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Thread: ADS-B Issues

  1. #41
    mvivion's Avatar
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    If you order one of the uAvionix units, either the tail beacon or the sky beacon, you want to ensure that the unit has 1.4.0 software installed. If not, go to uAvionix web site, and look for the update link.

    You'll have to use a PC to do the update, I was told that there is no compatibility with Apple devices. The update takes all of about 30 seconds, but it's designed to "fix" some of the issues I've been experiencing.

    MTV
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  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    I feel lucky I live in the sticks and don't need this stuff.

    Why not install a skyBeacon instead. Way simpler with the only modification being a .125" thick aluminum spacer on a stock Piper nav light bracket? And the skyBeacon is cheaper than the tailBeacon.

    Steve--I have Whelan strobes on wing tips and they eliminate requirement for anti collision light and no anti collision light on fuselage
    Marine Corps Aviation since 1966

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    Steve, Unfortunately Seaworthy's airport has the outer edge of a class B airspace touching one side of the traffic pattern. Why not just make a spacer which pushes the tail beacon further out? That shouldn't be too difficult.
    Pete---there has to be a reasonably easy fix
    Marine Corps Aviation since 1966

  4. #44
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seaworthy View Post
    Pete---there has to be a reasonably easy fix
    I have something in mind.
    N1PA
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  5. #45
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FdxLou View Post
    Pacific Coast Avionics shipped my TSO/STC’d TailBeacon for the 180 on Thursday.
    Should have it installed by Wednesday.
    Lou
    Do you call Pacific Coast Avionics when your airplane breaks Lou? Or to get to your airline pilot side " I could have saved you some money on that Lou".
    Steve Pierce

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  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    I have something in mind.
    You can cut and weld on the rudder and repair fabric or make a spacer that is a bout an inch plus longer for it to stick out but would make it easy to get knocked off. I'd put it on the wing tip and be done with it. Super simple and you can see a tube and fabric Piper's strobes from behind in bright daylight no matter what the charts etc say. I have followed my Dad all over the country in his Clipper with them
    Steve Pierce

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  7. #47
    Seaworthy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    You can cut and weld on the rudder and repair fabric or make a spacer that is a bout an inch plus longer for it to stick out but would make it easy to get knocked off. I'd put it on the wing tip and be done with it. Super simple and you can see a tube and fabric Piper's strobes from behind in bright daylight no matter what the charts etc say. I have followed my Dad all over the country in his Clipper with them
    If you install ADS B Out device forward or aft of the nav light-- won't that obscure the visibility of that light from other aircraft? Would you install it a considerable distance from the nav/ strobe light on the wing tip? Are there any photos of such an install?
    Marine Corps Aviation since 1966

  8. #48
    wireweinie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seaworthy View Post
    If you install ADS B Out device forward or aft of the nav light-- won't that obscure the visibility of that light from other aircraft? Would you install it a considerable distance from the nav/ strobe light on the wing tip? Are there any photos of such an install?
    Google search for uAvionics. Plenty of pictures.

    Also, could you explain what light assemblies you have installed on the wings and tail currently? You lost me on post #42.

    Web
    Life's tough . . . wear a cup.

  9. #49
    Seaworthy's Avatar
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    Marine Corps Aviation since 1966

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seaworthy View Post
    If you install ADS B Out device forward or aft of the nav light-- won't that obscure the visibility of that light from other aircraft? Would you install it a considerable distance from the nav/ strobe light on the wing tip? Are there any photos of such an install?
    It replaces the nav light and contains a Nav light and strobe in one unit with the ADS-B out. Wired to your nav light switch so no extra wiring or anything.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Steve Pierce

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  11. #51
    Seaworthy's Avatar
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    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	44605 The strobes are on a separate circuit breaker and on off switch from nav lights. The Whelan strobes are STC'd. Would this new strobe-- which it appears cast light laterally rather than fore and aft, negate the Whelan STC because it is not visible 270 degrees? Or is it visible 270 degrees? Interestingly-- that is the light you repaired Steve ten years ago at New Holstein.
    Last edited by Seaworthy; 09-22-2019 at 06:29 PM.
    Marine Corps Aviation since 1966

  12. #52
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    I have replaced several Whelen nav/strobe lights with the skyBeacon. Same view of strobe and nav light. I disconnect the wire out to the strobe from the power supply and connect it to the wire coming from the strobe switch to the power supply. That way strobes still work on one switch as do nav lights/ADS-B.
    Steve Pierce

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    Will Rogers

  13. #53
    mvivion's Avatar
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    I would point out that the anti collision light on the SkyBeacon is NOT a strobe. It is an LED . It’s bright as hell, but doesn’t look quite like a strobe.

