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Anyone have autopilot in their cub?

don d

Registered User
don
Have autopilot in my Skylane and really like it. Anyone have one in their cub? Thinking of installing a single Axis Trio in my experimental cub.
 
I had one of the first autopilots in a Cub back in 2005. It was a TruTrak. I have helped a number of folks since get one installed in their Cubs. I also put a certified TruTrak in my C-180 recently. Based on the feedback I’ve received from friends putting a Trio in their 180’s, I would not put one in a Cub. My money is on TruTrak. A very quality product with great customer support.
Just my 2cents.
Lou
 
I put the Garmin servos in this spring in my G3x carboncub. Kicking myself for not doing it during the build. I use it way more than I thought I would.

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Jake, are you controlling it via the G3x interface, or did you put a 507 head in as well?


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I have a 2 channel Dynon with AP74 head, it's nice to be able to confirm how many axis are live and cut out the roll axis with one buttton. I use it for altitude hold mostly. The roll can only dip a wing, it's a reminder to the human to rudder back to heading.
 
On the 1000+ mile ride to Idaho from Kansas City, an AP in the Super Cub would sure be a nice tool. I don't think there is one certified for the PA18 yet. I wonder if the FAA (who know believes every plane should have one) is loosening up their field approval rules around them?

sj
 
Has anyone added a yaw damper to their Cub AP? I didn't consider it because the G3X won't run it without a dedicated controller added. I sorta wish I had the 305 or 507 controller. The AP would be more functional. No plans to upgrade mine. It does enough as it is.
 
My friends would love it if I had one when I am lead, I tend to fly like a drunk sailor most of the time just because I like to look at stuff. I am afraid I would just fall asleep if I used one.
DENNY
 
Have autopilot in my Skylane and really like it. Anyone have one in their cub? Thinking of installing a single Axis Trio in my experimental cub.

Has anyone added a yaw damper to their Cub AP? I didn't consider it because the G3X won't run it without a dedicated controller added. I sorta wish I had the 305 or 507 controller. The AP would be more functional. No plans to upgrade mine. It does enough as it is.
Not in my Cub, however I went through this years ago with my 185. One axis at a time. While each axis does make life a bit easier, it also makes things more difficult since the pilot has to share the controls with the autopilot. It actually raises the fatigue factor. Use two axis as a minimum or not at all. A yaw damper helping to keep the controls coordinated would be most welcome, particularly on a plane which needs the rudder to be moved when the ailerons are moved in order to maintain a comfortable ride. Three axis on a long trip would make you more likely to take your Cub on long trips.
 
Share controls? Are you talking about hand flying with the AP on or resistance from the servos with AP off? The latter is a non issue with Garmin. You won't know the servos are there. The former? That depends on the torque and gain settings you entered at setup. My servos can be set so high that I can't overpower them. Clearly not the right way to do it but those little motors are surprisingly powerful.
 
I am referring to an airplane with a single axis autopilot or a two axis autopilot. Airplanes fly with three axis controls. Some can be flown with ailerons alone giving a smooth ride. Some with rudder alone, and some need all three to maintain a semblance of a smooth ride. When an airplane which needs more than one control to fly comfortably, that airplane should have autopilot capabilities to manage all of those controls. The human pilot has to handle the controls which the autopilot does not. SO the human pilot must coordinate his actions with the autopilot. I've never noticed any interference from any make of autopilot servo when the autopilot was disengaged.

During the times when I was flying my 185 on amphibs diagonally across Canada to Alaska a 32+ hour ride, it was tiring without an autopilot. I installed a single axis (ailerons) with a navigation coupler. That was a help, however I still had to have my hand on the elevators particularly when flying in thermally induced rough air. SO I added an S-tec pitch control. That was a big help (in smooth air only) and would even do coupled approaches. I still needed to keep my feet on the rudders to eliminate fishtailing created by the ailerons. SO, I installed a yaw damper. Now I finally could relax a bit (in smooth air). The S-tec sucked, to be blunt in turbulence. It doesn't sense pitch to control pitch. It actually makes things worse than no auto-pitch control at all. It uses pressure changes coupled with a G force sensor. IMO any pitch control autopilot should be able to sense pitch changes in order to control pitch. I removed the S-tec and replaced it with a TruTrak pitch control.
 
Jake, are you controlling it via the G3x interface, or did you put a 507 head in as well?


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Thru the G3x, just tap the FMA (flight management annunciation) bar on the top edge of the PFD and the autopilot window pops up. Saves wiring and panel space.


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Three systems for three axis', I like having a trigger on the stick to get the whole plane back right now. It's bigger than and above the transmit button.
 
I have a G3X with 2-axis autopilot in my Carbon Cub. I control it with a 305 head, and while autopilot in a Cub seemed sacrilegious to me at first, it really comes in handy on those 3-hour cross country flights in Wyoming. Sometimes I shut it off in turbulence (easier to hand fly than having the AP chase altitude while I jockey with the throttle).
 
Sometimes I shut it off in turbulence (easier to hand fly than having the AP chase altitude while I jockey with the throttle).
Can you turn off the altitude hold function leaving the rest of it operational? Your description sounds as though the autopilot is attempting to hold the altitude rather than just the attitude. Holding attitude, letting the altitude float makes for a smoother ride.
 
