Aeroski R-2800

[stewartb]

If I've ever seen them I wasn't paying attention. I know there's a cable release to retract skis in flight. How do you reset them to skis down? How do they work when landing snow with wheels down? Like a penetration ski or are they draggier than that? Do they have little wheels on the heel of the ski?

These things may make some sense for where I live these days.

[cubdriver2]

Very dragging even in dry snow. Datums or Summits are waaaaaaay better

Glenn

[mvivion]

First, yes, you land wheels down in the snow, and they act sorta like penetration skis there. Then you get out and use a lever to put the skis "down" for takeoff.

The original skis had a pretty long arm (I may have that reversed), so when the wheels were down, they were down quite a ways, and even when the skis were "down", the wheels penetrated pretty far. So, they were pretty draggy in snow, even skis down.

A few years ago (coulda been a lot of years ago, actually) Aero Ski changed the design to make the wheels "retract" more fully, so they actually worked better in snow.

So, if you do go there, call the Aero guys, and find out what they changed, then determine what the skis you're looking at have. My understanding was that it was retrofitable on the older skis anyway.

The early skis were miserable performers in deep snow. I've not run the later version, but I have talked to some folks who have and are pretty knowledgeable.

Call Aero Ski for an accurate description of what they did.

MTV

[chrisinak]

I ran these for a couple of years on my last pa-12, sold them with the plane. Primarily used for landing up high on glaciers for backcountry skiing. I actually think they are a reasonable compromise, they are fairly light and very simple to install and operate with cables mounted to the back of the pilot seat, and performed fairly well, I routinely landed (and took off after skiing all day) in waist deep powder over 5000'. In powder they aren't horribly draggy landing with the wheels down, in breakable crust you can definitely tell the wheels are down. A few times while dragging a potential LZ to check the snow it was a bit of a struggle to keep the plane from landing due to drag, but fine if you stay on the throttle. I haven't flown penetration skis but imagine it's about the same.

The version I had was the later version with two holes on the arm that lifts the wheel out of the snow so you can choose how deep you want the wheel to go. Definitely want to use the one that lifts it further out of the snow. The skis also need some modifications to perform well. I had 2.5" extended plastic all the way around the skis and extended almost to the tire in the middle of the ski, this allows you to shove a piece of uhmw under the tire to reduce drag if needed to get out of somewhere tight. The rear bogey wheels are super draggy as they come from aeroski. If you take the unit off the bottom of the ski and remount on the top of the ski replacing the bogey wheel with one of a larger diameter, much less draggy. Or even better, keep tools in the plane to remove the bogey wheels completely, takes 10 minutes and makes a huge difference. Much of the winter I would shove a piece of uhmw under the wheels and keep the bogey wheels off and they perform like a slightly heavier straight ski. My biggest complaint with the skis is that they need to be run with 6.00x6 tires. I would love for someone to build a very similar ski that can be used with 850's to give more prop snow clearance and better AOA, I wouldn't run them with my current set up of 3" gear and 86" catto. 6" gear and they might be ok.

Chris

[Cubus Maximus]

R2800 on 6 inch extended gear:

[Dave Calkins]

After modification, they are an acceptable compromise.

The 6-6.00 tires necessary limit the wheel regime use to paved or grass runways in my opinion. definitely not Hood strip type gravel if you wan to save your uhmw smoothness

[stewartb]

Thinking for Wolf Lake. Taxiways are plowed and everything in between gets blown away. I have enough power and wing to overcome some drag from penetration skis and I really don't need hydraulics. Just trying to sort out what works and what doesn't. How to mount ski fittings with TK-1 gear may be the deciding factor.

Anyone running any kind of wheel skis on TK-1 gear?

[chrisinak]

Thinking for Wolf Lake. Taxiways are plowed and everything in between gets blown away. I have enough power and wing to overcome some drag from penetration skis and I really don't need hydraulics. Just trying to sort out what works and what doesn't. How to mount ski fittings with TK-1 gear may be the deciding factor.

Anyone running any kind of wheel skis on TK-1 gear?

R2800 bracket should work fine with TK-1 gear. It bolts onto the lower side of the landing gear utilizing the existing strut bolt hole and one more you need to drill. I did have some issues mounting onto newer atlee gear, the gusset had changed locations since the brackets had been designed and we had to modify bracket slightly. Haven't tried on airframes or other gear.

