Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 41 to 66 of 66

Thread: Building an Experimental PA11

  1. #41

    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    nd
    Posts
    3,181
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by cubdriver2 View Post
    Has anyone just mounted a small gearmotor back there to run a belt/cable to just turn the stock pulley on the jackscrew?

    Glenn
    or just take the pulley off and hook the motor output shaft direct to the jackscrew?

  2. #42

    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Upper Peninsula of Michigan
    Posts
    405
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by tempdoug View Post
    or just take the pulley off and hook the motor output shaft direct to the jackscrew?
    Thats pretty much what bill rusk did on his Javron

  3. #43
    skywagon8a's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    SE Mass
    Posts
    9,166
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by tempdoug View Post
    or just take the pulley off and hook the motor output shaft direct to the jackscrew?
    Electric motors do not have much power when operating from a dead start. They would be much better in this type of application if they had a reduction gearing/belt pulley arraignment where the motor could get some RPM while doing it's work.
    Last edited by skywagon8a; 05-27-2018 at 12:54 PM.
    N1PA

  4. #44
    Southern Aero's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    kcco/1ga2
    Posts
    171
    Post Thanks / Like
    Glenn

    I haven't found a satisfactory way of driving the jack screw and leaving the manual trim in place............. need some kind of clutch/disconnect ...... I have experimented with several gearmotors but haven't found a lighter one that has enuff power to work under and air load. I have also been working on incorporating a Mitchell trim motor assembly from some old Piper Comanche Senaca, etc. Little heavy so have been working a modified gearmotor with same working principal. Will post something later on it if I get it to work properly. Maybe someone else has already done this and can shed some light?
    ......... It doesn't cost any more to go first class! You just can't stay as long.

  5. #45

    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    nd
    Posts
    3,181
    Post Thanks / Like
    thousands of high torque startup motors out there like this.https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NMDPQAQ...a-323303013812

  6. #46
    gbflyer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    PAGS
    Posts
    707
    Post Thanks / Like
    Can’t recall fooling with the trim much on the -11 we had. Had the -18 balanced tail, understand the Pacer width tail is the best.

    Certainly not a moose hauler. I’d think the Ray Allen servo and a tab would be a pretty simple and light solution. Works good on our current S7S. I doubt we use 5 degrees of the available deflection.

  7. #47
    Southern Aero's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    kcco/1ga2
    Posts
    171
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by tempdoug View Post
    thousands of high torque startup motors out there like this.https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NMDPQAQ...a-323303013812
    Yup, quite familiar with them ......... have quite a few. Would work fine but I want to be able to disconnect from the drive so I can manually trim. The Mitchell type have a spur gear that is disconnected when power to the drive motor and solenoid is removed allowing you to still manually trim. I am experimenting with that kind of disconnect with one of these gearmotors
    ......... It doesn't cost any more to go first class! You just can't stay as long.

  8. #48
    Gordon Misch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Toledo, Wa (KTDO)
    Posts
    3,310
    Post Thanks / Like
    Why do you want manual trim also? Redundancy? Fine adjustment? Just curious, thanks!
    Gordon

    N4328M KTDO
    My SPOT: tinyurl.com/N4328M (case sensitive)

  9. #49
    Southern Aero's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    kcco/1ga2
    Posts
    171
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Gordon Misch View Post
    Why do you want manual trim also? Redundancy? Fine adjustment? Just curious, thanks!
    Yes to both!
    ......... It doesn't cost any more to go first class! You just can't stay as long.
    Thanks Gordon Misch thanked for this post

  10. #50
    Gordon Misch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Toledo, Wa (KTDO)
    Posts
    3,310
    Post Thanks / Like
    Interesting. I will be helping a friend with an experimental -12, and I was planning to recommend to him an electric trim similar to what Stewart used. That's why I asked.

    So my follow-up question is, why the need for manual "fine adjustment"? The higher load capacity linear actuators have slower travel rates, which I think might be why Stewart's actuator has such a high force rating. I think.

