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Thread: Javeron Parts Availability

  1. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Todd long View Post
    Ok. So those of you that had said there is way more to this story and I don’t know what’s going on, BS! I dont know where you got your information. Of all of you I am the only person who was there first hand and saw them come out of the box. As for those that said Jay does not order from ACME and only did this as a favor to Dan and Paul, BS. I just talked to Jay and he confirmed that he did send these shocks to Paul. As for being 2 years before the kit? Nope with the kit, arrived last winter as I said. So I don’t know where you got your information but stop spreading lies.

    Here is is where this thing got all blown up, not withstanding the total fabrications about Dan. Jay told Paul to try and see what Acme would do. It’s how it was said. Jay meant I haven’t been able to get Eric on the phone, maybe you can. Paul hears that as you just need to deal with Eric, not my problem. Either way after talking to Jay a few mins ago the resolution is Paul sends shocks to Jay. Jay refunds money to Paul and fixes problem with Acme. Just As I said it should happen at the very beginning of this thread.

    Thru this I have always maintained Jay and Javeron produce excellent quality parts. I have also said the same about Acme shocks, as I plan to get a set myself after seeing how well they handle being dropped in hard by a new tailwheel pilot. All I asked was there any problems with getting parts. The first reply confirmed there were. Maybe expectations on delivery times were too high before he ramped up production. That’s in the past

    But out for all this other stuff about uninvolved parties getting trashed, Jay said he knows nothing about where those rumors started.

    So so final result, parts will be refunded, reputations hurt due to total rumors, Jay still makes good parts, “Dan does quality work”(Jays words) Paul has a very nice flying plane.
    To piggy back off of that. We worked directly with Dan to expedite a set of shocks that would work for Paul's plane and did so in less than 4 days (we have a 4 week turnaround right now). My suggestion was to have Paul send the shocks back to Jay so he could get fully reimbursed for what he paid for the Gen 2's, which he is doing Friday. Jay is going to trade the Gen 2's in for a set of Gen 3's that he already has sold so he will make his money on them.

    So when it's all said and done, Paul has brand new Gen 3 shocks that work great on his plane, Jay is getting an brand new set of Gen 3's he can sell and make his money on and everyone is happy.

    Not sure where everyone has gotten their info or should I say misinformation from but in the end everyone is happy. Also not sure why anyone would get slandered on here. That serves zero purpose. Anyone that knows us knows that we stand behind our product 100% and will bend over backwards to make things happen for anyone.
    Last edited by AcmeAeroFab; 03-06-2018 at 04:33 PM.
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  2. #42

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    Read post #7. So basically Toddy is spreading fake news. Right??? Just askin.
    Last edited by tempdoug; 03-06-2018 at 04:27 PM.
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  3. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by Iflylower View Post
    Tempdoug, what is the story on these? Is this a known issue? Do they have a week spot? I’ve been leaning towards getting a set. I’d like to know more.

    Sorry the thread drift, my experience with Jay has been first rate and likely the kit I would buy if I built another.
    It is usually our policy not to comment on every post pertaining to our shocks unless there is misinformation. As a company we test every product to failure prior to it making it to the market. We know that the force needed to break those shocks in a straight line pull was 18,000lbs. When we learned of this set breaking we contracted a third party engineering firm to recreate the incident that caused the failure, come to a conclusion as to what happened and make recommendations as to improvements to guard against this happening in the future. I will no release in an open forum the details of the incident but I will say that it was the conclusion of the firm that the shocks failed because of a load that was outside of its intended use.

    They also concluded that the cap material and subsequent strength was more than sufficient for its intended use but noted that if we changed the top cap material we could gain 4,000lbs more strength. As a company we offered to upgrade all of the gen-1 shocks to the new material at not cost to the customer. We even covered shipping. There are still gen-1'a flying that definitely aren't "crap" where the owner decided not to upgrade because the 18,000lb strength was more than sufficient.

    We pride ourselves on safety as well as performance. We tested the Gen-2's in compression (simulated side load) and they are 1,500lbs stronger than AOSS (Gen 2's made it to 3,500lbs and AOSS made it to 2,000lbs). No other company out there knows their side load capabilities. To take it a step further, we had the opportunity to work with another company to develop a new shaft material and did so. The result of that development is the Gen 3 shocks will now make it to 5,500lbs in a side load as opposed to 3,500 of the Gen 2, 2,000 of the AOSS, and 1600 of a standard bungee.

    Wd don't run from this picture at all. Hopefully this sheds a little light on the picture. Please don't hesitate to contact me if you have any further questions. 704-806-3582
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  4. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by Farmboy View Post
    Hey Acme, you might want to read the thread before you repost a statement that you’ve made prior. The thread really isn’t about your response.

    Don’t take that the wrong way, I’m saving up to be able to try out your strut’s.

    Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org
    I was simply responding to the picture of the failed shocks being circulated here. I just added quotes to hopefully clear up the confusion.
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  5. #45
    Todd long's Avatar
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    Sorry bud, no fake news here. Believe what ever you want. I could really care less.
    Oh, and I have the balls to at least use my real name on all my posts.

  6. #46
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Todd long View Post
    Sorry bud, no fake news here. Believe what ever you want. I could really care less.
    Oh, and I have the balls to at least use my real name on all my posts.
    I'd really hate to say the moderators need to boot anyone from the site, but it's time for you to go... go troll somewhere else!!!

  7. #47

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    Many people don’t necessarily use their name on this site and it has nothing to do with not having balls. However, the member area does list those users with full name and contact information for most of us. With all due respect to all, sometimes a public forum such as this may not be the best place to try and resolve contentious issues.
    Mark
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  8. #48
    Todd long's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike mcs repair View Post
    I'd really hate to say the moderators need to boot anyone from the site, but it's time for you to go... go troll somewhere else!!!
    Really?
    Explain where in this thread tempdoug has added any useful information. He brought up about the one pair of Acme shocks that broke. Do you know the circumstances of how they broke? Probably not. All he has done is stir the pot. It’s funny, people “slander” Acme and I stand up for them, no one cares. Post factual information about another vendor, no point in saying who, and I get hate mail and it’s all fake news. Mike you have no idea what you do t know. But again, nothing fake here.
    Chinook posts some problems he had with some parts. Replies were this guys is new and his first post he complains about his parts. Who is he? Don’t see him around anymore can’t imagine why. But funny, the thread he posted in was titled are we too picky or what, complaining about Legend and Univair. Bad parts that didn’t fit. Oh, but there it is believable. Second post in this thread was someone else adding their experience. Fake news too?
    You like Jay and Javeron? Ya, all should have let this thread die where I said it had come to a conclusion. No reason to keep stiring this up, because there were no lies told by me.
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  9. #49
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Todd long View Post
    Really?
    Explain where in this thread tempdoug has added any useful information. He brought up about the one pair of Acme shocks that broke. Do you know the circumstances of how they broke? Probably not. All he has done is stir the pot. It’s funny, people “slander” Acme and I stand up for them, no one cares. Post factual information about another vendor, no point in saying who, and I get hate mail and it’s all fake news. Mike you have no idea what you do t know. But again, nothing fake here.
    Chinook posts some problems he had with some parts. Replies were this guys is new and his first post he complains about his parts. Who is he? Don’t see him around anymore can’t imagine why. But funny, the thread he posted in was titled are we too picky or what, complaining about Legend and Univair. Bad parts that didn’t fit. Oh, but there it is believable. Second post in this thread was someone else adding their experience. Fake news too?
    You like Jay and Javeron? Ya, all should have let this thread die where I said it had come to a conclusion. No reason to keep stiring this up, because there were no lies told by me.
    as explained here before, they removed R&R... this place is for positive stuff, not trolling.... go away

  10. #50
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    So Todd, I am curious if you would go about this the same way?
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

  11. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by Todd long View Post
    Sorry bud, no fake news here. Believe what ever you want. I could really care less.
    Oh, and I have the balls to at least use my real name on all my posts.
    nothing to do or invested in any of it, whats the deal? Mike, no R-R going on just a litlle flushing. This whole thread is a very good deal, why would anyone want to spend $3500 for anything they cant use and not be able to return it. Just trying to find out the real deal, thats all. Maybe this will save some people some anguish or a broken airplane.
    OK, so heres the whole deal read it, in post number #41 from ACME sounds like everyone involved is happy, except for you and you dont have
    Last edited by tempdoug; 03-07-2018 at 08:41 AM.
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  12. #52

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    ok- I built a Javron 2200lb last year. I ordered Acme shocks. Jay didn't have shocks sitting on a shelf. Mine were actually shipped straight from Acme. I had several phone calls with Acme about the Javron cub, they listed the Javron on the invoice papers, yet no one every put 2 and 2 together that the shocks were Gen 2 and shouldn't be on a 2200 pound cub. I truly believe Jay didn't know either. Truthfully, just in my phone calls with Acme, I would have thought they should have recognized the error also. Just talked to them today. They are taking my gen 2 shocks back and I'm moving to gen 3 shock and paying a difference. Bummer, but I'm getting the correct and a much better version of them. I don't think anyone believes Jay makes Acme shocks directly and when you order them from Jay you know they are coming from Acme. Mine were shipped from Acme direct to me. Yes, I would be more upset if I had a failure, but life goes on and I'm not going to obsess about it. Acme shocks Gen 3 will be done and shipping next week I am told by Acme. Acme knows they both missed the obvious. Yes, Jay has some operation concerns, but he is good guy, makes a great product and I would buy another from him. I paid Jay for the shocks, but I don't think he marked it up any. Doug H
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  13. #53

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    I dont think over a year ago ACME even knew the Gen3s would exist. Jay dosent have any operation concerns if your a human being, that comments from my personal dealings.And when the Generation 4 and 5s come out then what??
    Last edited by tempdoug; 03-08-2018 at 05:08 PM.

  14. #54

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    Like a few others I too have built a Javron Cub. I met Jay in person and worked with him for a week up at Breezy Point. Jay goes out of his way to make things right. Just like the rest of us he's human so sometimes it takes more that one try to get everything right. I got frustrated at times but Jay and I were always able to come to a reasonable solution. I'm sure Jay may have been frustrated at me as well, but neither of us went on line to bad mouth someone.

    I agree with Mike, time for Todd to go away. Figure out how to work with people not flame them on a site in a misguided attempt to trash their business.

    Nelson
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  15. #55
    Todd long's Avatar
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    Maybe it is time for me to go away. But someone seems to be keeping this thread alive. And those people don’t seem to read and understand the earlier posts, and don’t check sources of facts.

    Tempdoug, yes ACME did know gen 3 would exist a year ago,actually they knew a lot longer than a year ago. Did they know when they would be available? No. Because like any good engineering company they made sure they were thoroughly tested. To answer the question you would probably reply with early......Yes the gen 1 were thoroughly tested before release. They tested stronger than bungees and hydrasorbs that you so much love. And as a company when 1, not multiple shocks broke they retested them. They were independently verified to be of design strength and the failure was a freak occurrence of exceeding design usage. Your bungees would have been like wet spaghetti. So what did they do? They offered free upgrades to gen 2. Not a $100, or even $500 discount. Free upgrade. So lay off them. That’s customer service. Oh, and what happens when gen4 or 5 come out? Nothing. At least for you. As you have clearly stated your devotion to bungees. So you care why?

    Now for the 2200# issue. Yes the gen3 is best for the 2200#+ javeron and other cubs. But as I clearly stated earlier this wasn’t a gen2 vs gen3 and 2200# issue. The Acme shocks that were sent were for a 1300# max airframe. They had sent them to jay for a project he had been working on earlier. Cool, no problem...yet. I’m guessing when Paul ordered his with ACME shocks Jay saw he had a pair in stock and sent them. Totally forgetting they were for the wrong airframe. Honest mistake. So in reality ACME is taking back a lightweight gen2 shock that was less expensive, and sending Jay a more expensive gen3 heavyweight shock in return. Find an aviation company that has that level of customer service that makes most people with at least a mildly pleasant demeanor happy. If you are a major grouch that doesn’t smile at a puppy and hates rainbows and ponies they probably won’t make you happy either.

    Yes this his is my real name, I’m not an actor or paid spokesperson. Your results may vary.
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  16. #56

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    So if they offered free upgrades to everyone wheres the problem that you started out with??? You posted all this for nothing. Read that again. I dont think you understand the earlier posts. Im keeping it alive because i ate some cash when i built my plane, wasnt on landing gear, had some learning curves to overcome. All my own fault. Nobody elses. Hoping first time builders understand this stuff. Go to your post number 10 and read it again, and now you say theres no problem, everyone is taken care of for no cost, im confused. Lots of bungees and hydrosorbs on 2200 lb cubs just have to put the right ones on, they wont turn into spaghetti. What number bungees did they do there tests with? And now your saying gen2s are even lightweights, thats interesting also. How come acme on there website dosent tell people there 1st 2 generations are lightweight? By the way, i dont love bungees i just know there time tested and work, i always keep an open mind.
    Last edited by tempdoug; 03-08-2018 at 07:19 PM.

  17. #57
    Todd long's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tempdoug View Post
    So if they offered free upgrades to everyone wheres the problem that you started out with??? Read that again. I dont think you understand the earlier posts. Im keeping it alive because i ate some cash when i built my plane, wasnt on landing gear, had some learning curves to overcome. Hoping first time builders understand this stuff.
    Is English your second language? I’m having problems following exactly what your point or question is here. I don’t think first time builders can even understand what you just wrote.

    to quote billy Madison
    Mr. Tempdoug, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having read it.
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  18. #58
    Todd long's Avatar
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    How many times are you going to keep editing your post? Wow.
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  19. #59
    Todd long's Avatar
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    They don’t tell them they are lightweight because they came in different versions. One for light sport or J3 weight one for standard 2000# super cubs. Now with the experimental supercub clones pushing up to 2500# they offer a heavyweight version, along with the standard 2000# and light sport 1300# versions.

    Do do some research. This information is readily available. Or you could just call the guys at ACME. They would gladly answer any questions you might have.

    You seem to think I have some vendetta against Javeron , which I don’t, but you clearly have one against ACME.
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  20. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by Todd long View Post
    How many times are you going to keep editing your post? Wow.

    trying to listen to a basketball game and attend to this at the same time, sorry.

  21. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by Todd long View Post
    They don’t tell them they are lightweight because they came in different versions. One for light sport or J3 weight one for standard 2000# super cubs. Now with the experimental supercub clones pushing up to 2500# they offer a heavyweight version, along with the standard 2000# and light sport 1300# versions.

    Do do some research. This information is readily available. Or you could just call the guys at ACME. They would gladly answer any questions you might have.

    You seem to think I have some vendetta against Javeron , which I don’t, but you clearly have one against ACME.

    Vendetta, yep because of your post number 10.

  22. #62
    Todd long's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Todd long View Post
    Ok, here’s the specific. Jay sent a set of acme shocks with the plane kit. Problem is they were the lightweight ones for a J3. 1320#. Not going to work.




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    So from my post#10.
    And the bungee lovefest and Acme vendetta comes from where. I said they were the lightweight ones. Not all gen2 are all lightweight. Where are you reading any of that into the above sentence?
    Have you built a Javeron, flown one, bought ACME shocks, flown ACME shocks?

    You may not like me, but you do realize I have no connection with ACME, right?
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  23. #63

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    #10 you say, quote-it cost a bunch of money. now in post 55 you say they did everything for free. whats a bunch of money, 40 bucks for shipping?

  24. #64
    Todd long's Avatar
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    Check the timeline of this thread....
    post 10 was 2/27. Jay had not contacted ACME yet. At that point Paul had not been able to resolve the problem with Javeron and to keep flying had to buy a new set from ACME. Jay finally contacted ACME on 3/4. This was after Paul notified Javeron, and after this thread picked up a following.That’s when they worked out a solution and Paul was to get his refund for the original pair purchased. And that refund was to come from Javeron where he purchased the original set. And ACME went out of their way to replace the lightweight gen2 with heavyweight gen 3 for Jay even though he had long before ordered exactly that, a lightweight gen2 set.

    On the separate subject ACME offered the free upgrades for gen1 to gen2,which had nothing to do with anything here. At this point, based on the other PMs I have received and calls, I believe you are the only one here not comprehending this. ACME is the only vendor that has responded here, and it was because you continually post with a complete and incomprehensible lack of understanding of the facts presented and available.
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  25. #65

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    So these were used ones allready on a flying airplane, that this guy didnt trust or somehow figured out they were the light ones? Let me ask a question, when the first ones came out , as your saying they made a heavy and light version or was the guy scared when he seen the picture. then you say they exchanged everyones for free. tell me more what im missing. If i have to apologize at the end of this, i will, but so far ive havent seen any reason.

  26. #66
    Todd long's Avatar
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    Call the guys at ACME.
    Let em help you, from above
    Please don't hesitate to contact me if you have any further questions. 704-806-3582
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  27. #67

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    Tell me all about how all your business has went with jay, i would really like to know. You put this here lets figure it out here.

  28. #68
    cubdriver2's Avatar
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    You guys aren't married to each other, are you?

    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"
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  29. #69
    Todd long's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tempdoug View Post
    Tell me all about how all your business has went with jay, i would really like to know. You put this here lets figure it out here.
    Dude, sorry but I’m becoming bored with you. Find a new thread. And some thought I was the troll
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  30. #70

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    Dont get bored. See i bought a airframe from a guy once, the guy showed me one that wasnt his and said i make these. first screw up i made was not to ask him if it was one of his, well it wasnt, So he made me one, brought it to my place and i thought what the he%%, from where the jackscrew for the trim goes, the top flange was off by 3/4 inch just to start with. Took it back, built another, got it about 9 months later, I went and got it. looked alot better, started doing some measuring and i thought things arent right here either, so i thought ive got to get this checked, JE Soares was the only guy with a jig around then, took it out to him and we put it in the jig just to make sure, i about cried how poor things were and how far off. I paid JE about 2100 if i remember right to cut it up and get things close. Then JE showed me some welding problems, and i thought enough is enough, so i took it back. I had about 5 grand in all this and ended up with nothing. Guy give me my original money back because i was going to camp out at his place until we figured it out. So he was good that way. And me sticking my money into it that was my own call. JE built me a new frame and that money i ate was well worth it. There was some pa12 frames that had a lot of the same issues. This whole thing is hopefully a heads up for first time builders. But please tell me how your dealings with Jay have went?

  31. #71
    Todd long's Avatar
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    All of that would have to do with this how? And has what to with ACME s bungees , and shocks that are 2 generations old but still safe?
    If you are thinking of buying and building a Javeron, do it. It won’t be cheap. But if you want something new, no matter how you slice it, it’s the best bang for the buck. But I’m getting the feeling you like to post more than build or fly. I’m at work getting paid today, but nothing to do, what’s your excuse?
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  32. #72
    WindOnHisNose's Avatar
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    I think it is time to close the thread.

    Randy
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