[cubdriver2]

Stewart, aren't you Ex ? The Datums are a great ski and they are less money then used R2800s. All prices on their site are Canadian, so take another 25%+ off of that

Glenn

[TurboBeaver]

Anyone that thinks any of these penatration type skis, with rear mounted
wheels , will even come close to a set of Datum skis, has obviously never flown them. Datum skis performance is very similar to Fernandez skis, just $20,000
less . Don't get hung up on the 8:50 part
of the equation, go measure the actual clearance on a set of the other skis being
discussed here and you will find the folks that build the skis have adjusted the amount that actually sticks thru their skis
To an absolute minimum to enhance the skis performance on SNOW. If they were to
hang the wheels down further to enhance ground clearance, the snow performance would be even worse.
Datum skis on 6" gear with a thrustline, shows a 70" crankshaft height, go measure
a standard Cub on 31" Bushwheels and see what you get.......
If you want to pretend your a Bushpilot and land on rocky sandbars, on skis, you better get a setof Airglides from Whipline for $27,000; and good insurance,as you will tear them up in short order....... If you want straight ski performance from a wheelski. You may want to look very hard at Datums.
But that's just my 2 cents worth,
E

Sent from my moto e5 go using SuperCub.Org mobile app

[mvivion]

I agree, I see lots of folks singing the praises of various penetration skis, then posting pictures of the plane parked on hard packed snow. There may be a penetration ski out there that performs as well as straight skis, but I’ve not met them. And the Aero 2800s certainly aren’t there. And, not all retractable are that great either.

In my experience, the Rossi Fernandez skis are the best of both worlds: Straight ski performance, great ski clearance when wheels down, and close to straight ski weight.

I’ve never flown the Datum skis, but I’ve heard lots of good things about them from experienced ski pilots.

MTV

[Fliger747]

I have had the 2800's for some time, but in the past had a way to hoist the aircraft so as to allow attachment of the SPRING with the ski tail all the way down. Not having this available does anyone have a good way to stretch the spring?

[aktango58]

NO such thing as easy, but some things I have done:

Lift the tail and put it on a saw horse or barrel

jack or block the wheel up a few inches

Remove the ski's tail wheel

Then, someone with arm strength sit in front of the ski and put a shaft through the spring loop and pull like mad towards the lower attach area, while a second person loops the connecting piece into the spring.

Not absolutely easy, but I have done it on the cub without any blocking with just muscle.

They are not as good as straits, but if you do have the 'lower' hole fittings that pull the tire totally out of the snow, you can do a whole bunch with those skis!! I worked them up over 7,000' in soft snow, low on bars with mash potato snow. The only time I got them really stuck was in really bad over flow.

[Fliger747]

I've flown these for some time and am aware of the advantages and limitations vis straight skis. I was a Denali Glacier pilot for a number of years and had some had some good adventures with these as my private rig. My cub is on the cover of the 2017 Supercub Calendar perched at about 8000' on the side of Moose's Tooth. Fortunately firm snow there! So thanks for the advice, certainly lifting the tail would help a little! When I could just put the plane in the hangar and use the hoist it was quite easy! Looking at attaching an extra tab to the front of the ski for a pulley so I could use a come along.

[chrisinak]

I've flown these for some time and am aware of the advantages and limitations vis straight skis. I was a Denali Glacier pilot for a number of years and had some had some good adventures with these as my private rig. My cub is on the cover of the 2017 Supercub Calendar perched at about 8000' on the side of Moose's Tooth. Fortunately firm snow there! So thanks for the advice, certainly lifting the tail would help a little! When I could just put the plane in the hangar and use the hoist it was quite easy! Looking at attaching an extra tab to the front of the ski for a pulley so I could use a come along.

I used a similar method as described above. Have someone lift the tail and hold it as far up as you can safely do and connect by pulling the spring by hand. Best of you have three people. One to lift the tail, one on the spring (with leather gloves on!) and one to hook the tab. Only takes a minute 🤷*♂️

[chrisinak]

I used a similar method as described above. Have someone lift the tail and hold it as far up as you can safely do and connect by pulling the spring by hand. Best of you have three people. One to lift the tail, one on the spring (with leather gloves on!) and one to hook the tab. Only takes a minute 路*♂️

note to self, stick to text on here and avoid emoticons… that turned out weird

[On Patrol]

I had them on Miss Daisy after Landes Straight Skis. I operated out of the WAD with little to no snow pack going in and out of local lakes with sometimes 12" deep snow and other times mash potatoes. I liked the skis as halfway to retract. I did adjust the penetration height the last two years I had them so that very little tire penetrated in the ski position. There is a bar to lower the skis. I would fly off the snow and head for fuel where I would pull the skis up by pulling the handles on the pilots seat. Then land on the pavement. The great thing was the wheel had enough penetration when ski was down that you could take off from pavement with ski down. The support was great from the manufacturer in Brooten, Mn. The parts or STC were never outrageous. I purchased my set used from a guy who had a Citabria. They had two landings on them. Unlike other manufacturers buying used did not dissuade the manufacturer from treating me like I bought new from him. I did not find the ski draggy once I adjusted the wheels up further. You will more than likely need to re-index the brake caliper to avoid the brake fitting from hitting the ski tunnel. That said it was a great step up from having Straight Skis.

[On Patrol]

NO such thing as easy, but some things I have done:

Lift the tail and put it on a saw horse or barrel

jack or block the wheel up a few inches.

Remove the ski's tail wheel

Then, someone with arm strength sit in front of the ski and put a shaft through the spring loop and pull like mad towards the lower attach area, while a second person loops the connecting piece into the spring.

Not absolutely easy, but I have done it on the cub without any blocking with just muscle.

They are not as good as straits, but if you do have the 'lower' hole fittings that pull the tire totally out of the snow, you can do a whole bunch with those skis!! I worked them up over 7,000' in soft snow, low on bars with mash potato snow. The only time I got them really stuck was in really bad over flow.

I learned the hard way. Use my hoist to lift the airplane up. Lift tail (Second season tip after complaining how hard ski springs are to attach) Leave the rear check cable off (Third Season Tip after complaining how hard the ski springs are to attach) By the fourth season it was getting much easier. You would have thought Glen Guilfoyle would have told me all the installation tricks at once in the first season not 3 seasons versus hearing me bitch on the lake every winter. HA!

[DanaD]

A friend gave me a good tip on how to attach the springs without needing extra people, a hoist, or other shenanigans. Hook one end of the spring up to the gear bolt tab. Then take a thin piece of cord and attach to the check cable/tip attachment tab at the tip of the ski. Bring the cord over the lower hook of the spring and then pull back down towards the tab. If you're burly (or have a friend handy) you should be able to use the mechanical advantage, 2:1 in theory, and hold it while you hook up the attachment to the spring with the other hand. I need to make another pass through a an additional loop at the tip tab and back up around the spring, like a block and tackle, and that works pretty well for me. No luck adding a photo but can share if interested.

[skywagon8a]

A friend gave me a good tip on how to attach the springs without needing extra people, a hoist, or other shenanigans. Hook one end of the spring up to the gear bolt tab. Then take a thin piece of cord and attach to the check cable/tip attachment tab at the tip of the ski. Bring the cord over the lower hook of the spring and then pull back down towards the tab. If you're burly (or have a friend handy) you should be able to use the mechanical advantage, 2:1 in theory, and hold it while you hook up the attachment to the spring with the other hand. I need to make another pass through a an additional loop at the tip tab and back up around the spring, like a block and tackle, and that works pretty well for me. No luck adding a photo but can share if interested.

I've done the same thing.....works great and is quick.

[Eddy Lewis]

Does anyone have pictures for how the ski attaches to the inside of the ski ? Also I'm guessing that the axle is replaced with the extended one that comes with the skis.

Thanks, Eddy

[aktango58]

Does anyone have pictures for how the ski attaches to the inside of the ski ? Also I'm guessing that the axle is replaced with the extended one that comes with the skis.

Thanks, Eddy

Not sure if you are asking how the attach fittings go onto the plane, or skis onto the attach fittings.

You can sort of see in the above photos that there is a big U shaped attachment piece that bolts to the outside stub axle , goes forward and around to the inside attach fitting. This bracket also has the catch and pivot point to raise and lower the ski.

The inside attach fitting gets bolted onto the bottom of the axle on some models of planes, and some folks weld them on. My fittings have options for attaching the skis to allow more ski clearance when they are up.

Aero ski has some photos also you can look at: http://www.aeroskimfg.com/retractables.html

[DanaD]

[QUOTE=Cubus Maximus;790677]R2800 on 6 inch extended gear:

Cubus Maximus, it looks like the install in most of your pics is missing the retraction/ski release cable?