    Calling Bill Rusk - - what is the travel rate of your electric trim system, and do you have issues with setting the trim "exactly" where you want it?

    Redundancy, to me, isn't important because at least in my -12 I only touch the trim for changes in loading.

    Edit: I think that cruise would be the only flight regime where an "exact" trim setting would be desirable. But in that regime a small change in engine power setting can achieve approximately the same effect as a small change in trim setting. Or I just set my arm on my lap so there is a slight stick pressure.

    Not trying to be adverse, just trying to envision an optimal solution. Thanks - -
    Gordon

    N4328M KTDO
    My SPOT: tinyurl.com/N4328M (case sensitive)

  11. #51

    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    4,476
    Post Thanks / Like
    http://www.tcwtech.com/Safety-Trim-Page.htm

    Actuators will use the 10A model. High speed-low speed controllable and the low speed rate is user adjustable at the module.
    Last edited by stewartb; 05-28-2018 at 06:58 AM.
    Thanks JeffP thanked for this post

  12. #52
    Olibuilt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Montreal, Canada
    Posts
    806
    Post Thanks / Like
    I have about the same setup as Bill Rusk and I love it. No pulley or cables. Very simple. About 17 seconds on the ground.. Easy to trim perfect.

    I can't really see the purpose of having redundancy in a Cub trim system..? Worst case scenario is almost really a non event.
    Thanks PerryB thanked for this post
    Likes JeffP liked this post

  13. #53
    PerryB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Northern Calif.
    Posts
    1,779
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Olibuilt View Post
    I have about the same setup as Bill Rusk and I love it. No pulley or cables. Very simple. About 17 seconds on the ground.. Easy to trim perfect.

    I can't really see the purpose of having redundancy in a Cub trim system..? Worst case scenario is almost really a non event.
    Just power it through a pull-able (new word) circuit breaker, so it can be readily disabled should a switch stick.
    After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF !

  14. #54
    Gordon Misch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Toledo, Wa (KTDO)
    Posts
    3,310
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by stewartb View Post
    http://www.tcwtech.com/Safety-Trim-Page.htm

    Actuators will use the 10A model. High speed-low speed controllable and the low speed rate is user adjustable at the module.
    Stewart, could you please give an operational report on this system when you've flown it a bit?
    Gordon

    N4328M KTDO
    My SPOT: tinyurl.com/N4328M (case sensitive)

  15. #55
    PerryB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Northern Calif.
    Posts
    1,779
    Post Thanks / Like
    If I ever DO get around to building a SC it's going to have an electric actuator with a digital position indicator. Phooey on cables, wires, pulleys and springs.
    After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF !

  16. #56

    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Upper Peninsula of Michigan
    Posts
    405
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by PerryB View Post
    Just power it through a pull-able (new word) circuit breaker, so it can be readily disabled should a switch stick.
    Yes, just run the positive wire to a toggle switch ahead of the rocker switch so it can kill the juice if it sticks

  17. #57
    PerryB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Northern Calif.
    Posts
    1,779
    Post Thanks / Like
    I was just thinking of a plunger type CB, but the ones that have a protruding head that can be pulled. As opposed to the ones that push in flush.
    After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF !
    Likes Gary K liked this post

  18. #58
    Olibuilt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Montreal, Canada
    Posts
    806
    Post Thanks / Like
    I don't any trim indicator in my case. I Just takeoff full nose down trim and work my way from there.

  19. #59
    PerryB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Northern Calif.
    Posts
    1,779
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Olibuilt View Post
    I don't any trim indicator in my case. I Just takeoff full nose down trim and work my way from there.
    Just curious, is your plane somewhat aft on the CG? It surprises me you go to full nose down for takeoff. Or does that have something to do with a modified thrustline?
    After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF !

  20. #60

    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    4,476
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Gordon Misch View Post
    Stewart, could you please give an operational report on this system when you've flown it a bit?
    Slow speed might make sense for the RV guys who are all about going fast but I'm confident the faster speed will be fine in the Cub. It isn't that fast. And I do like the three second time limit. Nobody wants runaway trim and the little stick top switch is the weak link in the system.
    Thanks Dan Gervae thanked for this post

  21. #61

    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Upper Peninsula of Michigan
    Posts
    405
    Post Thanks / Like
    You can always try to make things easier when building your own cub...this boot cowl allows access to the front rudder pedals.
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	8D81DCC1-344B-4FD4-B62E-9CD51BA89D6B.jpg 
Views:	64 
Size:	73.0 KB 
ID:	41084Click image for larger version. 

Name:	D9FBCDBE-FD22-4DD1-83D4-EE9A3EE92D8D.jpg 
Views:	59 
Size:	62.2 KB 
ID:	41085
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	C0E5D940-0234-423F-9E66-F6E904952FCB.jpg 
Views:	55 
Size:	48.0 KB 
ID:	41086
    Likes jrussl, BC12D-4-85, CamTom12, stknrddr liked this post

  22. #62
    Olibuilt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Montreal, Canada
    Posts
    806
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by PerryB View Post
    Just curious, is your plane somewhat aft on the CG? It surprises me you go to full nose down for takeoff. Or does that have something to do with a modified thrustline?


    I was teached to do so, for shorter takeoff distances. Just like full nose up for landing. But the plane feel more natural at about neutral trim.

  23. #63

    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Upper Peninsula of Michigan
    Posts
    405
    Post Thanks / Like
    Any of you out there with experience see an issue with me using a J3 engine mount? I know the PA11 is 4 degrees different....but what will this do? how will affect flight characteristics? This is a plans built fuselage and I have mounted the O200 using the J3 mount.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	FFW5.jpg 
Views:	42 
Size:	124.8 KB 
ID:	41092
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Engine2.jpg 
Views:	52 
Size:	65.4 KB 
ID:	41093

  24. #64

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    STL
    Posts
    253
    Post Thanks / Like
    Hot Damn Dan!! Looking good!! Your kickin my butt!
    If you get lost while flying, don't try hail a cop. Pick up the first railroad you find and hug it until you get somewhere.

  25. #65

    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    57
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Gervae View Post
    Any of you out there with experience see an issue with me using a J3 engine mount? I know the PA11 is 4 degrees different....but what will this do? how will affect flight characteristics? This is a plans built fuselage and I have mounted the O200 using the J3 mount.
    Leave the J3 mount; it is automatic thrustline-mod, and in my humble opinion, the only way to go on this fuselage/wing combo.

    Only downside is that on 29s with big gear, you won't be able to see much over the nose when on the ground. Takeoff, landing, flight characteristics of zerothrustline on this fuselage and wing is fantastic and far outweigh the need to s-turn while taxiing.

    (I fly a Wag Aero J3/PA-11 like thing with a zero-ish degree thrustline up on big tires and gear)
    Thanks Dan Gervae thanked for this post
    Likes Southern Aero liked this post

  26. #66

    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Upper Peninsula of Michigan
    Posts
    405
    Post Thanks / Like
    I haven’t worked on my project much this summer since I took on building a new hangar....I did take it all apart for fabric work ( only fuselage and ailerons left to cover) but I had a local guy do me up some seats. I think they look pretty nice.
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	DAF3F4B9-4E8A-4A08-92A7-09F8D1D0D207.jpg 
Views:	46 
Size:	58.8 KB 
ID:	43924

Similar Threads

  1. building exp PA11
    By jon s. blocker in forum Cafe Supercub
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 02-04-2014, 10:51 AM
  2. Are You Building an Experimental Cub?
    By Steve Pierce in forum Experimental Cubs
    Replies: 39
    Last Post: 01-22-2010, 07:18 PM
  3. Experimental SuperCub building
    By Jr.CubBuilder in forum Experimental Cubs
    Replies: 43
    Last Post: 04-21-2004, 04:03 PM

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •