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26" tire choice

And Hot: this is not Alaska. There are no places in SoCal to legally practice big props and long rocks. All of the giant-wheeled Cubs here are for “appearance” only.
And on pavement, the larger tires (29 and 31) cut the crosswind capability to about half. They don’t dare join me on our 20 kt crosswind days (neither do the Cherokees - I have the 11th busiest airport to myself).
 
I used to own a highly modified J5 that had 4 inch wheels with expand-o brakes. She also had the 25 inch tires. But they required two adapters per wheel. And I broke the adapters a couple times when the wheels spun. I would never go back to those nightmares.

The J3 / PA-11 I flew for many years had Goodyear 26 inch. They were used when I bough the plane, and still used when I sold the plane 14 years later. True that the PA-11 was on floats every summer, but to be truthful I was not very good about storing the wheel gear in a protected area during the summers.
 

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The weight of the 26” GY seems to be glossed over.

I recall them weighing nearly as much as a 31” Bushwheel Radial.

Yes they wear well.

someone wanting them for looks alone is an idea that escapes my understanding.

my J3 is on 8x4 with grove discs and calipers.
 
Things I have weighed and the published weights:

26” Goodyear Tires and Tubes 24-26 lbs.
31" AK Bushwheels 33 lbs.
29" AK Bushwheel Airstreaks 27 lbs.
Used 26" Airstreaks 18 lbs
8.50x6 with tube 18 lbs.
26”x12”x6” ---- 26lbs
29”x13”x6” ----- 31lbs
31”x13”x6” ---- 32lbs
35"x15"x10" ---- 40lbs
35"x15"x10" Beaver Special---- 60lbs


 
bob turner said:
And Hot: this is not Alaska. There are no places in SoCal to legally practice big props and long rocks. All of the giant-wheeled Cubs here are for “appearance” only.
And on pavement, the larger tires (29 and 31) cut the crosswind capability to about half. They don’t dare join me on our 20 kt crosswind days (neither do the Cherokees - I have the 11th busiest airport to myself).
Click to expand...

Maybe I'm just ignorant of the dynamics of how smaller tires work, but how is the crosswind capability of the aircraft tied to tire size? Is it that smaller tires will skid if cross loaded whereas bigger tires will grip?

I'm inclined to think the crosswind capability has more to do with the pilot than what tires are on the plane.

Thanks for posting those weights Steve. I thought that 26 GY's were the same weight as 29 Airstreaks but it's good to confirm. The rest of your numbers are accurate except the 31's are coming out around 34-35lbs these days and the 35's coming in at 43-45lbs each. Nothings changed except I think some of the old listed weights are a bit optimistic.
 
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I weigh everything and take a picture and try to file it for future reference but sometimes I am not good at the filing part. Seems everything to do with weights and airplanes is optimistic. ;)
 
bob turner said:
And Hot: this is not Alaska. There are no places in SoCal to legally practice big props and long rocks. All of the giant-wheeled Cubs here are for “appearance” only.
And on pavement, the larger tires (29 and 31) cut the crosswind capability to about half. They don’t dare join me on our 20 kt crosswind days (neither do the Cherokees - I have the 11th busiest airport to myself).
Click to expand...

I'm not sure why that is the case, Bob. Personally, I much prefer Bushwheels in crosswinds, because they STICK where you plant them. It's really easy to put one tire down, and work the airplane around that tire with controls as you decelerate, with little chance of that tire skidding.

I feel like I can land comfortably in as much or more wind with these tires than I can on smaller tires. Maybe it's just what you're used to?

Another issue that folks haven't been discussing, though they're obviously taking that into consideration is that smooth tires don't throw as much junk at your tires in off airport or gravel ops. Hence the preference for the Goodyear blimp tires and the Desser smooth 8.50s, I reckon.

MTV
 
smooth tires are slippery on snow covered surfaces

One reason my Desser 31’s on the 185 are not as docile as the grooved Airhawk 29-11x10 were. But the sidewall flex of the Desser 31 is very nice on Tundra and rocks and such.

my preferences are becoming apparent.

I have a set of 26” Goodyear blimp tires and tubes I am offering. in Anchorage, Alaska.
 
I took this Super Cub from Silver City, NM to Bentonville, AR on Aero Classic 31s on 10" wheels and SJ and I thought we had lost our ability to use our feet. It was a squirrel on the ground. Kept us both up that night trying to figure out what the heck. The next morning I found a pair of broom sticks and found out in the width of the tire it had 1/2" of tow in. Once I got it back to Bentonville we jacked my Super Cub up and swapped wheels and tires. My SC was docile as ever on the 31x10s and this one with the excessive tow in was docile on 31" Bushwheels. Was an eye opener to me.
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Anybody have drag/speed loss numbers on 850x6 and 26" tires? All this talk of the difference between the Desser 850 tundra and the 26 Goodyear has me curious what sort of difference in speed would be realized between those two.
 
On the crosswinds: when you touch down, there are two things trying to turn you in to the wind. One is the drag on the touchdown wheel, and the other is the wind blowing on the aft end of the aircraft. At touchdown you have only rudder and differential aileron drag counteracting those two forces. Your rudder and aileron authority, compared to the wind pressure and wheel drag, are all you’ve got.

