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ADS-B Issues

From all the reports I’ve heard, the OD of the skybeacon is larger than the ID of the Piper ring welded in the trailing edge. If you open it up so the Skybeacon fits, there isn’t enough structure left. I think Steve Pierce has confirmed this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Good thing I welded 1/16" steel in there. Still need to know the required opening diameter.

There is a drawing of the unit on their wed site. Looks like 1.142 dia, 1.583 deep. They use a mount ring that attaches to the rudder flange. Then the actual unit has 4 prongs that stick out to engage the mount ring. Go to the uAvionix web site and look at the data sheet for it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
1.14" - Bart posted a drawing on the champcitabriadecathlon forum.

The drawing shows four slots - no dimensions. Does this thing screw in as with interrupted threads?

I am going to do it anyway. Even I can weld in a tail light bracket.
 
So why would you cut, weld and recover your rudder when you can bolt it on the wing tip?
tailBeacon.jpg
 

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Steve, my impression is that even if the support ring fit, the electronics are too wide to fit between the fabric surfaces without rubbing. True?
 
Steve, my impression is that even if the support ring fit, the electronics are too wide to fit between the fabric surfaces without rubbing. True?

That was my impression as well when looking at the unit. It was a disappointment to say the least.
 
Why not the Skybeacon?
Personally i think its ugly.
In fact, so is the Tailbeacon,
but imho less noticeable on tbe tail.
Also imho less prone to damage on the tail--
Ive knocked off a wingtip nav light before,
but never an aft nav light (yet).
I also dont like the lack of symetry with two different looking wingtip arrangements--
must be my OCD tendencies.
 
Mike, how did you update the skybeacon software--
Download to PC, then plug a (USB?) cord between it & the unit?
If so, did you have to remove the unit from the airplane?
Or is it some sort of wireless magic?
 
Why not the Skybeacon?
Personally i think its ugly.
In fact, so is the Tailbeacon,
but imho less noticeable on tbe tail.
Also imho less prone to damage on the tail--
Ive knocked off a wingtip nav light before,
but never an aft nav light (yet).
I also dont like the lack of symetry with two different looking wingtip arrangements--
must be my OCD tendencies.

It is a compromise, inexpensive to buy the equipment and to install. If you don't like the looks there are a bunch of alternatives. All it takes is cubic dollars and the choices are out there
 
Here's a non-commercial ADS-B site run by enthusiasts: https://www.adsbexchange.com

Click on the radar icon on the right. You can zoom out and drag to anywhere in the world, and set that location as a default. The receivers are provided by volunteers and are not tied in to the FAA.

It is worth reading the home page on that web site and consider it in the context of privacy and stalkers of various forms. I don't fault the people running the site. I fault the FAA for not taking privacy seriously. It seems clear that information and safety were not the top priority when developing ADSB. Enhancing Big Brother's surveillance capabilities appear to have been the only serious priority.

Read this also:
https://www.adsbexchange.com/2015/10/20/thoughts-on-security/
 
Mike, how did you update the skybeacon software--
Download to PC, then plug a (USB?) cord between it & the unit?
If so, did you have to remove the unit from the airplane?
Or is it some sort of wireless magic?

Its actually quite simple, but there isn’t much explanation on uAvionix web site. You need a PC, preferably a sorta portable one. With connection to internet, go to uAvionix website and click on update link. There are a couple. First, upload the one that’s called the “update tool”, then locate the one that has the update software for version 1.4.0, and upload that.

Now go to airport, and turn on the SkyBeacon. On your laptop, go to settings WiFi and look for the SkyBeacon WiFi. Connect to that.

Open the install tool software on the PC, and it will automatically upload the update. If you are inside a Hangar, you’ll need to look at the bottom right of the update screen, and uncheck the GPS related box. Once the software loads, Close out the PC, then with your smart phone, verify that the SkyBeacon software is now 1.4.0.

It takes a lot longer to write it out than to do it. Upload takes 15 to 30 seconds. If it takes longer, AND you’re in a Hangar, look at the bottom right of the screen that comes up with the update tool. There’s a box there marked GPS. Uncheck that box since you’re not going to receive location data, and try the upload again.

if you’re outdoors, it should upload without unchecking that box.

Thats it.

MTV
 
If I were starting with an uncovered rudder, I think I'd consider doing what it takes to put the tail beacon in, including fairing the fabric somehow. But also use a conventional strobe / tail light with a separate ring. The main reason is because the wingtip model's strobe is so deficient. I assume it's legal, but it's not at all bright. One thought against that plan would be if the strobe wiring interfered with the ADSB function.
 
A small fabric repair takes about twice as long as the welding. I am not going to hesitate. I haven't ordered yet, but have chosen Steve P as my dealer.
 
I contacted uAvionix and they will contact me later with info to exchange the tailBeacon for the skyBeacon. My current wing tip strobes are synchronized but they said there is no way to have the skyBeacon synchronized with my remaining tip strobe. Intensities may be different too. Bummer!

It still my be worth opening up the rudder fabric and modifying the mounting ring. I'll discuss it with my tube and fabric mechanic before I make the switch. Hopefully such a nonstrucural mod would not trigger any undue FAA concern.

Jim


Sent from my SM-T827R4 using SuperCub.Org mobile app
 
It is a compromise, inexpensive to buy the equipment and to install. If you don't like the looks there are a bunch of alternatives. All it takes is cubic dollars and the choices are out there

I have purchased the Tailbeacon instead of the slightly cheaper Skybeacon because the reasons in post #69.
It comes out as the best (for me) compromise between cost, ease of installation, looks, etc .

If I were starting with an uncovered rudder, I think I'd consider doing what it takes to put the tail beacon in, including fairing the fabric somehow. But also use a conventional strobe / tail light with a separate ring. The main reason is because the wingtip model's strobe is so deficient. I assume it's legal, but it's not at all bright. One thought against that plan would be if the strobe wiring interfered with the ADSB function.

Gordon, not sure if you know but FYI the Tailbeacon does not include a strobe feature--
just ADS-B out and an LED nav light.

​[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Tahoma,Calibri,Geneva,sans-serif]https://uavionix.com/products/tailbeacon/[/FONT]
 
I just received my uAvionix tailbeacon but I take from this thread, it will not fit to replace a Super Cub taillight. I'd be interested if anyone successfully fits it to a standard SC rudder. …..


I just noticed this unusual nav light installation on a local Cub.
Maybe applicable to mounting a Tailbeacon?
It would be a lot less noticeable if the sealant matched the paint.

aft nav light on strobe can.jpg
 

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Gordon, not sure if you know but FYI the Tailbeacon does not include a strobe feature--
Yes, I knew that - thanks. That's why I was pondering a separate Wheelen unit on the tail.
 
I just noticed this unusual nav light installation on a local Cub.
Maybe applicable to mounting a Tailbeacon?
It would be a lot less noticeable if the sealant matched the paint.
I don't think the tailBeacon would work in that configuration.
 
A related issue:
I have a uAvionix for ADS-B Out, Stratus 2 for ADS-B In, and Foreflight on an iPhone for displaying ADS-B In data. I suspect this is a pretty common configuration.

On startup, I would see ADS-B No Towers on Foreflight. Makes sense, as I'm on the ground.

During the takeoff roll, Foreflight would display ADS-B lost (or something to that effect). Every time. Sometimes ADS-B would return, sometimes not.

What was happening is that "ADS-B" displayed by Foreflight was referring to the uAvionix unit, which of course is not ADS-B In. The iPhone was connecting to the uAvionix Wifi first. uAvionix turns off the WiFi after reaching a certain speed (user settable). For whatever reason, the iPhone wouldn't always reconnect to the Stratus, leaving me to fiddling around to get a connection in flight.

The solution is to disable Auto-Join for the uAvionix network; you'll need to manually join if you want to change settings, which is rare. AFAICT, on the iPhone you must be joined to the uAvionix network to change this setting.

Hope this helps someone.
 
I am way too old for all that. I can still do compass and a watch if I have to. Like Martha, I need a Sectional chart.
 
would they play nice together??? noise wise??

If you can get past the looks, it should function. That beacon is one of the Whelen slow flash, incandescent types (70509 I think?) not a true strobe. It pulls a fairly low amount of power and the slow on/off should keep the noise to a minimum.

Web
 
Installed my Tailbeacon yesterday, about as easy as they say it is.
Literally about 10-15 minutes to install & another 10-15 minutes to program with tablet--
including a fair amount of fumbling around.
Did a short 10 minute flight in some nearby class C airspace as a test.
When I went online to check the results, everything looked good on the PAPR report except for one thing:
under "missing elements", "flight ID" was red-tagged.
Gonna call uAvionix later today and ask them about it.

Tailbeacon.jpg

FWIW I did notice later that the tailbeacon unit was not a tight fit onto the base,
there was some wiggle which I figured would cause some vibration which would probably not be a good thing.
So I added some foil tape onto the base to get a snug fit.
 

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….Did a short 10 minute flight in some nearby class C airspace as a test.
When I went online to check the results, everything looked good on the PAPR report except for one thing:
under "missing elements", "flight ID" was red-tagged.
Gonna call uAvionix later today and ask them about it.....

The tech support guy at uAvionix told me the misreporting was undoubtedly at the beginning of the flight,
and was due to my old equipment (specifically the encoder) not being warmed up enough.
He suggested turning on the avionics several minutes before takeoff.
Kinda like what was related very early on in this thread--
except that the guy blamed my old encoder instead of the GPS in my new Tailbeacon.
 
Flew my 30-minutes-in-rule-airspace ADS-B test flight yesterday.
Got 3 green on the GAIRS report,
so I applied for my rebate last night.
Got an email from them today, wanting a copy of either the bill of sale for my device,
or the 337 for the installation. Sent them the 337.
Hopefully a "the check's in the mail" email will be forthcoming soon.

FWIW this is a recent addition to the FAA's rebate webpage
https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/rebate/

Rebate reservation applications will be available for the last time on Friday, October 11, 2019
at 1 pm Eastern Daylight Time (
EDT
). There will be a limited number of rebates available. Please note that getting to the application page does not guarantee that you will get a reservation.


Anyone who hasn't got a rebate yet, better try to get one while you still can.
 
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I had one of those conversations with the ADS-B Nazis in DC as well. The guy was polite, but inflexible. He told me my altitude reporting wasn't working correctly (actually, it wasn't reporting pressure altitude at all) and suggested I return the unit to the manufacturer. I told him I was aware of the problem, the unit had been to the manufacturer numerous times without resolution and I was actively working on the issue with the manufacturer. Then he said I would not be allowed to fly in ADS-B airspace with a unit that wasn't passing. OK, so ADS-B isn't even a rule yet (and most ATC facilities couldn't receive ADS-B information a year ago when I had this conversation with them), so what air space was considered to be "ADS-B Air space" since the rule doesn't apply until 2020? I was flying in a remote area nowhere near any controlled air space and was staying far away from controlled air space while I worked on the problem. Additionally, the first flight with any ADS-B unit is a test flight since you don't know for sure it is functioning correctly until you pull a performance report, how can he tell me I'm not allowed to fly the unit for troubleshooting and diagnostic purposes? Pulling a function report is how I know it is or isn't working correctly, and what needs to be addressed. Many first, second or multiple flights often times have issues with the ADS-B out. That's why we pull the reports, is so we can find and resolve the issues.

What I learned is that the guy in DC only seemed to understand 1090-ES functionality, and had extremely limited knowledge of the interaction between a UAT-Out unit and the transponder. And they seem to be completely inflexible when it comes to giving any leeway to diagnose and repair a problem. His only solution was that it had to be shipped back to the manufacturer for repairs even though that wasn't going to affect the issue one way or the other since I was having a dynamic interaction problem that was only showing up in flight.

I finally swapped ADS-B units between my planes effectively moving the problem unit to a different registration number while I resolved the issue. This particular unit seemed to have chronic issues with query and reply communications between it and my transponders, both of which are newer digital transponders. It would work perfectly on the ground, then get a failing error rate on the pressure altitude once I was in the air. If I remember right >2% error rate is failing. I was able to eventually resolve the issue, but the FAA telling me I wasn't allowed to turn it on wasn't helpful in the resolution.

-Cub Builder
 
Applied for my rebate wed evening, sent the requested 337 documentation Thursday morning,
and received a "check's in the mail" email Thursday afternoon.
Looking forward to getting my rebate soon--
FWIW a buddy of mine installed his Tailbeacon on sept 27,
and just got his rebate check yesterday-- so about a 2 week wait.
 
I had one of those conversations with the ADS-B Nazis in DC as well. The guy was polite, but inflexible. He told me my altitude reporting wasn't working correctly (actually, it wasn't reporting pressure altitude at all) and suggested I return the unit to the manufacturer. I told him I was aware of the problem, the unit had been to the manufacturer numerous times without resolution and I was actively working on the issue with the manufacturer. Then he said I would not be allowed to fly in ADS-B airspace with a unit that wasn't passing. OK, so ADS-B isn't even a rule yet (and most ATC facilities couldn't receive ADS-B information a year ago when I had this conversation with them), so what air space was considered to be "ADS-B Air space" since the rule doesn't apply until 2020? I was flying in a remote area nowhere near any controlled air space and was staying far away from controlled air space while I worked on the problem. Additionally, the first flight with any ADS-B unit is a test flight since you don't know for sure it is functioning correctly until you pull a performance report, how can he tell me I'm not allowed to fly the unit for troubleshooting and diagnostic purposes? Pulling a function report is how I know it is or isn't working correctly, and what needs to be addressed. Many first, second or multiple flights often times have issues with the ADS-B out. That's why we pull the reports, is so we can find and resolve the issues.

What I learned is that the guy in DC only seemed to understand 1090-ES functionality, and had extremely limited knowledge of the interaction between a UAT-Out unit and the transponder. And they seem to be completely inflexible when it comes to giving any leeway to diagnose and repair a problem. His only solution was that it had to be shipped back to the manufacturer for repairs even though that wasn't going to affect the issue one way or the other since I was having a dynamic interaction problem that was only showing up in flight.

I finally swapped ADS-B units between my planes effectively moving the problem unit to a different registration number while I resolved the issue. This particular unit seemed to have chronic issues with query and reply communications between it and my transponders, both of which are newer digital transponders. It would work perfectly on the ground, then get a failing error rate on the pressure altitude once I was in the air. If I remember right >2% error rate is failing. I was able to eventually resolve the issue, but the FAA telling me I wasn't allowed to turn it on wasn't helpful in the resolution.

-Cub Builder

Interesting. The gent I spoke with, as I was experiencing similar problems never suggested I shouldn’t fly the airplane. The instruction not to fly the airplane in ADS-B airspace, he explained to me simply meant I shouldn’t fly the plane in B, C, or above 10,000 AFTER the 2020 deadline. He told me to upload the latest firmware, and fly it again. I asked what the consequences would be if it continued to fail. His response was that he’d “block” my ADS-B signal in their system, but I’d still be legal to fly outside ADS-B airspace.
I subsequently got a positive report after uploading the firmware.
MTV
 
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