Can you turn off the altitude hold function leaving the rest of it operational?

Yes, I'll try that next time - especially through the Laramie<->Fort Collins corridor which always seems to have significant up and downdrafts. The Garmin G3X (which I'm still getting to know) prompts me to "Trim Up" or "Trim Down" in such cases, but I agree that floating the altitude may be the better way. As I recall it's just one button (ALT) on the 305. Thanks for the suggestion.

~PandaCub
 
Yes, I'll try that next time - especially through the Laramie<->Fort Collins corridor which always seems to have significant up and downdrafts. The Garmin G3X (which I'm still getting to know) prompts me to "Trim Up" or "Trim Down" in such cases, but I agree that floating the altitude may be the better way. As I recall it's just one button (ALT) on the 305. Thanks for the suggestion.

~PandaCub
Without electric trim wired in, the manual trim up or down warning is countered with manual trim or throttle. I found using the throttle works pretty good in occasional up and down drafts around Minnesota and leaving it trimmed for cruise. YMMV

Jake

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I know with external control heads you can deselect altitude hold with the ALT button. I don't know if the GDU allows deselecting the vertical component but I'm pretty sure there's a button for it. Jake? I have a few more months before I can find out.
 
All the features on the control head are built into the touch screen. The vertical speed just takes an extra step vs the control head. Touch the VS button then set the rate with the right hand control knob.

You can select or deselect all the modes. Altitude hold, heading, vertical speed, track, vertical nav, etc.

I will try to post a picture tomorrow.

Jake

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Last edited:
I took a screen shot from a garmin webinar
https://youtu.be/b3V4ZeCi4Oo
Screenshot_20191211-220713_YouTube.jpeg

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My CC has the 507 head with the Garmin AP. It’s a wonderful piece of electronics. I was always impressed by the Trutrak in Lou’s cub and it’s capabilities but said what the heck I will never use it. Wrong, it’s a really powerful piece


our new grain dryer crapped out a VFD drive on the #2 burner motor. It’s either shut 2 combines and wait for FEDEX overnight or fly 300 miles to NY and be back by noon with the part
i set up the FD with the destination to nav to, climb the cub at 700 FPM, and capture 4500 altitude. Blasted out of my strip in the dark at 5 am, cleared the trees and hit the AP button, and hit the AP disconnect 3 hours later in NY. Pretty geewhiz stuff for this hack

I gave the boss a ride to pickup her car the other day and showed her how the blue WLbutton works. Rolled into about a 65 degree turn and showed her how the wings level button will bring the plane back to level attitude I love to hear her howl in those turns. She said something about a blue button in the back of my head
jim
 
I have just completed a 2 axis Trutrak Gemini AP installation in my Super Legend Cub. It took about 40 hours total to do the install. The installation time was prolonged a few hours for fabrication of the brackets for servo mounting plates. The "kit" Trutrak sells for the Legend Cub is not all inclusive of the correct parts and the engineering department replied in an email "to be creative but safe in the fabrication of the brackets" since they were not going to supply the correct parts. Trutrak as many of you know has been bought by Bendix-King. Its no longer the small one-on-one customer service as in the past. They are working hard at getting folks trained up on the Trutrak line. I made a couple of calls during the process of setting the parameters in the control head (since there were none supplied for the Legend) and found them helpful in finding the best settings for the aircraft.
There is little residual resistance of the servos when the AP is off. I have only flown in some semi turbulent air and it handle it well. Once I set for cruise trim, I used the throttle to satisfy the trim during up or down drafts. As others have said, AP in a Cub? but now wish I had done it before it ever left the factory. I take a lot of pictures during flight and with the " Control Wheel Steering" on the Trutrak, if there is something I see off-course, it is easy to wonder over and then return to course
 
I'm always amazed more don't drivers don't use their cruise control on the interstate. You know the ones, who haul ass up behind you, then hang there for a few minutes, then decide to pass, and a few more miles later are now off your front bumper. I use my CC every chance I can, even on 45 mph county roads. I can for sure see the advantages of having one in even such a small plane as my S-7S. I seem to have a recurring issue with my GPS, it fails to track my progress properly, often showing as much as 10 or 15 degrees off course drift, it can't be my inattention, or can it?! It gets me thinking: I'd be there by now without all those detours.....I actually know of a few different S-7S pilots with AP, and they also have a turboed engine and oxygen systems, and sound like ATP's when they talk about their latest XC's. But, they can still get down and dirty when needed, they sound like a win/win to me.
 
Regarding lack of use of cruise control, I completely agree. CC has a long list of good reasons to use. But like merging, it seems so many were never taught nor grasp the concept.


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I'm a huge cruise control believer, my spouse is not. I even set it at 25mph when driving around our lake. When we go on cross country trips, I get an extra mile per gallon than when Laura is driving and I believe it is from cruise control use.

My neighbor, however, has been driving fleet vehicles his whole life and the company training (a big company) says cruise control leads to more accidents. Now, I have not googled this up, but apparently it leads to more or worse "asleep at the wheel" accidents..

sj
 
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