Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 40 of 68

Thread: Matco Tailwheels?

  1. #1

    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    England
    Posts
    322
    Post Thanks / Like

    Matco Tailwheels?

    Has anyone tried one of the 8” pneumatic tyre, double strut Matco Tailwheels on their Cub? Successful or otherwise if yes?

    Same question on their wheel/brake combos, my 12 still has the bag brakes and I’d LOVE an affordable disc upgrade route

    Thanks!!


    Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Last edited by Philly5G; 01-22-2019 at 05:40 PM. Reason: Forgot the wheels!,
    Thanks NDRII thanked for this post

  2. #2
    txpacer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Iowa Park, TX
    Posts
    618
    Post Thanks / Like
    We had a fat Matco on a Legend Cub. It was great on grass and dirt, but we couldn't get it to not shimmy on pavement.
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes Philly5G liked this post

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    118
    Post Thanks / Like
    [QUOTE=Philly5G;737862]Has anyone tried one of the 8” pneumatic tyre, double strut Matco Tailwheels on their Cub? Successful or otherwise if yes?

    Same question on their wheel/brake combos, my 12 still has the bag brakes and I’d LOVE an affordable disc upgrade route

    Thanks!!
    You can’t go wrong with Matco products! Their 8” tailwheel wheel and steering mechanism works great on a RANS S-7S. Not a cub like you’re asking about, however, it’s close lol.
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes Philly5G liked this post

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    England
    Posts
    322
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by txpacer View Post
    We had a fat Matco on a Legend Cub. It was great on grass and dirt, but we couldn't get it to not shimmy on pavement.
    Thanks for that! Is that small vibration, or teeth loosening and coffee spilling shimmying, leading to tank slapping and fish tailing?!!


    Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app

  5. #5
    txpacer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Iowa Park, TX
    Posts
    618
    Post Thanks / Like
    It was pretty bad, but only on pavement. Never figured out why. It's on a shelf now.
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes Philly5G liked this post

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    England
    Posts
    322
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by txpacer View Post
    It was pretty bad, but only on pavement. Never figured out why. It's on a shelf now.
    Hmmmmmmm....... that’s pretty much the LAST thing I need, as I rarely use pavement THANK YOU for that KEY feedback!!!


    Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app

  7. #7
    hotrod180's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Port Townsend, WA
    Posts
    2,522
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by txpacer View Post
    We had a fat Matco on a Legend Cub. It was great on grass and dirt, but we couldn't get it to not shimmy on pavement.
    A guy on my airport owned a Legend Cub for a while, it had a Matco tailwheel.
    I don't recall hearing anything either good or bad about how it worked,
    but IMHO it just looked cheesy. Really cheesy.
    I'd have swapped it out for one of those API tailwheels, or maybe an inflatable Maule.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes Philly5G liked this post

  8. #8
    cubdriver2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    upstate NY
    Posts
    9,750
    Post Thanks / Like
    I thought Legend came with an API 6131?

    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    England
    Posts
    322
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by cubdriver2 View Post
    I thought Legend came with an API 6131?

    Glenn
    API 6131 is an option for me I guess and pretty inexpensive. I’ve currently got a pretty tired Scott 2000 and really like the chunky look and perceived ride quality of the Scott/ABI 3200, although obviously relatively expensive. The 2000 and similar just look a bit spindly on the 12 I think?


    Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app

  10. #10

    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    England
    Posts
    322
    Post Thanks / Like

    Matco Tailwheels?

    Quote Originally Posted by hotrod180 View Post
    A guy on my airport owned a Legend Cub for a while, it had a Matco tailwheel.
    I don't recall hearing anything either good or bad about how it worked,
    but IMHO it just looked cheesy. Really cheesy.
    I'd have swapped it out for one of those API tailwheels, or maybe an inflatable Maule.
    Good point on the API, see my last post for detail


    Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app

  11. #11
    Richgj3's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    LI,NY
    Posts
    934
    Post Thanks / Like
    First Legends used the solid Maule. Later ones used the solid Matco. It was better. I had the Maule and my buddy had the Matco. I flew both, mostly off hard surfaces. No issues with shimmy. These were the original AL3 planes. The Super Legends must use something more robust.

    Rich

  12. #12

    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    118
    Post Thanks / Like
    Well now. My cheesy ol Matco tailwheel works great and looks good too! Would imagine a fat a$$ tailwheel might behave kinda weird on pavement. Maybe. Better then a half a change something else was at play.

  13. #13

    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    118
    Post Thanks / Like
    “Real cheesy” lol!

  14. #14
    txpacer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Iowa Park, TX
    Posts
    618
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by RoddyM View Post
    Well now. My cheesy ol Matco tailwheel works great and looks good too! Would imagine a fat a$$ tailwheel might behave kinda weird on pavement. Maybe. Better then a half a change something else was at play.
    Very possible, I just couldn't get it to work. I figured it was something about the flat, wide lawn tractor tire that didn't like pavement.
    Likes RoddyM liked this post

  15. #15
    flyrite's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Lyons,GA
    Posts
    389
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by RoddyM View Post
    “Real cheesy” lol!
    Buy an API....Then MAKE IT CHESSY !



    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	2F78EAF8-D155-4227-820F-51ECB03AB59A.jpeg 
Views:	156 
Size:	79.0 KB 
ID:	41082
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post

  16. #16

    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    England
    Posts
    322
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by flyrite View Post
    Buy an API....Then MAKE IT CHESSY !



    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	2F78EAF8-D155-4227-820F-51ECB03AB59A.jpeg 
Views:	156 
Size:	79.0 KB 
ID:	41082
    Tailwheel trainer wheels, or a triple decker cheesy burger?


    Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Likes flyrite liked this post

  17. #17
    PerryB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Northern Calif.
    Posts
    1,763
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by txpacer View Post
    We had a fat Matco on a Legend Cub. It was great on grass and dirt, but we couldn't get it to not shimmy on pavement.
    I watched a guy land a Mackey Cub at McCall a couple years ago (with a Matco) and that thing was doing 360's.
    After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF !
    Likes mike mcs repair liked this post

  18. #18
    cubdriver2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    upstate NY
    Posts
    9,750
    Post Thanks / Like
    The API solid molded tire is as soft as a properly inflated 3200 tire. I machined a few to fit on a Scott 2000 and the 501 Lang, add the hubcap and nobody can tell the difference. Makes them ride like a Caddy, smoooooooooooooth.







    Glenn
    Last edited by cubdriver2; 01-22-2019 at 09:17 PM.
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post

  19. #19

    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    England
    Posts
    322
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by cubdriver2 View Post
    The API solid molded tire is as soft as a properly inflated 3200 tire. I machined a few to fit on a Scott 2000 and the 501 Lang, add the hubcap and nobody can tell the difference. Makes them ride like a Caddy, smoooooooooooooth.







    Glenn
    Is that a 6131?


    Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app

  20. #20

    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    118
    Post Thanks / Like
    Which part was doing said “360s” lol! If it was “the plane” he needs a look at Trent Palmer’s most recent YouTube on ground loops. Was a good refresher for me anyway. Gotta love this “good accurate info” lol!
    Keep er comin!
    Likes Eddie747 liked this post

  21. #21

    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Posts
    73
    Post Thanks / Like
    Just bought this on craigslist for $50. needs a new tire, what size axel is that wheel from API?






  22. #22

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Posts
    6,634
    Post Thanks / Like
    I love that lathe. 9” South Bend? I use Maules on both Cubs, but am ready to try an API.

