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Thread: Catto update.and ??

  1. #1

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    Catto update.and ??

    Visited with Nicole this morning. She related that the STC would be forthcoming in a couple (2 or 3 months)
    She also said the PMA, (Parts Manufacturer Approval) would not be accomplished until the first of the year 2019.
    I didn't ask... but what benefit would a STC be if the PMA wasn't obtained?? Seems you would have the right to use a prop that you couldn't use??
    What am I missing?
    Steve
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    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    The Supplemental Type Certificate is the approval of the part.
    The Parts Manufacturing Authority is the permission to make, inspect and certify the parts.
    N1PA
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    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    probably different FAA groups to work with too, MIDO i think in the manufacturing branch

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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    The Supplemental Type Certificate is the approval of the part.
    The Parts Manufacturing Authority is the permission to make, inspect and certify the parts.
    I guess I should have said ..you have the right to use a prop that doesnt exist. since the PMA and STC need to go hand in hand.

    Another thought...actually wishful thinking. In my youth, Craig told me the propeller he was trying to certify is the identical to the one he was building for the experimental folks. I am guessing that his prop, he will obtain the STC for has 'evolved' somewhat...otherwise, 'you would think' that a field approval would be a slam dunk for all the experimental props currently flying....yeah.

    yet another STeve
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    Just sign up on there list another year like a "lemming" we all are, I've been on there list for "what" 4,5,6,7 years now. Makes them, make you feel good about nothing. Do you think that they saved all there list and your at the top of it, for the first ones STC,d.....NOT! I know, I know I'm the bad guy for bring this up! I have a bad habit for pointing out the "absurd, with more absurdnees"....Scott
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    I know Scott, it is frustrating but Craig has demonstrated to me that he is one of the good guys.. If his only sin is optimism then so be it...life goes on and Iam going with McCauley. When and if Catto becomes certified i'll take the bottom of the list and fly what I got until UPS pulls in the yard.
    Steve
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    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scott the cub guy View Post
    Just sign up on there list another year like a "lemming" we all are, I've been on there list for "what" 4,5,6,7 years now. Makes them, make you feel good about nothing. Do you think that they saved all there list and your at the top of it, for the first ones STC,d.....NOT! I know, I know I'm the bad guy for bring this up! I have a bad habit for pointing out the "absurd, with more absurdnees"....Scott
    you are pretty much just a troll here... not much useful comments...

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    Steve, well put and I think you get it. It was never about the Catto folks. There great folks. The process is aggravating. Not because of the FAA. But there own roll out. And then you are the one to point it out and now are called names. Like Mike calling me a troll. I'm sure it would be different if someone made repeated appointment to have his plane repaired, or better yet, promises to pay his bill thats over due for years. Then some one points out why you let some one make you look like a fool. He,d think differently....Scott
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    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scott the cub guy View Post
    Steve, well put and I think you get it. It was never about the Catto folks. There great folks. The process is aggravating. Not because of the FAA. But there own roll out. And then you are the one to point it out and now are called names. Like Mike calling me a troll. I'm sure it would be different if someone made repeated appointment to have his plane repaired, or better yet, promises to pay his bill thats over due for years. Then some one points out why you let some one make you look like a fool. He,d think differently....Scott

    Have you had any encounters of working with the FAA? Give catto a friggen break, its a miracle that they are even trying to get anything certified. I think everyone agrees, shut the hell up about it. Bitching on the forum wont get them certified any quicker.
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    Quote Originally Posted by scott the cub guy View Post
    Steve, well put and I think you get it. It was never about the Catto folks. There great folks. The process is aggravating. Not because of the FAA. But there own roll out. And then you are the one to point it out and now are called names. Like Mike calling me a troll. I'm sure it would be different if someone made repeated appointment to have his plane repaired, or better yet, promises to pay his bill thats over due for years. Then some one points out why you let some one make you look like a fool. He,d think differently....Scott
    Scott, I feel your pain. You and I think on similar terms. I only visit waterholes with this optimist sign.



    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"
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    Raised by wolves, you don't get it, did you evan read what you copied and reposted, it never was about the Catto folks them selfs, (nice remarks added) it was never about the FAA, also noted in my post, you must have passed over that? It's about the "the roll out" .....no bitching Involved here, NONE! Now that I have made my self clear....I hope your not holding your breath for being on the 2012 list......Sarcasm added........Scott

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    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flynlow View Post
    Visited with Nicole this morning. She related that the STC would be forthcoming in a couple (2 or 3 months)
    Since some seem to be rather picky today, did Nicole actually say STC? Or did she say TC? I know that the term STC has been tossed about during these Catto discussions. First Catto needs to get a TC for the propeller, then the PMA needs to be acquired to build and sell the prop. Then someone needs to get an STC which is needed to install it on an airplane. Catto will be the holder of the TC and PMA. Anyone could acquire and hold the STC. The STC could be applicable to just one engine and airframe combination or a collection of various models.
    N1PA
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    Quote Originally Posted by scott the cub guy View Post
    Just sign up on there list another year like a "lemming" we all are, I've been on there list for "what" 4,5,6,7 years now. Makes them, make you feel good about nothing. Do you think that they saved all there list and your at the top of it, for the first ones STC,d.....NOT! I know, I know I'm the bad guy for bring this up! I have a bad habit for pointing out the "absurd, with more absurdnees"....Scott
    just what list is it that you are (continually) griping about, I’ve only ever seen are you interested in surveys from Cato just like the one that has been on their web site for a good while and at their booth at OSH.
    Remember, These are the Good old Days!

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    Quote Originally Posted by scott the cub guy View Post
    Just sign up on there list another year like a "lemming" we all are, I've been on there list for "what" 4,5,6,7 years now. Makes them, make you feel good about nothing. Do you think that they saved all there list and your at the top of it, for the first ones STC,d.....NOT! I know, I know I'm the bad guy for bring this up! I have a bad habit for pointing out the "absurd, with more absurdnees"....Scott
    just what list is it that you are (continually) griping about, I’ve only ever seen are you interested in surveys from Cato just like the one that has been on their web site for a good while and at their booth at OSH.
    Remember, These are the Good old Days!
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    LAST POST FROM ME ON THE ISSUE. Becuase if you make a piont here, your the bad guy troll. No griping here, just honesty in pointing out the obvious. After many years of sign up at the Alaska Airmen Booth. The sign up sheets where YOU could be one of the first in line to get there STC propeller, this is getting old. it was, and still is NOT about the Catto folks, there fine folks, it was, and still is NOT about the FAA delays. It is and still is about the roll out, or proceived rolled out. Although I wish them much apprehended good luck in there Qwest. True and accurate progress updates should have been a better way of doing business. Having folks sign up on there multiple years of list seems redicules....I hope I have explained this without upsetting folks that seem confuse on my point. I'm not trolling, I'm only pointing out the obvious and wishing it went smoother. Case and point in the simpler of terms. Keep the process going with true and accurate updates.....nothing more. Scott
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    Quote Originally Posted by scott the cub guy View Post
    LAST POST FROM ME ON THE ISSUE. Becuase if you make a piont here, your the bad guy troll. No griping here, just honesty in pointing out the obvious. After many years of sign up at the Alaska Airmen Booth. The sign up sheets where YOU could be one of the first in line to get there STC propeller, this is getting old. it was, and still is NOT about the Catto folks, there fine folks, it was, and still is NOT about the FAA delays. It is and still is about the roll out, or proceived rolled out. Although I wish them much apprehended good luck in there Qwest. True and accurate progress updates should have been a better way of doing business. Having folks sign up on there multiple years of list seems redicules....I hope I have explained this without upsetting folks that seem confuse on my point. I'm not trolling, I'm only pointing out the obvious and wishing it went smoother. Case and point in the simpler of terms. Keep the process going with true and accurate updates.....nothing more. Scott
    Scott, Didn't mean to come off as baiting, that actually helps.
    Remember, These are the Good old Days!

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    I understood Nicole to say STC, Then she added that the PMA would take til first of year.

    At any rate it makes one appreciate whats involved in the certification process. The FAA probably errs on the side of caution in this process but I'll accept that, opposed to the alternative.
    Steve

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    Something doesn’t quite sound right. First off, they need a Type Certificate for the prop. That is the design approval. Next up, they need a Production Certificate to be able to build the prop (they normally allow a short period of production under the TC only). Then finally the need an STC to allow that prop to be installed on each make model airplane. PMA doesn’t even enter into it. PMA is only for parts, not for complete Type Certified products.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by scott the cub guy View Post
    last post from me on the issue. Becuase if you make a piont here, your the bad guy troll. No griping here, just honesty in pointing out the obvious. After many years of sign up at the alaska airmen booth. The sign up sheets where you could be one of the first in line to get there stc propeller, this is getting old. It was, and still is not about the catto folks, there fine folks, it was, and still is not about the faa delays. It is and still is about the roll out, or proceived rolled out. Although i wish them much apprehended good luck in there qwest. True and accurate progress updates should have been a better way of doing business. Having folks sign up on there multiple years of list seems redicules....i hope i have explained this without upsetting folks that seem confuse on my point. I'm not trolling, i'm only pointing out the obvious and wishing it went smoother. Case and point in the simpler of terms. Keep the process going with true and accurate updates.....nothing more. Scott
    thank you!

    From Genesis: "And God promised men that good and obedient wives would be
    found in all corners of the earth."

    Then he made the earth round... and He laughed and laughed and laughed!
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  20. #20
    WindOnHisNose's Avatar
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    Trolls or no trolls (I am a bit sensitive right now about "trolls", having babysat our granddaughter, who is 2 years old and who cannot get enough music from the movie "Trolls", or tee shirts with Trolls on them, etc) we are here to learn, to do things better and to be safer. I think this thread has run its course. I am one of those who is anxious to get a Catto prop approved for my good old super cub, but I know that the Catto family had a big fire to deal with a relatively short time ago, I have heard nothing but good things about their honesty and with this in mind I suggest we give them the benefit of the doubt, learn from it and move on.

    Randy
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    Quote Originally Posted by WindOnHisNose View Post
    Trolls or no trolls (I am a bit sensitive right now about "trolls", having babysat our granddaughter, who is 2 years old and who cannot get enough music from the movie "Trolls", or tee shirts with Trolls on them, etc) we are here to learn, to do things better and to be safer. I think this thread has run its course. I am one of those who is anxious to get a Catto prop approved for my good old super cub, but I know that the Catto family had a big fire to deal with a relatively short time ago, I have heard nothing but good things about their honesty and with this in mind I suggest we give them the benefit of the doubt, learn from it and move on.

    Randy
    Thks. Randy, i had a troll doll hanging from my rear view mirror in my 57 Ranchero....a few years back

    At any rate it looks like the certification is still under way and sometime in the future....thought some here would want to know...Now back to our regularly scheduled programming...religion and politics anyone??

    Steve

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    Why are people waiting for Catto when there is a wood core composite prop out there that is legal on pa-12 and 18 with 0-320. Pulls as hard weighs the same.
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    Scouter's Avatar
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    I have bought two Catto props. If you dont like the prop, Nichol will fix it for you. If you still dont like it, she will let you try another one. If you dont like that one, she will refund your money. I wish all companies were like Catto. Best customer service ever.
    I hope they will clear the FAA process , sell millions of dollars of props, and the world lived happily every after.

    Now to hijack the thread and move on, why did Maine get rid of billboards, when in South Carolina they have these beside the road?
    Greer SC driving thru last tuesday.
    Now billboards make perfect sense

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    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scouter View Post
    Now to hijack the thread and move on, why did Maine get rid of billboards, when in South Carolina they have these beside the road?
    Greer SC driving thru last tuesday.
    Now billboards make perfect sense
    jim
    Some folks can read and others just talk?

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    Maritime provinces in Canada place severe limitations on billboards because they are eyesores and a hindrance to tourism.

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    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    Alaska banned them in 1998 via public ballot.

    I miss the Burma-Shave sequential ads and how many miles to Wall Drug. Beat listening to my parents sing and talk while driving because they were too cheap to buy an AM radio.

    Gary
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    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkwentnaMan View Post
    Why are people waiting for Catto when there is a wood core composite prop out there that is legal on pa-12 and 18 with 0-320. Pulls as hard weighs the same.
    What prop would that be Israel?
    Steve Pierce

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    WanaBNACub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    What prop would that be Israel?
    Steve, it is the new version of the old Sensenich wood prop. That is what I have been running.


  29. #29
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Didn't realize it was composite. How does it compare to the Borer?
    Steve Pierce

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    Is this the W80DM38-42 prop with fiberglass covering. Do you have performance numbers 150hp-160hp?
    As Steve mentioned any comparisons with the borer prop would be helpful.
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  31. #31
    WanaBNACub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    Didn't realize it was composite. How does it compare to the Borer?
    Mine is the W80DM-44 wood/fiberglass with the nickel edge and tip. It pulls very similar or maybe a little harder, with better static and better cruise than the 1A200. I dont have the numbers for a 150/160, but my 180 cruises at 104 at 2450 on 35's, and static was 2580. Climbs around 2600. I am sure it will not hold up to the brush like an aluminum prop, although I haven't babied it and so far it is doing well. And at 30# lighter than a 1A200 with the same or better performance it definitely is working well for me so far.
    Last edited by WanaBNACub; 04-02-2018 at 12:20 AM.
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  32. #32
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WanaBNACub View Post
    Mine is the W80DM-44 wood/fiberglass with the nickel edge and tip. It pulls very similar or maybe a little harder, with better static and better cruise than the 1A200. I dont have the numbers for a 150/160, but my 180 cruises at 104 at 2450 on 35's, and static was 2580. Climbs around 2600. I am sure it will not hold up to the brush like an aluminum prop, although I haven't babied it and so far it is doing well. And at 30# lighter than a 1A200 with the same or better performance it definitely is working well for me so far.
    Just for clarification purposes. Your engine is an 0-360 (180 hp)? You are using a Sensenich W80DM-44 which is listed on Sensenich's application guide as a cruise prop for a 0-320 (160 hp)? http://www.sensenich.com/wp-content/...1471369065.pdf
    What did you do about the different diameter bolts between the two engines? Special order with the larger holes? The guide calls for a W80CM8-xx for the 0-360.
    N1PA
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    Quote Originally Posted by WanaBNACub View Post
    Mine is the W80DM-44 wood/fiberglass with the nickel edge and tip. It pulls very similar or maybe a little harder, with better static and better cruise than the 1A200. I dont have the numbers for a 150/160, but my 180 cruises at 104 at 2450 on 35's, and static was 2580. Climbs around 2600. I am sure it will not hold up to the brush like an aluminum prop, although I haven't babied it and so far it is doing well. And at 30# lighter than a 1A200 with the same or better performance it definitely is working well for me so far.

    Interesting...the application guide calls for a 80/34 sensenich for the 0-290. That is the exact same, Catto prop dimensions I have for a 0-290.

    What was the pitch on the 1A200 you compared the 80/44 to?

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    Just for clarification purposes. Your engine is an 0-360 (180 hp)? You are using a Sensenich W80DM-44 which is listed on Sensenich's application guide as a cruise prop for a 0-320 (160 hp)? http://www.sensenich.com/wp-content/...1471369065.pdf
    What did you do about the different diameter bolts between the two engines? Special order with the larger holes? The guide calls for a W80CM8-xx for the 0-360.
    Sorry about that, you are correct. I dug out the prop log and it is the W80CM-44 for the 0-360

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by flynlow View Post
    Interesting...the application guide calls for a 80/34 sensenich for the 0-290. That is the exact same, Catto prop dimensions I have for a 0-290.

    What was the pitch on the 1A200 you compared the 80/44 to?
    it was a 42 pitch 1a200. I am hoping to get a pull scale at some point and do an actual pull test with a few different props.
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  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by King Brown View Post
    Maritime provinces in Canada place severe limitations on billboards because they are eyesores and a hindrance to tourism.
    The "Olympic Highway" (aka US Hwy 101) in western Washington was declared a scenic byway years ago,
    my uncle ended up losing a good source of revenue he got by leasing space out in the pasture to a billboard outfit.
    Apparently only portions of 101 are scenic, or there's some loopholes, as I've noticed signs in some other locations.
    I don't mind "elk jerky in 2 miles" or similar. "Swains has everything" (for a long-time family-owned general store) has always been one of my favorites.
    The most unsightly is the big electronic sign at the Indian casino at Sequim Bay. Ugh.
    They also have plenty of regular billboards, advertising the casino and their convenience store, gas station, souvenir shop, fireworks stand, etc.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!
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    Quote Originally Posted by hotrod180 View Post

    The most unsightly is the big electronic sign at the Indian casino at Sequim Bay. Ugh.
    Best pun of the week

    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scouter View Post
    I have bought two Catto props. If you dont like the prop, Nichol will fix it for you. If you still dont like it, she will let you try another one. If you dont like that one, she will refund your money. I wish all companies were like Catto. Best customer service ever.
    I hope they will clear the FAA process , sell millions of dollars of props, and the world lived happily every after.

    Now to hijack the thread and move on, why did Maine get rid of billboards, when in South Carolina they have these beside the road?
    Greer SC driving thru last tuesday.
    Now billboards make perfect sense

    jim
    Name:  sugar.jpg
Views: 3373
Size:  24.8 KB

    Glenn
    They have some really cool T shirts at the distillery website
    you want one when I order mine?
    The next farmstrip Andy and I discover on our John Graham program
    is going to be named Sugar Tit

    jim

  39. #39
    cubdriver2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scouter View Post
    Glenn
    They have some really cool T shirts at the distillery website
    you want one when I order mine?
    The next farmstrip Andy and I discover on our John Graham program
    is going to be named Sugar Tit

    jim
    Do we order by S M L XL or A B C D?

    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"
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  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubdriver2 View Post
    Best pun of the week Glenn
    Unintentional too. Really.
    Slow as I am, it took me a minute to realize what you were talking about.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

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