitude, which can range from a few minutes to 20 minutes depending on the installation and temperature. This worked for me on the ground, in my hangar; YMMV.

To check if your overall ADS-B out system is working, spend some time flying in range (distance, altitude) of ADS-B ground stations, then get a PAPR report. If your ADS-B out is working but not connecting to the transponder, you'll get passing for most everything, but red (fail) for altitude. This is also what happens if you forget to turn the transponder to ALT . https://adsbperformance.faa.gov/paprrequest.aspx

There is an FAA ADS-B coverage map available, but you have to download a Google Earth plugin: https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/research/airspace/#interactiveMap
(The FAA recently moved this link, making it hard to find)

I was able to get a quick flight in today. I spoke with ATC, and they had me do an IDENT. They said they could see me just fine, and they even confirmed my altitude. That was with ADSB off.

I also confirmed I'm on version 1.5.1. I guess I'll call support and see what they say.

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Yesterday I was able to get signed off, so I went out today to get my test flight. I sat on the ground and played with the transponder fine tuning one more time, and I got a reading! I tried tuning to the left and to the right to see if that worked also, but it did not. Then when I went back to the setting that I thought previously worked it could no longer see my transponder. I figured I would go for a flight anyway, and I generated the report tonight. No errors and everything passed! I guess you really have to be patient when tuning the transponder. It appears that it really does take a while to update.

One thing I did notice was that when I turned on the transponder the pressure altitude would move almost immediately on the app on my phone. That's what made me think the tail beacon was seeing the transponder. I was also told by uAvionics that I could put the unit into rotorcraft mode, and then I would be able to change the settings while flying and see the updates on my phone. I didn't try that though.

So I guess this ends the journey..... Unless I get that phone call. [emoji3]

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fhu667 said:

.... I was also told by uAvionics that I could put the unit into rotorcraft mode, and then I would be able to change the settings while flying and see the updates on my phone. I didn't try that though.
So I guess this ends the journey..... Unless I get that phone call. [emoji3]

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I'd like to know just what they told you about that rotorcraft mode,
I don't recall seeing that option on the app.

FWIW I think it's a good idea to get a PAPR test every now & then,
to make sure your gizmo is still working correctly.
Same idea as the every-2-years transponder cert--
only you can do it yourself & it's free.

hotrod180 said:

I'd like to know just what they told you about that rotorcraft mode,
I don't recall seeing that option on the app.

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This is what uAvionix told me:

Connect to the beacon while sitting on the ground via WiFi. Then change the "emitter type" to rotorcraft. I am not able to see the options on the app right now, but it was a helicopter type option. They explained that this would enable me to stay connected to the beacon while I was flying. This way I would be able to make changes to the transponder threshold adjustment while in flight. I guess the thought is that my transponder will be more likely to be responding to queries with more altitude. Normal behavior for the beacon is that when the plane starts moving beyond a certain speed that the WiFi connection shuts off, and you cannot make changes while in flight. I hope this explanation is helpful.