    Seaworthy, this unit is a legal replacement for both the nav light and the anti collision light. In other words, it meets the azimuth visibility requirements.

    MTV

  14. #54

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    To go way back to #1 of the original post, I've read somewhere that some of the "FlightAware" type websites are putting up their own ground receivers. No way to go anonymous, unless they plan to pay for the stations with your payoffs. If the FAA data stream is free (is it?) what other motivation is there? In the 30 years its has taken to get the system off the ground, encryption has become cheap and common. Sigh..
    What's a go-around?

  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skywalker View Post
    To go way back to #1 of the original post, I've read somewhere that some of the "FlightAware" type websites are putting up their own ground receivers. No way to go anonymous, unless they plan to pay for the stations with your payoffs. If the FAA data stream is free (is it?) what other motivation is there? In the 30 years its has taken to get the system off the ground, encryption has become cheap and common. Sigh..
    Here's a non-commercial ADS-B site run by enthusiasts: https://www.adsbexchange.com

    Click on the radar icon on the right. You can zoom out and drag to anywhere in the world, and set that location as a default. The receivers are provided by volunteers and are not tied in to the FAA.
    Idaho drinks more wine per person than any other state in the country.

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    A little off center of topic but I think worthy of some consideration. Two flight
    instructors went to pick up the Mooney one of them had purchased. The plane was
    in excellent condition except for an electrical glitch in the avionics. Also
    equipped with ADS-B out. Flight of only a few hundred miles to get it home. They
    launched and almost immediately lost communications but continued the VFR flight
    at 25-2800 feet and arrived home without incident- so they thought. It seems the
    ADS-B unit was broadcasting their altitude as 25-28 THOUSAND feet for some reason. Since they
    were showing up on the screens but were incommunicado multiple commercial flights were diverted by ATC. Military
    jets were scrambled to look for the Mooney but were unable to find it at the high altitude. Our guys
    were showing the plane to their buddies at the airport when Feds showed up.
    Explanations were made. NASA reports have been filed, and hopefully all is well.
    Be careful about ADSB-out. It can bite you in ways nobody expected and haven't thought of yet.
    You can't get there from here. You have to go over yonder and start from there.
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  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvivion View Post
    1. When you have your ADS-B Out unit set to "Anonymous mode", the unit still transmits your tail number to the FAA. The only anonymity is that your tail number is blocked to the "Public". So, if you're paranoid about Joe the child molester down the street possibly tracking you, set that puppy to anonymous mode, but understand that the FAA will still receive all the data they would have if the unit were in normal mode.
    This long thread on the Van's site describes some testing done by individuals to determine just how anonymous these devices really are: http://www.vansairforce.com/communit...d.php?t=168704

    "Anonymous Mode" may be more or less anonymous depending on the ADS-B Out vendor's implementation and what type of transponder you have. From what I've been able to gather, a Garmin GDL-82 in anonymous mode (pin 5 grounded) paired with a Mode C transponder squawking 1200 will not transmit uniquely identifying information, except possibly for the first few seconds after powering up. uAvionix devices have similar behavior that may be fixed with a firmware update.

    I plan to do some of my own testing once everything is wired up. The only way to be really sure you aren't transmitting identifying information is to not transmit anything at all. Not legal for most, and not operationally feasible for many, regardless of legality.

  18. #58
    Eddie Foy's Avatar
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    Mode C can do the same thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by N86250 View Post
    A little off center of topic but I think worthy of some consideration. Two flight
    instructors went to pick up the Mooney one of them had purchased. The plane was
    in excellent condition except for an electrical glitch in the avionics. Also
    equipped with ADS-B out. Flight of only a few hundred miles to get it home. They
    launched and almost immediately lost communications but continued the VFR flight
    at 25-2800 feet and arrived home without incident- so they thought. It seems the
    ADS-B unit was broadcasting their altitude as 25-28 THOUSAND feet for some reason. Since they
    were showing up on the screens but were incommunicado multiple commercial flights were diverted by ATC. Military
    jets were scrambled to look for the Mooney but were unable to find it at the high altitude. Our guys
    were showing the plane to their buddies at the airport when Feds showed up.
    Explanations were made. NASA reports have been filed, and hopefully all is well.
    Be careful about ADSB-out. It can bite you in ways nobody expected and haven't thought of yet.
    "Put out my hand and touched the face of God!"