At max control input, increasing drag on that wheel means decreasing the crosswind.

If you want to know how much extra drag a 26” Goodyear is, try to move a Cub with those tires up a slight incline with a towbar.

And sure - once both mains are on the ground the drag is now offset. How many Cub pilots land in a 20 knot crosswind on both mains?

thanks for all the info - I think Steve will opt for Goodyears and call Steve in Carefree. We picked up a UPF-7 in Carefree a while back - great airplane!
 
Anybody have drag/speed loss numbers on 850x6 and 26" tires?
Click to expand...
I've used both of those, and 31s on my -12. I'd say the speed difference between 8.50 Dessers and 31s is roughly 5 mph, with the 26s falling in the middle.
 
Bob, pump the tires up and they all roll just fine. I haven't noticed any discernable difference between 8.50s, BW 26s and BW 31s in crosswinds. I'd bet the GY 26s will feel a lot like 8.50s; unless they're soft, of course.
 
Gordon - so spin-up inertia doesn't affect initial adverse drag on touchdown?

Are you routinely practicing in 20 kt direct crosswinds?

Granted - the hard 26s do handle crosswinds almost as well as an 8:50, but have you tried 29s in a 20 knot direct xwind?
 
Since I started it, I do not mind hijacking - as always around here, I got the info I needed and then some. You guys are great.
 
If I had a 20knot direct crosswind I'd probably just land on a taxiway turnoff. Landing would only be about 75 foot with that much wind!

Plus good lord, I'd hate to be up if it was that gusty. In a J3 you'd be bouncing around inside the cabin like a rubber ball.
 
bob turner said:
And sure - once both mains are on the ground the drag is now offset. How many Cub pilots land in a 20 knot crosswind on both mains?

thanks for all the info - I think Steve will opt for Goodyears and call Steve in Carefree. We picked up a UPF-7 in Carefree a while back - great airplane!
Click to expand...

Bob, who said anything about landing both tires simultaneously in a crosswind? What you’re describing is initial spool up of the tire on the upwind side. That’s a very momentary force, and is easily overcome by proper control application. Once that Bushwheel is down, and rolling, it provides much less opportunity to skid. Plane just runs along on that tire till it’s time to put down the other. The force to keep a larger tire spinning once it’s spun up is easily overcome with minimal control forces.

MTV
 
Mounted 35s weigh 68# each. Talk about spin-up factor, but even at that it's no big deal. 26" Goodyears are a total non-event. In a crosswind tall tires add to the excitement. More height, more excitement. And more AOA. Plus with Bushwheels you get all the sidewall flex, too. Smaller, harder tires are better in unfavorable winds.
 
I dunno, I’ve landed in winds I couldn’t safely taxi in, while running “oversized” tires (not 35 inch Bushwheels). Not fun, but mostly it’s an exercise in reducing the crosswind component, whether you’re running big or small tires.....then figuring out what to do next......like find some wing walkers.

Just how much wind are you guys tackling, anyway?

MTV
 
Enter the Newbie: Late Fall 1975 Merrill Field Anchorage in a just bought PA-18 (N7777D) with checkout pilot in back. T&G on old style 25x11x4's first left black marks on the runway. Screeech screech! I was informed to tap them to roll 'em up some then set down a few feet later to save the rubber. Still works.

Gary
 
You haven't had fun taxing in the wind until you've flown a slat wing on 6" ext gear and 35s. But I'm just a toddler in dog years when it comes to my big wing Cub.

Talking personal wind limits will be a waste of time. Guys will be wagging Johnsons before you know it. I'll pass.
 
BC12D-4-85 said:
Enter the Newbie: Late Fall 1975 Merrill Field Anchorage in a just bought PA-18 (N7777D) with checkout pilot in back. T&G on old style 25x11x4's first left black marks on the runway. Screeech screech! I was informed to tap them to roll 'em up some then set down a few feet later to save the rubber. Still works.

Gary
Click to expand...

I recognize that number, I was working at Pats Flying Service about that time... were the 25x11x4’s the ones that had the springs in them that everybody pulled out?
 
I bought it from Lou Armbruster (also had a Heliocourier) at Merrill for $15K. New factory engine and 4 yrs on rebuild. Sheep hunter special.

No metal staples on the 25's...the ice grip ~31-36" tires had them and they took several six packs to remove. Today many of those tires are still airworthy and flyable with little weather deterioration. Tubed with 8:50x6" tubes and held to the 4" rims with fiberglass or metal adapters that adapt the lugged rims to the smooth wheels. Plus we screwed through the wheels>adapters>tires to allow less air pressure.

Gary
 
Ah yes.... I spent many an hour pulling those buggers out, and I remember the screws into the tires. Good times.
 
Jim Helmericks from the Colville River delta was the first I came across that claimed he could land anywhere he wanted on the big 36". It took a quick look to see why and that was before fat tailwheels. Now look at what's available from Airframes. It's been quite an evolution for the better.

Gary
 
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