Adel Clamps?

Our local hardware store carries adel clamps, that look the same as the ones you'd buy from an aircraft parts supplier. Are they legal to use on a certified airplane? Mainly looking to use them for the fuel lines?

MS 21919-????? is the realdeal part number stamped on the real Adel clamp. Probably make sure your IA approves the use of the hardware store version

Alas, "look" the same and the same are usually not the same.

from this site: http://www.aeroelectric.com/articles/adel.html

[h=1]Adel Clamps[/h]
[h=2]Everything you ever wanted to know but were afraid to ask[/h][h=3]by Bob Nuckolls[/h]

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I've seen some conversation recently concerning "Adel" clamps and their suitability for use around fuel, high temps, etc. I've pulled the specs and will excerpt some of their contents as follows:
The "Adel" clamp is more properly called an MS21919 aircraft clamp. The company named Adel built a goodly portion of the MS21919 clamps back in the 60's (and may still). The term sort of stuck on these devices in spite of the fact that they are now made by dozens of companies.
The full description for these clamps follows the convention MS21919WXXZZ where:
W = "wedge" feature in cushion that helps prevent escape of small wires out of cushion. Virtually all new production of MS21919 clamps below size 50 have the wedge feature...
XX characters have the following significance:
DE = Aluminum band, Ethylene Propylene Cushion (212F)
DF = Aluminum band, Nitrile Cushion (212F)
DG = Aluminum band, Chloroprene Cushion (212F)
CE = Corrosion Resistant Steel band, Ethylene Propylene Cushion (275F)
CF = Corrosion Resistant Steel band, Nitrile Propylene Cushion (200F)
CH = Corrosion Resistant Steel band, Silicone Cushion (400F)
CG = Corrosion Resistant Steel band, Chloroprene Cushion (212F)
CJ = Corrosion Resistant Steel band, Fluorosilicone Cushion (450F)
F = Low Carbon Steel Band, Nitrile Cushion (212F)
G = Low Carbon Steel Band, Chloroprene Cushion (212F)
H = Low Carbon Steel Band, Silicon Cushion (400F)
CAUTION - Clamps with low carbon steel bands are not recommended for new design and most were purged from stocks back in early 80's, however, you never know what might show up in the Fly-Market at OSH so I've included the "heads up" here.
[h=3]Cushion Application and Color Information:[/h]
Ethylene Propylene - for use in areas contaminated with phosphate- ester hydraulic fluid and other synthetic fluids. Excellent ozone resistance., Not resistant to petroleum based fluids. Color shall be solid purple.
Nitrile - for use primarily in fuel immersion and fuel vapors. Good ozone resistance. Not resistant to phosphate-ester based fluids. Not for use on titanium tubing. Color shall be solid yellow.
Chloroprene - for general purpose use in areas contaminated with petroleum based hydraulic fluids and occasional fuel splash. Excellent ozone resistant. Not resistant to phosphate-ester based fluids. Not for use on titanium tubing. Color shall be black with a blue identifier patch.
Silicone - for elevated temperature usage in phosphate-ester based fluid and other synthetic fluid contaminated areas. Unaffected by ozone. Not resistant to petroleum based fluids. Color shall be natural white.
Fluorosilicone - for elevated temperature usage in petroleum based fluid contaminated areas. Unaffected by ozone. Not resistant to phosphate-ester based fluids. Color shall be solid blue.
Silicone - RED now obsolete and used only on the low carbon Steel
The last characters (ZZ) are digits describing the internal diameter of the closed clamp in 1/16ths of an inch. E.G. an MS21219WDG4 is aluminum strap inside a chloroprene cushion and sized to support 1/4" diameter bundle of wires, tubing, etc.
I note that the spec does not speak to the "red" cushions currently being discussed. I recall seeing a number of clamps with red cushions over the years but quite frankly, I don't know if they were MS21919 or perhaps some other part number.UPDATE: All of the "reds" have been purged from Raytheon's stocks, couldn't even find one in the junk boxes that I had access to. Mr. Sobek says the one he found does carry the part number MS21919H** which tells us it is indeed the obsolete, low carbon steel version and silicon rubber (not recommended for use where "wet" with hydrocarbons.

Most of the stuff on a cub is ace hardware.

.....and some at National Aircraft Parts Association stores around the country

How much maney will you save using the hardware store clamps that probably came from China vs the real Adel clamps. When Piper built airplanes and used some automotive parts we didn't have cheap Chinesse copies.

The high temp cushion would be handy (for peace of mind) but what phosphate-ester based fluids would aviators run across?

This is what I could find with a quick search. You never know what kind of stuff people are using because they got it cheap, had a bottle of stuff on the shelf, or a buddy said it was the way to go. The 5056 stuff is mineral-based.

http://www.flight-mechanic.com/types-of-hydraulic-fluids/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydraulic_fluid

DENNY

I remember when Japan built cheap junk cars and trucks, and stole US made electronics. Now look at Japanese products, Honda, Toyota, etc. Don’t be so quick to knock the Chinese stuff so fast, times are changing, I wish I could say that for US manufacturing!

And, the discussion is not even about cars or trucks or electronics, it's about Adel clamps for crying out loud.
In my humble opinion, whether you use Adel clamps of any variety, wire ties with standoffs or rib stitch cord and you do a good job---
there you go--Bob's your Uncle. Or, if you use the correct P/N Adel clamp and do a crappy job, well there you go.
I've never really understood the "Bob's your Uncle" saying, by the way.

My uncle's name was Louie

What's really confusing to me is that I have an Uncle Bob. How did they know?

Go to Home Dpot and Lowes and buy hardware and tell me how it compares to what you use to buy in the Mom and Pop hardware stores. I worked in small Mom and Pop hardware stores through high school and college and the quality has gone to **** and look at the tags at where it is made. Look at plumbing fittings like the Weatherhead fittings Piper used and compare it to some of what you find at Auto Zone and O'Reillys. What I have seen hasn't been as good, thinner walls and crappy threads.

Yep, not just fittings, some nuts and bolts are pretty crappy quality. Sometimes a new nut won't screw onto a new bolt.

Thanks for the history on the Bob's your Uncle saying. I knew what it meant, but had no idea where it came from.

I got a box of grade 5 bolts for the snow blower on the tractor because the John Deere bolts are 1.30 each. Know how many I broke last year? A lot. Usually four or five a storm. Guess I’ll buy the John Deere bolts. Didn’t break those unless something got stuck in the auger.


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What is a snow blower?

RaisedByWolves said:

I got a box of grade 5 bolts for the snow blower on the tractor because the John Deere bolts are 1.30 each. Know how many I broke last year? A lot. Usually four or five a storm. Guess I’ll buy the John Deere bolts. Didn’t break those unless something got stuck in the auger.


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China knows how to make good parts, too, but the market wants cheap parts and China can do that better than anyone. You get what you pay for. And I hear some of you buy tools at Harbor Freight???

Eddie Foy said:

What is a snow blower?

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When the temps are around freezing or below, water falls from the sky, leaving a fun mess. The tractor has an attachment with an auger to remove that fun mess. You should come up and see it. Quite the marvel.


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Carey Gray said:

And, the discussion is not even about cars or trucks or electronics, it's about Adel clamps for crying out loud.
In my humble opinion, whether you use Adel clamps of any variety, wire ties with standoffs or rib stitch cord and you do a good job---
there you go--Bob's your Uncle. Or, if you use the correct P/N Adel clamp and do a crappy job, well there you go.
I've never really understood the "Bob's your Uncle" saying, by the way.

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Me neither...[emoji4]

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Go to the UK and you'll hear it. With sone UK accents you may not recognize it.

RaisedByWolves said:

I got a box of grade 5 bolts for the snow blower on the tractor because the John Deere bolts are 1.30 each. Know how many I broke last year? A lot. Usually four or five a storm. Guess I’ll buy the John Deere bolts. Didn’t break those unless something got stuck in the auger.


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I changed to a grade 8 bolt 20 years ago. Last one I ever had to buy. And I blow snow for 6 months some years

Glenn

Doesn't a grade 8 bolt kinda defeat the whole purpose of having a shear bolt??

stewartb said:

China knows how to make good parts, too, but the market wants cheap parts and China can do that better than anyone. You get what you pay for. And I hear some of you buy tools at Harbor Freight???

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Only the torque wrench I use for the prop bolts....

If I finish the 180 before I die I will come when this frozen water is not falling.

RaisedByWolves said:

When the temps are around freezing or below, water falls from the sky, leaving a fun mess. The tractor has an attachment with an auger to remove that fun mess. You should come up and see it. Quite the marvel.


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Someone asked an old Vermonter 'what do you do in the summer?' He says 'If it falls on a weekend I go fishing'

skipster said:

Doesn't a grade 8 bolt kinda defeat the whole purpose of having a shear bolt??

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That is what I was thinking but then I considered it was Glenn's post. 8)

skipster said:

Doesn't a grade 8 bolt kinda defeat the whole purpose of having a shear bolt??

Click to expand...

Kinda, everything you clear is paved, everything I clear is dirt, gravel or bank run gravel. The shear bolts that came with the blower last about 5 min. Grade 5 about 10 min. I either had to sell the blower or spend 20k to have everything paved. I don't like the look of pavement, looks like a city boy lives there.
The drive chain has broken once and I've saved about 1k not buying 10 shearbolts every day. Blower is still in nice shape and can throw a softball size rock as fast and far as a good college girls softball outfielder

Glenn