    There are two secrets to shimmy - well, three:

    1. Kingpin absolutely vertical under normal load.
    2. Friction damping between kingpin and bearing
    3. Forget about big fat tires. They are horrible on pavement, unless you have a locking mechanism. The 2:80x2:50x4 tire is ok if kept above 50 psi.
    Likes Beaverpilot liked this post

  23. #23
    cubdriver2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    upstate NY
    Posts
    9,750
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Philly5G View Post
    Is that a 6131?


    Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    No, it's a Scott 2000 with an API wheel.

    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes Philly5G liked this post

  24. #24
    AdirondackCub's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Ballston Spa, NY
    Posts
    138
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Philly5G View Post
    API 6131 is an option for me I guess and pretty inexpensive. I’ve currently got a pretty tired Scott 2000 and really like the chunky look and perceived ride quality of the Scott/ABI 3200, although obviously relatively expensive. The 2000 and similar just look a bit spindly on the 12 I think?


    Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    We recommend that or the baby bush tail wheel only for the most rugged back country. As mentioned it can be pretty grabby on asphalt. Further it does change your AOA.


    Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Mark Keneston
    Cub Crafters
    Northeast Reagion Sales
    Ballston Spa, NY
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes Philly5G liked this post

  25. #25

    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    England
    Posts
    322
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by AdirondackCub View Post
    We recommend that or the baby bush tail wheel only for the most rugged back country. As mentioned it can be pretty grabby on asphalt. Further it does change your AOA.

    Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Thanks Mark, do you mean you only recommend the API 6131 for only the most rugged back country? I'm basically looking for a beefier and well handling (across all surfaces except gravel bars etc!!) tailwheel for my PA-12, as all the others I see seem to have the Scott/ABI 3200 and the tired Scott 2000 mine came with has been workaround repaired. I operate from grass 95% of the time and need my tarmac/pavement handling to be good when I venture on to it

  26. #26
    hotrod180's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Port Townsend, WA
    Posts
    2,522
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie747 View Post
    Just bought this on craigslist for $50. needs a new tire, what size axel is that wheel from API?
    That's a non-swiveling tailwheel.
    It looks cool but IMHO it'd be less than satisfactory for actual use on an airplane.
    Think how often you swivel your t/w around when ground handling or when maneuvering around in tight quarters.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes Philly5G liked this post

  27. #27
    hotrod180's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Port Townsend, WA
    Posts
    2,522
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by RoddyM View Post
    Well now. My cheesy ol Matco tailwheel works great and looks good too! Would imagine a fat a$$ tailwheel might behave kinda weird on pavement. Maybe. Better then a half a change something else was at play.
    Sorry if my "cheesy" comment about Matco t/w offended you.
    I just checked the Matco website--
    the dual-fork models look better, but I still don't care for the looks of the single fork version.

    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

  28. #28
    hotrod180's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Port Townsend, WA
    Posts
    2,522
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by PerryB View Post
    I watched a guy land a Mackey Cub at McCall a couple years ago (with a Matco) and that thing was doing 360's.
    I've seen the 360'ing tailwheel thing before.
    First time was on a Seabee, the tailwheel whirled around like a dervish.
    Amazingly, it didn't seem to affect the behavior of the airplane, whereas a shimmy generally does.
    Seen the whirling t/w phenomenon a few times since then--
    it never fails to amaze me.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes Philly5G liked this post

  29. #29
    cubdriver2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    upstate NY
    Posts
    9,750
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie747 View Post
    Just bought this on craigslist for $50. needs a new tire, what size axel is that wheel from API?





    The tires they sell for that size fits Scott 2000, 3000, Heath, Lang TWs. Very hard rubber and last a hundred years. The API tire is molded to an Alum hub with a grease fitting. It used a flanged step bearing. I think it's .500" shaft size. The tire rubber is similar to the superball balls we had years ago. You can take the unit and drop it and it will bounce back up after hitting the floor. Spruce sells the whole tire/hub with bearings for around $40. Easy to modify if you want to play around. You can buy better quality bearings on the same page cheap.



