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Thread: Layout Instrument panel for NQ

  1. #1

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    Layout Instrument panel for NQ

    Hello, I’m new to the SC. I will get my own Cub late spring/early summer.
    Right now I’m trying to put together the best instrument panel setup from scratch. I am going for night certification. G5? What airspeed indicator altimeter and what altimeter/VSI and what gyro? Do you recommend an Engine monitor (the aircraft has a “standard” EGT/CHT monitor right now. Which Radio and transponder (Trigs?- small and I hear only good). iPad mount in the panel or on the “side”. Is anyone using a 9.7” iPad?
    What are your suggestions?

  2. #2
    wireweinie's Avatar
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    Strap on a helmet and your flak jacket, cause you're about to get a whole lot of incoming!

    First and foremost, everything should be as small and lightweight as you can afford. Whatever the brand or model. My recommendation would be an Electronics International CGR-30P for engine gauges. Winters, 2 1/4" airspeed and altimeter. If you use a VSI, just grab any cheap one, preferably in the 0 to 3000ft range. Trig or Becker radios and transponders. Big difference is that Beckers are a one piece unit and the Trigs are separate control head and transmitter box. If you require ADS-B, I feel that the Trig is easier to connect into the system. And I always recommend installing a stand alone intercom. You get better volume and easier squelch control than with the built in intercom in the com radio.

    You mentioned gyros. Is a gyro required for your certification? Is your night certification IFR or VFR? Are there specific instrumentation requirements for this?

    Web
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  3. #3
    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
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    Speaking of trigs, my display went on the tc90 comm. after a bit of going back and forth with the factory not getting anywhere, I remembered mid continent is who they use for us repair. Called them up, they said yeah it’s the display, 100 bucks we will send you a replacement and send the old one back. It was out of warranty, but they were fantastic to work with. And it’s super easy to pull the head unit out. New one works great. That was the only trouble I had with them so far in 400 hrs


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  4. #4
    wireweinie's Avatar
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    Great info. I'll keep Mid-Continent in mind for any future issues.

    Web
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  5. #5
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    you are about to discover the steel fuselage tubes hiding behind panel... THEY WILL DICTATE YOUR LAYOUT, and no mater how hard you try you WILL run into issues with them..

  6. #6
    wireweinie's Avatar
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    Heh heh. Oh yeah.

    Web
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  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by mike mcs repair View Post
    you are about to discover the steel fuselage tubes hiding behind panel... THEY WILL DICTATE YOUR LAYOUT, and no mater how hard you try you WILL run into issues with them..


    Like that? Click image for larger version. 

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  8. #8

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    Portable so not “certified” but for night flight I really like my Garmin 796 with the GDL 3D linked to it. In the hsi mode you can split the panel with the moving map or go full HSI and it is really slick plus you get ADS B. I have the 796 as the center of my panel and display vertical speed digitally on it so that saves a hole.
    Remember, These are the Good old Days!

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by OLDCROWE View Post
    Portable so not “certified” but for night flight I really like my Garmin 796 with the GDL 3D linked to it. In the hsi mode you can split the panel with the moving map or go full HSI and it is really slick plus you get ADS B. I have the 796 as the center of my panel and display vertical speed digitally on it so that saves a hole.

    Here is my new carbon fiber panel on Husky, pretty much same for cub.
    John
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  10. #10

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    Don’t skimp on a dimmer if you’re actually going to fly in the dark. I spent two hrs tonight with a microfiber towel over my brightest displays

  11. #11
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    I had the same sort of issue recently taking off at what was effectively dusk--
    not really, but pretty dark out due to low clouds & rain,
    and tablet display was bright enough to make the rest of the panel hard to see.
    I was at a towered airport & in a hurry so I just turned on my (battery powered) "Pilot Light Pro" overhead instrument lights.
    When I got back to my home airport about 20 minutes later, it was much brighter out and I forgot to turn the instr lights off--
    I don't night fly much & so they aren't part of my normal shutdown routine.
    Luckily a buddy stopped by to BS and happened to notice from in front of the airplane that they were still on--
    otherwise, it wouldn't been til I needed them again that I woulda discovered the dead battery.

    FWIW these instrument lights are plastic, battery powered,
    and (like most things in aviation) kinda spendy for what you're actually getting....
    but they were the most cost-effective solution I could find for instrument lighting that I'd only use very occasionally.
    I have the unit mounted to the bottom of the forward spar carrythrough.

    https://www.aircraftspruce.com/pages...otlightpro.php
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

  12. #12
    Stew's Avatar
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    Right now I’m trying to put together the best instrument panel setup from scratch.
    I am in exactly the same position with a certified PA18 rebuild in the UK. I have a new blank panel, a Trig TY91 comm and Trig TT21 Mode S and the old original instruments. Keen on a source of attitude reference, have sourced an electric AH but a Garmin G5 looks very good as there is an STC for it and you can toggle up an HSI display if required.

    When I flew the plane I used an iPad mini supported in a RAM mount with a suction cup attached to the lower right windscreen position.

  13. #13
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jokerswe2008 View Post
    Hello, I’m new to the SC. I will get my own Cub late spring/early summer.
    Right now I’m trying to put together the best instrument panel setup from scratch. I am going for night certification. G5? What airspeed indicator altimeter and what altimeter/VSI and what gyro? Do you recommend an Engine monitor (the aircraft has a “standard” EGT/CHT monitor right now. Which Radio and transponder (Trigs?- small and I hear only good). iPad mount in the panel or on the “side”. Is anyone using a 9.7” iPad?
    What are your suggestions?
    Have you seen the recent thread with panel pictures? http://www.supercub.org/forum/showth...54930-Cgr-30-p After flying with the iPad ina Super Cub I much prefer the Garmin 796. The glare is a problem with the iPad in a Super Cub at different times of day. I am a minimalist but I like my VSI, lets me know if I am climbing in the mountains. I really like the Trig radio and transponder. Built in intercom works well. Like Tom posted, Mid Continent does their service work. Bruce there is great to work with. Their warranty is 2 years and if you have a problem that warranty starts over. The Electronics International CGR30P is a great engine instrument for the Super Cub by integrating everything you need for the engine in one 3 1/8" instrument that is easy to see all the information. I have never had to buy new flight instruments, usually just get the old ones rebuilt due to cost of new certified. If you need help I am a Trig and Electronics International dealer, have layed out and installed quite a few Super Cub panels and can provide good pricing and technical advice if needed. It is fun to see these things come together.
    Steve Pierce

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  14. #14

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    Anti-glare screen protectors are almost as common as iPads.

    A minimal panel with an iPad Mini running GP and a GDL50 would be a strong contender if I was in the certified world. Amazing capability. Very simple to use.

    My perfect certified panel would have a JPI 930, an airspeed and altimeter, and an iPad running a GDL50. Panels are personal choice. Nobody's choices are righter than another's.
    Last edited by stewartb; 12-01-2018 at 02:06 PM.
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  15. #15
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stewartb View Post
    Anti-glare screen protectors are almost as common as iPads.
    Open to good suggestions on glare shields. Can't remember all the ones we have tried. One was glass and not cheap. The newest iPad has better glare resistance but still hard to see at certain times of day in certain directions. I love all the information, crazy the think what we use to fly with and what we have at our fingertips now.
    Steve Pierce

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  16. #16

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    Univair

    Quote Originally Posted by mike mcs repair View Post
    you are about to discover the steel fuselage tubes hiding behind panel... THEY WILL DICTATE YOUR LAYOUT, and no mater how hard you try you WILL run into issues with them..
    The new modified Univair fuselage has taken the instruments into consideration, so I believe it’s easier with this new fuselage (and also no rust or stressed metal etc - after all it is a very old aircraft).

  17. #17
    wireweinie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jokerswe2008 View Post
    The new modified Univair fuselage has taken the instruments into consideration, so I believe it’s easier with this new fuselage (and also no rust or stressed metal etc - after all it is a very old aircraft).
    No design changes that I'm aware of. Anyone else heard of this, other than special order?

    It's not the center brace that will obstruct you, it's the two tubes forward of the lower mounting tabs. They come together to form an 'x' between the panel and the firewall. With the panel tipped forward at a slight angle, EVERYONE that has fabbed a panel has had an instrument/radio/primer/etc bump those tubes. You''ll understand this the first time you mock up your panel.

    Web
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  18. #18

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    In lower corners it will be a problem to place instruments.
    I don’t know how to post pictures here, but send me a PM and I’ll send you a picture.

  19. #19

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    Once you have a panel layout figured out, cut it out in 1/4" plexiglass the exact shape of the actual panel, very helpfull seeing your obstructions
    Staying alive in an airplane has a lot more to do with mastering ourselves than mastering the aircraft.
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  20. #20
    behindpropellers's Avatar
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    Hit me up if you need a test panel cut, I do them for all of the local guys. I usually suggest two. The first one has the outline and the mounting holes cut with the instrument/avionics locations engraved. The second one is complete.

    Usually I make them out of .093 stock since this is pretty close to typical panel thickness.

    As far as hitting the stuff behind the panel, the cub is pretty easy since there is good design data on it.

    Click image for larger version. 

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  21. #21

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    I seem to recall the guy in Vernon, B.C. solved the interference problem with the tubes behind the panel by simply cutting them out, claiming they weren't needed. I don't know if the owner ever discovered if he was wrong.

  22. #22
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jokerswe2008 View Post
    I don’t know how to post pictures here.
    Click on the picture frame with a tree on it just to the right and below where is says "Quick Reply".
    Steve Pierce

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  23. #23
    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
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    I've never had a problem with the 796, and i like having a dedicated GPS my self.

    Tom

  24. #24
    Bearhawk Builder's Avatar
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    Tom, what are you using for weather/adsb on the 796? What's the yearly subscription for vfr charts?
    Never had a Garmin unit

    Quote Originally Posted by RaisedByWolves View Post
    I've never had a problem with the 796, and i like having a dedicated GPS my self.

    Tom

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    Quote Originally Posted by john schwamm View Post
    Here is my new carbon fiber panel on Husky, pretty much same for cub.
    John
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    a getting dark shot with the 796 in split screen mode with the GDL 3D talking to it via Bluetooth. 796 is surface mounted with the stock mounting bracket.
    Last edited by OLDCROWE; 12-02-2018 at 06:56 PM.
    Remember, These are the Good old Days!
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  26. #26
    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
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    Layout Instrument panel for NQ

    Gdl-39 via Bluetooth. I have ForeFlight on my phone as-well.


    Air gizmo panel mount


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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    I’ve been trying to figure out how to post pictures also, I have nothing on my screen that shows Quick Reply. Do I have to change my settings? Thanks for any help.

  28. #28
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    How are you posting? Here is the quick reply.
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    And the picture frame with the tree "picture upload" icon.
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    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

  29. #29

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    I have nothing like that, I’m on the forum.

  30. #30
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    What browser are you using?

    Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Steve Pierce

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    Will Rogers

  31. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    What browser are you using?

    Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Safari



    Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app

  32. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckwagon View Post
    Safari



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  33. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckwagon View Post
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    Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Thanks for the help Steve, I was able to figure it out on the mobile app. Still didn’t have either of two pages you posted though. I’ll have to do more looking.


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  34. #34
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    The mobile app is different. I just have an arrow to upload but I am on an Android.
    Steve Pierce

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    Will Rogers

  35. #35

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    Assuming you're logged in, at the bottom of any thread you'll see a quick reply window, or if you select reply from a particular post you get the same window. In the quick reply window look to the top right header and select the third symbol from the far right. That'll bring up the add photo function. Select from computer or URL. From computer when you click on select files you'll get a file page to choose where the picture you want resides. Locate it, select it, and click upload files.

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  36. #36

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    If you are going from scratch I would try to get as much digital equipment as possible. I think they are more dependable, less weight and take up less space compared the old gyro's. When you build the panel make it easy to upgrade. Switches on drop out panel for easy access. I would not mount I-pad or Garmin 796 type GPS in the panel, do a surface mount and extend it above the panel as far as possible. This will save space and easy swap out if you upgrade. I have a center drop out access plate in the middle of my panel( 795 mount attached). If I need to reach the back of anything in the panel I can stick by arm in and reach it. Use instrument nuts on all gauges. The last raffle cub was built with nylocks behind all the gauges, making it a major pain to work on. I have seen aircraft builds delayed by 8-12 weeks waiting on custom laser cut panels and power coating. Mine was built in 12 hours and rattle can paint. No right or wrong just some stuff to think about.
    DENNY
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