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Thread: BBI Aviation "Nick Smith" wings

  1. #1

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    BBI Aviation "Nick Smith" wings

    Hey group anyone have experience with BBI Aviation "Nick Smith" wings? I am looking at them as a option for my build and they seem like a good wing. Have there been any issues with them? Thanks!

  2. #2
    Bill Rusk's Avatar
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    Nick Smith, used to have the Smith Supercub Kit. At that time Wayne Axelson was building the wings for Nick‘s kits. They were very well-built, perhaps a little on the heavy side, but true and accurate wings.
    When Nick sold his company to Turbine Cubs of Wyoming, which was later to become Backcountry Cubs, Wayne Axelson went and worked for Backcountry Cubs. After a couple of years Wayne left Backcountry Cubs and returned to Canada.
    I do not know if Nick is building his own wings now or if Wayne has resumed building them since he is no longer associated with Backcountry.
    either way, I am quite confident that the wing is very similar, to what Nick and Wayne used to build. Like I said, it is quite strong, a little heavy, but a true and accurate wing. The only downside will be the weight. Probably about 15 pounds to 20 pounds heavier, per panel, than a stock wing.

    This is just my opinion and I may very well be wrong. Perhaps someone else will chime in with better, or more updated, information.

    Bill
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Rusk View Post
    Nick Smith, used to have the Smith Supercub Kit. At that time Wayne Axelson was building the wings for Nick‘s kits. They were very well-built, perhaps a little on the heavy side, but true and accurate wings.
    When Nick sold his company to Turbine Cubs of Wyoming, which was later to become Backcountry Cubs, Wayne Axelson went and worked for Backcountry Cubs. After a couple of years Wayne left Backcountry Cubs and returned to Canada.
    I do not know if Nick is building his own wings now or if Wayne has resumed building them since he is no longer associated with Backcountry.
    either way, I am quite confident that the wing is very similar, to what Nick and Wayne used to build. Like I said, it is quite strong, a little heavy, but a true and accurate wing. The only downside will be the weight. Probably about 15 pounds to 20 pounds heavier, per panel, than a stock wing.

    This is just my opinion and I may very well be wrong. Perhaps someone else will chime in with better, or more updated, information.

    Bill
    Thanks Bill.

  5. #5
    cgoldy's Avatar
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    I flew Wayne’s wings for 7 years. As bill says, strong and true. If your looking to haul weight, I would recommend them. They also had the extended leading edges. No scallops in the fabric and looked great. I swapped them out because I put my cub on a diet.
    Javron O-375 wide body extended wing cub
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  6. #6
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    With the current exchange rates between the US and Canadian dollars, now is a good time to buy a Smith kit.
    N1PA
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    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    The wings are very heavy compared to a PA18 or a Dakota Cub wing as are his fuel tanks. If the tanks are retained like the Smith wings they come out in an accident. Been involved in one nose over where they broke the straps and then one stalled and hit the ground in a nose down attitude and the tanks were in front of the airplane.
    Steve Pierce

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  8. #8
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    The wings are very heavy compared to a PA18 or a Dakota Cub wing as are his fuel tanks. If the tanks are retained like the Smith wings they come out in an accident. Been involved in one nose over where they broke the straps and then one stalled and hit the ground in a nose down attitude and the tanks were in front of the airplane.
    Are these the hinged straps?


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  9. #9
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike mcs repair View Post
    Are these the hinged straps?


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    Yes. This was a nose over.
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    You can see the hinge is pulled apart around the pin here.
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    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers
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  10. #10
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    My wings were built after the transition to TCOW, they did did not have the hinges. Perhaps the current ones do not have that failure issue?
    N1PA
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    Bill Rusk's Avatar
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    Mine were also prior to TCOW and my straps were like the std supercub.

    interesting

    Bill
    Very Blessed.

  12. #12
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    BBI Aviation "Nick Smith" wings

    So both current project and wildcat had the hinges. Will need to weld hinges on next ones. And or put wider hinges on.

    Thanks


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    Are there any other structural issues I should be aware of? So the wings are approximately 15 - 20 lbs heavier per wing? Is there a way that you can add tank straps if needed? I would probably go with the 20 gallon tanks over the 24 gallons due to the weight.

  14. #14
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    I can't account for the weight differences. You can add all the straps you wish, it would be a simple procedure. I like my 24 gallon tanks, nearly 6 hours range with a fuel injected 180 hp. You never have too much fuel unless you are on fire.
    N1PA
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    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cook11 View Post
    Are there any other structural issues I should be aware of? So the wings are approximately 15 - 20 lbs heavier per wing? Is there a way that you can add tank straps if needed? I would probably go with the 20 gallon tanks over the 24 gallons due to the weight.
    I don’t think you truly save weight with smaller tanks because the structure is set up for 24. With the smaller one you end up adding a compression member and fittings.

    Current set here has the smaller tanks. Wildcat had the 24 gallon.


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  16. #16
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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  17. #17
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike mcs repair View Post
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    mike, what is the purpose of that beefy I beam? Flap load transfer to the front spar?
    N1PA

  18. #18
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    mike, what is the purpose of that beefy I beam? Flap load transfer to the front spar?
    yes, it the compression member & flap hanger, overkill... VERY heavy wings.... 2' deep x 12' slotted front mackey flaps

  19. #19
    cgoldy's Avatar
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    Mine didn’t have the hinge and also came from Backcountry.
    Javron O-375 wide body extended wing cub
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  20. #20

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    Hi guys, Nick Smith jr here. A customer notified me about this post and i thought i would have a look. I have not been made aware of any issues with our gas tank straps during normal use of our planes. We do make them differently now for unrelated reasons. If any one has any concerns I would be happy to modify there old ones at no charge. Our wings are a little heavier but extremely strong. Our last wide body with dual doors, L-21 glass square wing and 31" bush wheels came in at 1180 LBS. 70 ft take off and 60 ft landing. So that seams pretty good. If anyone has any further questions pllease let me know.
    Thanks Nick
    BBI Aviation
    519-461-0274
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    Thanks for chiming in Nick! I will be giving you guys a call either today or tomorrow to talk wings.

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    Dave Calkins's Avatar
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    Nick. thanks for chatting here.

    Will you please start a thread describing this new widebody?

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    Thanks, looking forward to the call. Hi Dave, just 4" wider frame. We have built about 120 of the wide body kits. out of the 175 planes kits we have delivered. I think there pretty well known. They kind of fit guys like me that have wide bodies.

  24. #24
    Dave Calkins's Avatar
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    Nick. specifically speak to the 1180 EW widebody please.

    Others I know came out heavier. But, yes we know the wings are strong and the fuel tanks themselves are very strongly fabricated

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    OK, will do in the next couple of days. Thanks
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  26. #26

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    Nick I appreciate your time yesterday. That was a great phone conversation and I learned a lot about your wings and airframes.

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    A bit normal that theirs wings are on the heavy side, they can haul 2400 lbs.

    Franky

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    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franky View Post
    A bit normal that theirs wings are on the heavy side, they can haul 2400 lbs.

    Franky
    I have read that, how was that number obtained?
    Steve Pierce

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    Will Rogers

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    Hi Steve

    My best buddy bought a super cub kit from BBI, and that's the max gross weight of his wings, the spars are 0.125 thick, he have his blog on "Member project in progress" New kid on the block: Buzz Cola.

    Franky

  30. #30
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franky View Post

    the spars are 0.125 thick,

    Franky
    if this is same wing backcountry uses/sells? I just measured rear spar thickness is 0.080" in web of rear spar.... 0.093" that includes some thickness of paint..... these are also 2400lb wings i think...

  31. #31
    RVBottomly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike mcs repair View Post
    if this is same wing backcountry uses/sells? I just measured rear spar thickness is 0.080" in web of rear spar.... 0.093" that includes some thickness of paint..... these are also 2400lb wings i think...
    Hard to tell from web search, but Backcountry's web site says spars are .011 thicker plus doublers. Christian Sturm's website shows rear spar (10743) for Piper at .060 web thickness and front spar (10741) at .075 web thickness.

    So I presume Backcountry's are .086 front and .071 rear. FWIW.
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    Guys

    Unfortunutely, i can not tell you anything about the Backcountry wings, what i know about my buddy's wings is that they are good for 2400 lbs and i believe this is what BBI Aviation publish on their website for the Super Cub and the LS3000 180 kits as they have the same wings (USA 35 B mod), as for the thickness of the main spars webs, 0.125 is what my buddy told me a few days ago, i did ask him for the weight of his wings, he said that he did not weight them , but was guessing about 130 lbs each, he have 2 gas tanks per side (24 + 12 gal.) for a total of 72 gallons of fuel, he will fly with an O-360.

    Franky
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  33. #33
    Buzzcola777's Avatar
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    The way the fuel tanks are retained on the Smith Cub is not with straps anymore

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    An AL plate is welded to the front & rear of the tank. Theses lids sit on the front & rear spars

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    With a screw you hook this ''L'' shape part to the spar at each corner. Really simple et solid.

    Dan Poirier
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  34. #34
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Dan, when you install those tanks be certain the angles sit on both spars solidly without any gaps. If they are able to wobble before tightening the clamps, they would be subject to stresses in flight which could cause cracking next to the welds.
    N1PA
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  35. #35
    Buzzcola777's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    Dan, when you install those tanks be certain the angles sit on both spars solidly without any gaps. If they are able to wobble before tightening the clamps, they would be subject to stresses in flight which could cause cracking next to the welds.
    Good point Sky!
    I also glued a strip of semi-hard rubber (5/32'') on the spar to prevent metal-to-metal contact.

  36. #36
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Also check the fit of the tanks AFTER​ the wings are installed and rigged.
    N1PA
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  37. #37
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    Also check the fit of the tanks AFTER​ the wings are installed and rigged.
    And loosen clamps and recheck for rocking every 100 hours like Atlee tanks.


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