    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"

  30. #30
    cubdriver2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    upstate NY
    Posts
    9,750
    Post Thanks / Like
    Looking at Spruce found this, who makes it?



    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"

  31. #31
    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    3,736
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by cubdriver2 View Post
    Looking at Spruce found this, who makes it?



    Glenn

    Matco



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  32. #32

    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Posts
    73
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by hotrod180 View Post
    That's a non-swiveling tailwheel.
    It looks cool but IMHO it'd be less than satisfactory for actual use on an airplane.
    Think how often you swivel your t/w around when ground handling or when maneuvering around in tight quarters.
    Decided to not buy it, thanks.

  33. #33

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Posts
    6,634
    Post Thanks / Like
    I have one of those, and used it for a while. Not worth the effort. Here is one of my lathes - a work of art!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	South Bend 9 inch lathe.jpg 
Views:	107 
Size:	97.0 KB 
ID:	41107  
    Likes mike mcs repair, RaisedByWolves liked this post

  34. #34
    cubunltd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Belle Vernon,PA
    Posts
    1,138
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by bob turner View Post
    I have one of those, and used it for a while. Not worth the effort. Here is one of my lathes - a work of art!
    The most common reason tail wheels shimmy is because of a negative caster angle. It may be positive when empty, but egative when the airplane is loaded.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes Philly5G liked this post

  35. #35

    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    England
    Posts
    322
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by cubunltd View Post
    The most common reason tail wheels shimmy is because of a negative caster angle. It may be positive when empty, but egative when the airplane is loaded.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Does negative mean the bottom of the pivot pin is further back than the top of the pin? I can see this angle increasing as the weight at the tail increases and the spring angle to the ground decreases from its (45 degree) angle when load weight is added


    Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org mobile app

  36. #36
    Eddie Foy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    3,347
    Post Thanks / Like
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caster_angle


    Quote Originally Posted by Philly5G View Post
    Does negative mean the bottom of the pivot pin is further back than the top of the pin? I can see this angle increasing as the weight at the tail increases and the spring angle to the ground decreases from its (45 degree) angle when load weight is added


    Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    "Put out my hand and touched the face of God!"

  37. #37
    cubunltd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Belle Vernon,PA
    Posts
    1,138
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Philly5G View Post
    Does negative mean the bottom of the pivot pin is further back than the top of the pin? I can see this angle increasing as the weight at the tail increases and the spring angle to the ground decreases from its (45 degree) angle when load weight is added


    Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Yes you are correct. Bottom of pin is further back then the top. Re-arch the spring so that it is at a positive angle when loaded. Or you may be able to shim the tail wheel with a tapered shim.
    Its like a grocery cart that has a wherl shimmy. Its because the whell is bentback giving it a negative angle. The front wheels on your car have a positivr caster so the wheels have rendency to straighten themselves out.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes Philly5G, bob turner liked this post

  38. #38
    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    3,736
    Post Thanks / Like



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes Chicken Hawk, Philly5G, L18C-95 liked this post

  39. #39
    cubunltd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Belle Vernon,PA
    Posts
    1,138
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by RaisedByWolves View Post



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    You beat me to it Raised by Wolves

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes Philly5G liked this post

  40. #40
    txpacer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Iowa Park, TX
    Posts
    618
    Post Thanks / Like
    That's all great, but I think to the wide tire throws another dynamic into it. The API tailwheel was rock solid, but the fat Matco shimmied like a stripper, on the same spring.
    Thanks Philly5G thanked for this post
    Likes RaisedByWolves, flyrite, Philly5G liked this post

Similar Threads

  1. FS: Matco Master Cylinders
    By Barnstormer in forum Parts and Pieces
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 08-10-2018, 09:31 AM
  2. Grove vs. Matco
    By C-YQK in forum Tips and Tricks
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 07-30-2010, 12:51 PM
  3. Matco master cylinders
    By willirw in forum Experimental Cubs
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 03-31-2010, 12:48 PM

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •