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Thread: Anyone have experince with AQUA 3190s ?????

  1. #41
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    Not to mention that finding a set of PK-3000s in Alaska is darn near impossible. The couple sets available are in Eastern Canada. I would have to have them inspected by a third party or fly there myself. Then break them down for long range shipping and then pay some sort of re-import duty. All the while not knowing if I could ever obtain a field approval.

  2. #42
    TurboBeaver's Avatar
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    I hear ya both! Just at the PK float factory a few mins ago and told Keith Strange I was stirring the soup a little bit,
    And everyone got to laughing and Keith said to give em hel(........

  3. #43
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    Keith Strange is a good guy.
    He helped me A LOT with my last set of PKs. All they need to do is amend their installation STC to include the higher gross weight for the last couple models of 180s with the Kenmore Tail STC. Since those are really a 185 airframe at that point and since the floats are ALREADY approved at a higher gross weight for 185s, it should be no problem. But whomever was answering my e-mails thought it would be.

    I like PKs for rough water, like I get on Tustumeana Lake and Skilak Lake. The flat panel sections of the PKs do not water slap on waves like the fluted bottoms of the 2960s. Plus the rear compartments on the PKs are wider and deeper so the tails do not sink as much.

  4. #44
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    My high time (mid-upper 20K) neighbor at the float pond has a C-185 IO-520 on PK 3000's. Belly pod w/gear, 3-4 SOB, fuel, sunk to the rear spreader some days while taxiing. He likes to work the elevators to get on step but takes off in a reasonable distance unless it's real calm and warm. Impressive for a PK float. He added a 3-blade Mac a few years back which he said really helps.

    Gary

  5. #45
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    Tell you what, as hard as it is to find dock space here every summer, I am about ready to sacrifice a seat space and go amphib.
    I wonder if EDO 3500s are too heavy ?? There is a nice set in Sitka.

  6. #46
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Clark View Post
    Tell you what, as hard as it is to find dock space here every summer, I am about ready to sacrifice a seat space and go amphib.
    I wonder if EDO 3500s are too heavy ?? There is a nice set in Sitka.
    EDO 3500s have never been approved on a Cessna 180. That's beside being a sacrifice of about 300 pounds.
    N1PA

  7. #47
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    So they are heavy.
    The old 2790s are approved, I have no idea how much they weigh but I have seen people trying to leave a lake with them...Then there are the super expensive Aerocet 3400s ( 651 pounds installed , so I would loose 200 pounds ) and Wip 3000 Amphib.

    Oh well, just a random thought. Dock space is a premium around here and the water is corrosive.

  8. #48
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Yes the 2790s are approved at a reduced gross weight due to floatation requirements. 3100 lbs limit. You would also have to consider the 180 to be a two place airplane. I just don't see you being satisfied based on your description of what you need. Yes they are good floats but in my opinion you would be much happier with your 2960s.

    I can get you the weights if you like in the morning.
    N1PA

  9. #49
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    Yeah I know... I sent you one of those PM things

  10. #50
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Clark View Post
    ...Then there are the super expensive Aerocet 3400s ( 651 pounds installed , so I would loose 200 pounds )
    Is this 651 lbs after you deduct the weight of the land gear or before? That number is considerably less than the EDO 3500s 765 lbs from which you deduct the land gear.
    N1PA

  11. #51

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    A lot of maintenance on those older amphibs so need to take that into consideration. Always repacking wheels, brakes, gear issues, pump and electrical switches etc on those old 2790s. We used to run some pretty heavy loads with them on 185s but yikes a bit scary in big water. They would be useless on a standard 180. With amphibs running empty it feels like your half loaded. Never liked that part even with the Aerocets so unless you really need them I would agree with the previous post that you may not be happy. We had a 185 with a IO550 on Aerocet 3400's and they were absolutely trouble free. As you figured earlier 3430's not approved for 180's. Another float that would be an option although hard to find is the CAP 3000 D model. They were built in Canada but approved in the US on a 180. They are round top but the fastest float in that group for sure. I have never personally flown a set but had friends that had them. Got off the water as well as the 2960's with a big load. Everybody that I knew that had them liked them. Can't remember the floatation on them of hand but they were used on 185s so they will be as high as 2960s I am sure.

  12. #52
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    I have flown a 185 on CAP 3000s a few times. I like the Capt Nemo look of the back ends. They did OK.

    PETE: 650lbs is the totally assembly weight of the Aerocet 3400s , as compared to 450lbs for the 3500Ls straight floats. So you loose an extra 200 pounds of useful load by going amphib with Aerocets. Oddly enough the Wip 3000 amphibs are 20 or 30 pounds lighter.

  13. #53
    mvivion's Avatar
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    Another vote for CAP 3000 floats. They’re tough and perform, flown right. I’ve flown both 180 and 185 on them and liked both. Flat top floats are nice, if you don’t mind paying for them.....

    And everything Peter Dillon said about those old EDO amphibs is right on. EDO 3500s are HUGE floats, derived from EDO 4000 straights, not approved on the 180 and way too big in any case.

    MTV

  14. #54
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    Pete: Here is what passes as the Public Mooring area here on Beluga Lake. And this guy picked a good spot with smaller rocks. He was nailed by a strong wind on his tail in the middle of the night. Those lines are tied to the main road guard rail.
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  15. #55
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    I'd build a floating ramp before tying up like that to a steep bank. There was one next to my old parking space for years that a C-185 used. The bare wood got slippery from algae but carpeting fixed that. But maybe Homer would require it to be licensed as a vessel and have Coast Guard registration. Some local folks have given up on shore parking and just use a pull out trailer when done for the day.

    Gary

  16. #56
    TurboBeaver's Avatar
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    Alex I gotta agree with you about 2790 floats and watching them "try" to take off ! That is a great choice of words. Probably the absolute poorest choice you could ever make! Don't forget all the older amphibian floats used the most bouyant compartment for the main gear! And that comes at a huge price, a C180 on them loaded in a stiff breeze isnt
    really a floatplane it's a submarine. P Dillion has given you great advise........ I am going to say you will get more pratice
    with aborted takeoffs then you have in your whole career! And make darn sure your insurance is up to snuff, cause a common view of 2790's on a C180 is bottoms up! They would be the worst idea you could ever come up with......
    Good luck
    e

  17. #57
    mvivion's Avatar
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    Alex,

    Just call up the Red River Bank in Halstad, MN and take out a loan on a brand new set of Aerocets......Simple.

    MTV
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  18. #58
    cubdriver2's Avatar
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    Alex and others might need some of these


    BUMPER FLOATS • $200 • FOR SALE CHEAP BUMPER RUBBER NEW FOR EDO 1400-1650-2000-2425-2870-2960+++++ $200.00 US EACH CALL PETER 1-819-438-1758 • Contact Pierre A. Girard - AVIATIONPG located Grandremous, QC Canada • Telephone: 819-438-1758 • Posted April 18, 2018 • Show all Ads posted by this AdvertiserRecommend This Ad to a FriendEmail AdvertiserSave to WatchlistReport This AdView Larger Pictures




    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"

  19. #59
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    I have actually made over-stuffed bumpers. It does not help anything for a steep and rocky shoreline. If I cannot obtain dock space this year I will have to make a floating fender-dock of some sort, OR pull my plane out of the water every night on a trailer.
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  20. #60
    mvivion's Avatar
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    As Gary suggested, build a wood ramp. Weight the outboard end so that it'll sink a bit to protect your floats when you ramp them. Ramp it, then get out and muscle it around to the heels are toward the shore, tie it down. Put in some duck bill earth anchors in the bottom beside the ramp, or just tie the plane to the ramp. In the morning, preflight, load up, fire up, warm up, and power off the ramp.

    Only real down side is, as Gary noted, they get slicker than snot with algae. Some wing walk or similar along the sides helps with that.

    We kept our floatplanes on a floating ramp at our remote camp on Kodiak all the time, worked great, even in some big blows.

    MTV
    Thanks peterdillon thanked for this post

  21. #61
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    Or how about these? Saw them first at Eyak Lake in Cordova when I was flying during the oil spill. No doubt common knowledge along the coast but I thought how inventive for the builders. One had hydraulics in the cab. Just drove under the front of the plane and lifted it via the rising frame under the spreader bars.
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  22. #62
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    I've seen a similar launching vehicle at Vancouver BC. Very efficient and quick.
    N1PA

  23. #63
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    More Aquas. Think the size is wrong but do know the floats and owner. https://fairbanks.craigslist.org/avo...569681409.html

    Gary

  24. #64
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    The Aqua 3430s are big girls. I just looked at a new install on a c206

  25. #65
    mvivion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BC12D-4-85 View Post
    Or how about these? Saw them first at Eyak Lake in Cordova when I was flying during the oil spill. No doubt common knowledge along the coast but I thought how inventive for the builders. One had hydraulics in the cab. Just drove under the front of the plane and lifted it via the rising frame under the spreader bars.
    Those are a nice idea, but they’d require a two person team to launch, or some fancy rigging.

    MTV

  26. #66
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Clark View Post
    The Aqua 3430s are big girls. I just looked at a new install on a c206
    I believe they are 3190's but will have a look today to confirm. They were on a 185 previously.

    Gary

  27. #67
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    "Those are a nice idea, but they’d require a two person team to launch, or some fancy rigging.

    MTV"

    They drove the trailer into the lake then jumped out moved the beached and tethered plane by hand onto the trailer. Similar to what we do with an ordinary hydraulic trailer that lifts the spreader bars. Side guide boards and float bumper stops on the trailer would make that pre-positioning easier. Then pump up the lifting arms and scoot away to parking.

    Of course the setup could be built with a standard low deck trailer the float keels sit on instead of the fancy hydraulics if the plane doesn't need to be removed later for storage.

    Gary

  28. #68
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    I have never seen a set of used Aerocets 3400s amphibs listed for sale. EVER.....In fact I have never seen a used set of 3500Ls for sale either. Although I know a local guy who did find some 3500Ls for the deal of the century. ( less than 20K, thus no doubt he struck a deal with Satan) So has anyone ever seen a set of A-3400s for sale or are they like Unicorn testicles???

    Here is another shot of what they call public or transient tie-downs on Beluga Lake ( 5BL). The rocks are rather nasty when the wind pounds your floats. And the steep bank up to the road tends to make it hard to tail ( heel) beach because there is no place for your aircraft's tail.
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  29. #69
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BC12D-4-85 View Post
    I believe they are 3190's but will have a look today to confirm. They were on a 185 previously.

    Gary
    These are indeed Aqua/Capre 3190's S/N 1108-09 Mfg. 5/97. Hatches in each float. Didn't appear abused.

    Owner has 2960's now. Just in case someone wants what will likely be a deal when the snow finally melts around the rest of them

    Gary

  30. #70
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    I called Seaplanes North today in an effort to buy some Aerocets. I was told that there are none and they are back-ordered into next year. Bummer...

  31. #71
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    That's a clue Alex, hope you placed an order. Use the 2960s this year and look forward to your new floats next year. You most certainly will have no trouble selling the Aerocets if for some reason you can't take delivery.
    N1PA
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  32. #72
    C-FIJK's Avatar
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    WIPLINE 3000A AMPHIB'S • $51,700 • THIS ONE WON'T LASTWipline 3000A amphib's w/ storage hatches, paddle brackets, walk wire & tow bar fittings. Only 372 Hrs TT. S/N 30059 & 30060, built 03/2001. Cessna 185 rigging including front pork chop fittings and rear attach fittings. Includes 12V electro/hydraulic pump assembly, hand pump assembly, hydraulic lines, switch panel w/indicator lights, Lake & Air gear advisory system, circuit breakers, wiring & retract handle assembly. New wheel bearings in 2017. Bottoms in good condition. • Contact Joe Birkemeyer - NORTHPOINT AVIATION, Owner - located Brainerd, MN USA • Telephone: 7153776921 . 2188293398 • Fax: 2188223893 • Posted April 26, 2018 • Show all Ads posted by this AdvertiserRecommend This Ad to a FriendEmail AdvertiserSave to WatchlistReport This AdView Larger Pictures

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  33. #73
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    Mike V, do you know the seller ???

  34. #74
    TurboBeaver's Avatar
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    Alex,
    If your thinking of diving into the world of amphibious floats the PK 3000 is made as the model 3050 with the main gear
    retracting into the aft forward section leaving the STEP compartment ( one that really matters) the same as a straight float
    These perform quite differently than ANY conventional amphibious float that uses the step compartment to hold the main gear. The Whips are a copy of Alton Bouchards original design of using the aft section to mount the mains. We have them here on a 185 that you could try out before you spend money? Also Keith is just finishing a tricked out 185 on brand new
    3050's that I am sure you could demo? I would sure speak to him about all this, as they will certainly bend over backwards
    to sell you a set of amphibious floats! So there is two options right there! I am running back and forth to Lincoln all the time annualing two planes, and have plenty of room here if you want to come fly them ??? Welcome to kick around with us
    if that would help ya????
    Likes Bill Rusk liked this post

  35. #75
    mvivion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Clark View Post
    Mike V, do you know the seller ???
    Nope, but I'm in MN right now, I'll ask around.

    MTV

  36. #76
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Joe Birkemeyer is one of the persons in charge when the Bauman floats were being produced.
    Last edited by skywagon8a; 04-27-2018 at 07:10 AM.
    N1PA
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  37. #77
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    The problem with PK is their lack of compliance with the gross weight increase etc. The e guys at Kenmore said that Aerocets were the only way to go. A new set of Aerocets 3400 amphibia is now 95,000 bucks.....wow....

  38. #78
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    I sent a message last night to Wip asking if the Amphib versions met the same weight as the straight 3000s for the Kenmore gorss weight increase. And No answer yet.

  39. #79
    Bill Rusk's Avatar
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    Joe Birkemeyer is a good man. I would not hesitate to do business with him. He was the manager of Bauman floats for several years.

    Bill
    Very Blessed.

  40. #80

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    Joe works with Park Rapids Aviation boys now. Those guys know float planes. Bought quite a few sets of Aerocets from them. Joe is as straight a guy as you will ever meet.

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