  19. #59
    OldCuby's Avatar
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    I just received my uAvionix tailbeacon but I take from this thread, it will not fit to replace a Super Cub taillight. I'd be interested if anyone successfully fits it to a standard SC rudder.

    I have Whelen Orion 650 wingtip led position and anti-collision lights I'd like to keep.
    I'm in no hurry to install so I'll see what my several friendly A&P/IAs have to say.

    As a near last resort, I'd consider the skyBeacon. Or sell the tailBeacon (also find out return policy) and say the hell with it.
    I can fly over nearly all of beautiful almost heaven West Virginia without it. Plane's based outside Mode C but house unfortunately is just inside. No more sky waves to the wife!

    Jim

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  20. #60

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    It won't fit a standard tail light mount? That is what it is designed to do. What changes do I have to make to the Super Cub rudder? Now is the time - we are running wires back there next week!
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  21. #61

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    From all the reports I’ve heard, the OD of the skybeacon is larger than the ID of the Piper ring welded in the trailing edge. If you open it up so the Skybeacon fits, there isn’t enough structure left. I think Steve Pierce has confirmed this.


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  22. #62

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    Good thing I welded 1/16" steel in there. Still need to know the required opening diameter.

  23. #63

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    Quote Originally Posted by bob turner View Post
    Good thing I welded 1/16" steel in there. Still need to know the required opening diameter.
    There is a drawing of the unit on their wed site. Looks like 1.142 dia, 1.583 deep. They use a mount ring that attaches to the rudder flange. Then the actual unit has 4 prongs that stick out to engage the mount ring. Go to the uAvionix web site and look at the data sheet for it.


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  24. #64

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    1.14" - Bart posted a drawing on the champcitabriadecathlon forum.

    The drawing shows four slots - no dimensions. Does this thing screw in as with interrupted threads?

    I am going to do it anyway. Even I can weld in a tail light bracket.

  25. #65

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    Thanks Dave - we posted simultaneously. Good thing I have a spare Decathlon rudder. Time to get more acetylene.

  26. #66
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    So why would you cut, weld and recover your rudder when you can bolt it on the wing tip?
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Steve Pierce

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  27. #67
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    Steve, my impression is that even if the support ring fit, the electronics are too wide to fit between the fabric surfaces without rubbing. True?
    Idaho drinks more wine per person than any other state in the country.

  28. #68
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sjohnson View Post
    Steve, my impression is that even if the support ring fit, the electronics are too wide to fit between the fabric surfaces without rubbing. True?
    That was my impression as well when looking at the unit. It was a disappointment to say the least.
    Steve Pierce

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  29. #69
    hotrod180's Avatar
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    Why not the Skybeacon?
    Personally i think its ugly.
    In fact, so is the Tailbeacon,
    but imho less noticeable on tbe tail.
    Also imho less prone to damage on the tail--
    Ive knocked off a wingtip nav light before,
    but never an aft nav light (yet).
    I also dont like the lack of symetry with two different looking wingtip arrangements--
    must be my OCD tendencies.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!
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  30. #70
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    Mike, how did you update the skybeacon software--
    Download to PC, then plug a (USB?) cord between it & the unit?
    If so, did you have to remove the unit from the airplane?
    Or is it some sort of wireless magic?
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

  31. #71
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hotrod180 View Post
    Why not the Skybeacon?
    Personally i think its ugly.
    In fact, so is the Tailbeacon,
    but imho less noticeable on tbe tail.
    Also imho less prone to damage on the tail--
    Ive knocked off a wingtip nav light before,
    but never an aft nav light (yet).
    I also dont like the lack of symetry with two different looking wingtip arrangements--
    must be my OCD tendencies.
    It is a compromise, inexpensive to buy the equipment and to install. If you don't like the looks there are a bunch of alternatives. All it takes is cubic dollars and the choices are out there
    Steve Pierce

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  32. #72
    kestrel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sjohnson View Post
    Here's a non-commercial ADS-B site run by enthusiasts: https://www.adsbexchange.com

    Click on the radar icon on the right. You can zoom out and drag to anywhere in the world, and set that location as a default. The receivers are provided by volunteers and are not tied in to the FAA.
    It is worth reading the home page on that web site and consider it in the context of privacy and stalkers of various forms. I don't fault the people running the site. I fault the FAA for not taking privacy seriously. It seems clear that information and safety were not the top priority when developing ADSB. Enhancing Big Brother's surveillance capabilities appear to have been the only serious priority.

