Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 41 to 55 of 55

Thread: Grounding your home base fuel tank

  1. #41

    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Fairbanks Alaska
    Posts
    642
    Post Thanks / Like
    I have 3 above ground tanks 2 300 1 500 none of them are grounded.
    Last edited by mit greb; 09-23-2020 at 12:15 AM.
    Tim

  2. #42
    mvivion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Bozeman,MT
    Posts
    11,036
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian M View Post
    Naive question here - what about fueling from plastic fuel jugs? I've started running a mixture of 100LL and 87 mogas, and I use normal 5 gallon fuel jugs for the mogas. I feel OK doing so in the summer, but the idea of doing that in the winter has me concerned about static. Would it do any good to drive a ground rod into the soil outside my hangar and connect that to my airplane when fueling from a plastic jug?
    Do a search on this site. There is at least one VERY long thread on that very subject.

    MTV
    Thanks Brian M thanked for this post
    Likes Brian M liked this post

  3. #43
    mvivion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Bozeman,MT
    Posts
    11,036
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by mit greb View Post
    I have 3 above ground tanks 2 300 1 500 none of the are grounded.
    Yeah, but you always live on the edge Tim

    MTV
    Likes mit greb liked this post

  4. #44
    wireweinie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Palmer, AK
    Posts
    3,387
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian M View Post
    Naive question here - what about fueling from plastic fuel jugs? I've started running a mixture of 100LL and 87 mogas, and I use normal 5 gallon fuel jugs for the mogas. I feel OK doing so in the summer, but the idea of doing that in the winter has me concerned about static. Would it do any good to drive a ground rod into the soil outside my hangar and connect that to my airplane when fueling from a plastic jug?
    Be cautious with plastic, funnels or jugs. The good ones are conductive. The bad ones aren't.

    Web
    Life's tough . . . wear a cup.
    Likes Hardtailjohn liked this post

  5. #45
    wireweinie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Palmer, AK
    Posts
    3,387
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by ak49flyer View Post
    Another question- is a floatplane in the water grounded, and thereby bonded to the fueling system(assuming its grounded)? Iíve been around a lot of 135 and other floatplane ops here and have never once seen one grounded/bonded during fueling. For that matter, Iíve never seen them do it on their wheel planes either, except at the airport... Not saying itís a good idea, just what Iíve observed.
    No. Freshwater is not very conductive. Saltwater is phenomenally conductive but don't land your airplane in saltwater, lol.
    Life's tough . . . wear a cup.

  6. #46
    skukum12's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    The Last Frontier
    Posts
    1,152
    Post Thanks / Like
    I used to deliver methanol in Prudhoe Bay, Alaska. Being the north slope, static electricity is a huge deal. I have had static jump through my leather gloves from doorknobs.

    Anyway, the methanol would flow from my 10,000 gallon tanker to the storage tank filling from the bottom up. This prevented a static charge from being created by free falling fuel from the top down.

    Soo, now that I will be grounding and bonding my fuel supply system, I will add one more precaution which may be Overkill. When I insert the nozzle into the wing tank, I will minimize fuel free fall by getting it in there as far as it will go. At some point the fuel will begin to cover the filler tube of the nozzle and there will be no more free fall which may cause static.
    "Always looking up"
    Likes RVBottomly, Hardtailjohn liked this post

  7. #47
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Fairbanks, AK.
    Posts
    2,408
    Post Thanks / Like
    All it takes is once of course. But after 55 yrs of transferring fuel in Alaska year round all seasons into anything that uses it - I've never had a spark that created a fire. I do keep a fire extinguisher handy. The one fire I was made aware of involved a Lower 48 Cub draining a main tank into a container on the ground from an open quick drain during summer. The owner moved the plane but the fire was faster. Every year thousands of town and bush people fuel their vehicles from ungrounded plastic and gasoline tanks. Safe? No. Works? Sometimes.

    Gary

  8. #48
    skywagon8a's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    SE Mass
    Posts
    10,490
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian M View Post
    Naive question here - what about fueling from plastic fuel jugs? I've started running a mixture of 100LL and 87 mogas, and I use normal 5 gallon fuel jugs for the mogas. I feel OK doing so in the summer, but the idea of doing that in the winter has me concerned about static. Would it do any good to drive a ground rod into the soil outside my hangar and connect that to my airplane when fueling from a plastic jug?
    I think there is some confusion in the use of the words "ground", "grounded" and "bonded". They are similar in practice and meaning. They are often used interchangeably without much thought. The whole idea is to use an unpowered metallic connection (ground wire or bonding wire) between the originating container of the gasoline and the place where you are putting the gasoline. This will ensure there is no electrical differential between the two locations. With no electrical differential there will be no spark.

    Plastic jugs have the ability to make their own static charge.
    N1PA
    Thanks mam90, OLDCROWE thanked for this post

  9. #49

    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Fairbanks, Alaska
    Posts
    101
    Post Thanks / Like
    Ive had one fueling with a chamois The winter of 69 in hughes alaska. metal cans. when i tipped the can into the funnel it aught fire,. I threw the almost fuel an off the back side of the wing. It was -35. You guys need to pay attention to wire weinie and read the proper procedures. Pa -12 burned up in cys hangar in manle
    Quote Originally Posted by BC12D-4-85 View Post
    All it takes is once of course. But after 55 yrs of transferring fuel in Alaska year round all seasons into anything that use for not proper boning. There have been at least 4 hangers in alaska that have burned to improper bonding.
    - I've never had a spark that created a fire. I do keep a fire extinguisher handy. The one fire I was made aware of involved a Lower 48 Cub draining a main s need to ptank into a container on the ground from an open quick drain during summer. The owner moved the plane but the fire was faster. Every year thousands need to under stand wire ws of town and bush people fuel their vehicles from ungrounded plastic and gasoline tanks. Safe? No. Works? Sometimes.

    Gary
    Sandy

  10. #50

    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    5,446
    Post Thanks / Like
    That's a good example if why guys need to learn about bonding. Here's a refresher. Static electricity management isn't new.

    https://www.supercub.org/forum/showt...Worth-Watching

  11. #51

    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    5,446
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian M View Post
    Naive question here - what about fueling from plastic fuel jugs? I've started running a mixture of 100LL and 87 mogas, and I use normal 5 gallon fuel jugs for the mogas. I feel OK doing so in the summer, but the idea of doing that in the winter has me concerned about static. Would it do any good to drive a ground rod into the soil outside my hangar and connect that to my airplane when fueling from a plastic jug?
    If you use plastic jugs on the wing the safest way I know is to use racing jugs (AIH) and keep the long pour hose so you can immerse the hose end into the fuel in your tank. Use a rag around the hose to guide the hose into the filler and keep it there to close off the filler area from air transfer. The air in the tank is usually too rich to ignite. Keep fumes inside the tank. The smooth hose dumping directly into the fuel in the tank minimizes static generation and race jugs empty quickly so exposure time is reduced. I've done the funnel thing, too. Race jugs work better for me.
    Thanks OLDCROWE thanked for this post
    Likes RVBottomly, BC12D-4-85 liked this post

  12. #52
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Fairbanks, AK.
    Posts
    2,408
    Post Thanks / Like
    Ask Charly Center about fires and hangars. Sadly lost his new setup in Wasilla years ago to a fire...not sure but I think he said there was defueling or wing work going on. Plane was behind others that slowed the exit.

    Gary

  13. #53
    8GCBC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Oahu
    Posts
    1,796
    Post Thanks / Like
    “Ground” is relative. Contrasts: From a micro watch battery terminal to a nuclear generator earth ground.

    We all live with several different “Grounds” on a daily basis. Cars, iPADS, DC & AC. etc all have different and distinct “Grounds”.

    “Grounding” everything together is not the solution. Understanding electrical potential is the key.
    2018 R44
    IA/A&P, ATP, SES, CFII, MEI, Rotor PPL (2500 TT)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXI48e1heuo

  14. #54
    moneyburner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Western Washington
    Posts
    987
    Post Thanks / Like
    Electrical grounding and static bonding are two different things that look nearly identical.

    First, a grounding conductor is incorporated into an AC electrical circuit to prevent you from being intimately involved in that circuit if a line wire comes into contact with a metal part that you might touch. This can ruin your day.

    Second, bonding items together and to the GROUND is to help eliminate a build-up of a potential between two electrically isolated things and a resulting spark jumping across them to equalize that difference. Your vehicle picks up a charge from moving through the air; sometimes it is a lot, other times it is not noticable. This charge might be (and usually is) different from the charge of the tank you want to use. When you attach your bonding wire from the reel, you are equalizing those charges and the spark happens right there at the connection, if at all.

    Bonding using the nozzle of a gasoline hose where it meets your fuel tank filler neck could also ruin your day.
    Quidquid Latine dictum sit, altum videtur

  15. #55
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Fairbanks, AK.
    Posts
    2,408
    Post Thanks / Like
    My habit is to tap the plane's lifting ring first with the hose nozzle before opening the cap. For a few years I wore insulated nylon overalls in winter but quit when I threw a spark touching metal with my finger.

    Gary

Similar Threads

  1. Fuel tank grounding?
    By bob turner in forum Cafe Supercub
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 10-28-2019, 08:57 AM
  2. WTB Left Hand PA-18 or PA-11 Fuel Tank, straps, tank cover
    By supercub in forum Parts and Pieces
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 01-21-2019, 12:10 PM
  3. Lake Hood ICE REPORT..SkiPlane Base or SeaPlane Base?
    By Dave Calkins in forum Ski Flying Forum
    Replies: 43
    Last Post: 01-24-2015, 08:37 PM
  4. Firstair Field in Monroe, Wash. For Sale, Jason's Home Base
    By Steve Pierce in forum Take Action Jackson
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 08-31-2009, 06:43 AM

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •