Bart23Sept
Registered User
Pittstown, NJ
Thank you very much John, all good info.
Anybody know of a full time shop that uses Stewarts as their system of choice? Day in and day out.
Overall I like the theory of Stewart's and getting away from VOC's but getting consistent professional results seems harder with it as it's way less forgiving than polyfiber/dope. I like their glue, had trouble with the ekofill when I sprayed it got run's and if you lessened the fluid control to stop the run's it would hit the fabric dry and have a sandpaper like feeling just no happy medium. The ecofill sands nice so after talking with Jason when he worked there I settled on shooting it dry and sanding it smooth as it was easier than sanding runs out, but the problem only appeared after I applied the yellow ekopoly. The sandpaper did not reach into the pinked edges of the tapes and after the yellow was on there was perfect 2" gritty lines runing down the sides of the fuselage. Never had problems painting ecopoly sprayed very similar to aerothane and that is where most seem to have trouble, had a little more orange peel than I like but I didn't want to deviate from the direction.
Did I just get a bad batch of ecofill? Don't know but it seems that most 1st timers that are using the system paint things flat and one side at a time so you don't get runs and I goes on fine as did my tail feathers but if you are doing this for a living you don't have time to paint one side at a time plus It looks better painted all at once handing or in a rotator. Is it the lack of solvents that give it bite into the brushed coat? What ever happened to the blisters that were appearing a few years down the road if it got wet or in high humidity? Stewart's is finiky about the spray gun you use, now do you have a compressor that has the CFM's that the finish line HVLP they recommend needs, got to have real clean air so now you need filter system, all stuff you need for any system but polyfiber can be sprayed with about anything short of a garden hose and get descent results. My friend Lynn uses a turbine HVLP for everything from polyspray to aerothane and he's winning lindys with his planes, don't know how Stewart's works with turbine systems but it wasn't recommended to me at the time I used it.
I think this is a pretty fair comment. For success with Stewart Systems, It does require that you follow the steps laid out in the manual. If you try to wing it than the variables will stack up against you and problems will crop up. The picture below are panels shot by first time Stewart Systems users at the seminar I taught in December. These were all shot in my home shop with just the basic set up recommended in the manual. I use a compressor bought on Craigs list, a home made dryer found here on SC, and the spray gun recommended in the manual. My set up is not high tech at all. I try to teach and show that exceptional results can be achieved with out a huge investment in equipment. I'm more than happy to share the techniques needed to get this kind of finish. A couple options I'd like to offer. I'll be doing workshops in a few weeks at the US Sport Aviation Expo in Sebring Florida from Jan 24-27. We will be there and teaching all during the expo. These are free workshops. If you are in the area, come say high and sit in on the workshops. I'll be happy to share everything and answer any questions. We will also be at Sun N Fun in April, and have a booth at the Alaska Aviation Gathering May 5 & 6 in Anchorage. Oshkosh will follow in July, again with workshops the entire week. The idea here is education. The more you know and understand the system the better the results you will get. I'll be doing another seminar in California in March and I'm also available to do a seminar at your location. Please, if you have any questions, let me know. Supercub.org has been so good to me over the years I want to give back in any way I can. One of these days, I'll actually be finished with my project!Thanks for the feedback. The impression I'm getting is that if you really follow the directions and maybe even use tweaks that people familiar with the system are willing to offer then you've got a good chance of getting great results. If you wing it then all bets are off. I have to admit, when it turns out just right it's pretty damn nice!
4th plane with Stewarts, I've been flying the Bearhawk since 2010. . I paint lots of things (like the Cobra, not Stewart's) and I'm fussy]View attachment 34552]
I had a tank on my Cub split and leak, Av gas ran on the inside of the wing as well as on the outside as well as the fuselage. It is finished with the Ekofill, Ekoprime, and their top coat. It did not damage the finish. Stewart’s had told me years ago that Mogas will cause damage if on the inside of the fabric because of the various chemicals used in the formulation of the Mogas. They recommend spraying the tank bay.Marty, any comment on the EkoPrime/fuel compatibility? My intent certainly wasn’t to bash the product- I definitely plan to keep using it- just curious if I screwed something up or if others have noticed this too...?
I've always shot it hanging, never had a problem. I teach the paint class at Sun 'n Fun for them...it's taught vertical. No need to shoot horizontal. It's not difficult, but it IS different. The people that seem to have the most problems are ones that have lots of experience...myself included...I have to constantly remind myself to follow procedures.
John
I've never had a problem with ekofill flat or horizontal. That Sata 4000 is my favorite gun but honestly I shoot the Ekofill with my old Devilbiss Finishline with a big 1.8 tip. Don't know, maybe those good guns atomize the Ekofill too much? Do you have a decent primer gun to try?Marty,bear hawk and anybody else that has had multiple successe with Stewart's are you painting everything flat or have you been able to paint vertical without problems? I'm mainly intrested in ecofill as I found spraying ecopoly no diffrent than spraying aerothane and had good results with it, ecofill has been my only gripe with Stewart's and it seems I'm the only person who can f*@k it up. At the time I was using a Sata 4000rp but have now bought a 5000rp and 1000k pressure pot set up so maybe someday I'll give it a try on somthing small and see if what happens.
Not sure about the gun set up you are using; specifically the pressure pot. No idea how that will effect the paint or Ekofill; something we haven't worked with as far as I know. I teach with the Finishline 4 with 1.5 tip for Ekofill and 1.3 tip for Ekopoly. As for vertical or horizontal, no difference. I taught with both methods in December with no difference in results.Marty,bear hawk and anybody else that has had multiple successe with Stewart's are you painting everything flat or have you been able to paint vertical without problems? I'm mainly intrested in ecofill as I found spraying ecopoly no diffrent than spraying aerothane and had good results with it, ecofill has been my only gripe with Stewart's and it seems I'm the only person who can f*@k it up. At the time I was using a Sata 4000rp but have now bought a 5000rp and 1000k pressure pot set up so maybe someday I'll give it a try on somthing small and see if what happens.
Marty, any comment on the EkoPrime/fuel compatibility? My intent certainly wasn’t to bash the product- I definitely plan to keep using it- just curious if I screwed something up or if others have noticed this too...?
I don't have a strip handy but it would be a good test. CA gas is nasty stuff; it would be good to see how it reacts.Interesting Marty, you wouldn't happen to have a strip of Poly Fiber process to test for comparison?
I don't have a strip handy but it would be a good test. CA gas is nasty stuff; it would be good to see how it reacts.
Marty
I can send you a piece of poly fiber coated via snail mail... inspection hole cut outs...
Brian
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Ekoprime isn't an issue. When I tested the fabric in CA auto gas with ethanol, the Ekobond is what let go; the painted surface came off un-touched. Ekofill, Ekoprime and EkoPoly all seemed to be unaffected. One of the additives in the fuel attacked the ekobond. Andy tested the same fabric sample I used at Stewart Systems home base in Ohio. Auto fuel with ethanol there had no effect on the finish, same for clean Mogas. Ohio gas had no effect if the fabric was first shot in Ekopoly, followed by Ekofill than the top coat of Ekopoly. That's the problum, regional fuel uses what ever additives they want to achieve the octane and other ratings they want. Unpredictability with ethanol fuel is the issue. Mogas seems to be ok in most areas; none available here in CA.The auto fuel incompatibility issue seems like a big deal to me. Fuel spills happen, with certain colors like yellow, Ekoprime can’t be avoided, so I wonder how big of issue it is in the real world. Could be a deal breaker for some folks.