    Read this also:
    https://www.adsbexchange.com/2015/10...s-on-security/
    --
    Bearhawk, RV-4

  33. #73
    mvivion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hotrod180 View Post
    Mike, how did you update the skybeacon software--
    Download to PC, then plug a (USB?) cord between it & the unit?
    If so, did you have to remove the unit from the airplane?
    Or is it some sort of wireless magic?
    Its actually quite simple, but there isn’t much explanation on uAvionix web site. You need a PC, preferably a sorta portable one. With connection to internet, go to uAvionix website and click on update link. There are a couple. First, upload the one that’s called the “update tool”, then locate the one that has the update software for version 1.4.0, and upload that.

    Now go to airport, and turn on the SkyBeacon. On your laptop, go to settings WiFi and look for the SkyBeacon WiFi. Connect to that.

    Open the install tool software on the PC, and it will automatically upload the update. If you are inside a Hangar, you’ll need to look at the bottom right of the update screen, and uncheck the GPS related box. Once the software loads, Close out the PC, then with your smart phone, verify that the SkyBeacon software is now 1.4.0.

    It takes a lot longer to write it out than to do it. Upload takes 15 to 30 seconds. If it takes longer, AND you’re in a Hangar, look at the bottom right of the screen that comes up with the update tool. There’s a box there marked GPS. Uncheck that box since you’re not going to receive location data, and try the upload again.

    if you’re outdoors, it should upload without unchecking that box.

    Thats it.

    MTV
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  34. #74
    Gordon Misch's Avatar
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    If I were starting with an uncovered rudder, I think I'd consider doing what it takes to put the tail beacon in, including fairing the fabric somehow. But also use a conventional strobe / tail light with a separate ring. The main reason is because the wingtip model's strobe is so deficient. I assume it's legal, but it's not at all bright. One thought against that plan would be if the strobe wiring interfered with the ADSB function.
    Gordon

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  35. #75

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    A small fabric repair takes about twice as long as the welding. I am not going to hesitate. I haven't ordered yet, but have chosen Steve P as my dealer.

  36. #76
    OldCuby's Avatar
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    I contacted uAvionix and they will contact me later with info to exchange the tailBeacon for the skyBeacon. My current wing tip strobes are synchronized but they said there is no way to have the skyBeacon synchronized with my remaining tip strobe. Intensities may be different too. Bummer!

    It still my be worth opening up the rudder fabric and modifying the mounting ring. I'll discuss it with my tube and fabric mechanic before I make the switch. Hopefully such a nonstrucural mod would not trigger any undue FAA concern.

    Jim


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  37. #77
    hotrod180's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    It is a compromise, inexpensive to buy the equipment and to install. If you don't like the looks there are a bunch of alternatives. All it takes is cubic dollars and the choices are out there
    I have purchased the Tailbeacon instead of the slightly cheaper Skybeacon because the reasons in post #69.
    It comes out as the best (for me) compromise between cost, ease of installation, looks, etc .

    Quote Originally Posted by Gordon Misch View Post
    If I were starting with an uncovered rudder, I think I'd consider doing what it takes to put the tail beacon in, including fairing the fabric somehow. But also use a conventional strobe / tail light with a separate ring. The main reason is because the wingtip model's strobe is so deficient. I assume it's legal, but it's not at all bright. One thought against that plan would be if the strobe wiring interfered with the ADSB function.
    Gordon, not sure if you know but FYI the Tailbeacon does not include a strobe feature--
    just ADS-B out and an LED nav light.

    https://uavionix.com/products/tailbeacon/
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

  38. #78
    hotrod180's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldCuby View Post
    I just received my uAvionix tailbeacon but I take from this thread, it will not fit to replace a Super Cub taillight. I'd be interested if anyone successfully fits it to a standard SC rudder. …..

    I just noticed this unusual nav light installation on a local Cub.
    Maybe applicable to mounting a Tailbeacon?
    It would be a lot less noticeable if the sealant matched the paint.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!
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  39. #79
    Gordon Misch's Avatar
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    Gordon, not sure if you know but FYI the Tailbeacon does not include a strobe feature--
    Yes, I knew that - thanks. That's why I was pondering a separate Wheelen unit on the tail.
    Gordon

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  40. #80
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hotrod180 View Post
    I just noticed this unusual nav light installation on a local Cub.
    Maybe applicable to mounting a Tailbeacon?
    It would be a lot less noticeable if the sealant matched the paint.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    would they play nice together??? noise wise??

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