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Thread: Cabin Vent Options

  1. #1
    Eddie Foy's Avatar
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    Cabin Vent Options

    Looks like I will be making a new boot cowl for my PA18 certified. I dont like the vent in front of the windshield. I especially dont like how the cable goes thru the firewall twice. There has to be a better way. I will be putting a snap vent in the left front side window.

    What say you all? any alternate ideas?
    "Put out my hand and touched the face of God!"

  2. #2
    wireweinie's Avatar
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    Open the door or open the window?

    Web

  3. #3
    Eddie Foy's Avatar
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    Web,

    Dont quit your day job.

    How about any useful, non smart ass answers?
    "Put out my hand and touched the face of God!"

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    cubdriver2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wireweinie View Post
    Open the door or open the window?

    Web
    It always amazes me that 95% of super cub guy's close the door. WTH. I have hours of ski time with the door open. What are you guys afraid of, falling out.

    Glenn

  5. #5
    wireweinie's Avatar
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    Just had to be said.

    Why not use the left window? Front or rear. Keeps you from having to poke a hole in a window or fuselage. And no control cables.

    Web

  6. #6

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    I have seen a side vent on the boot cowl. I have a vista vent in the side window in front of the slider. If you put one there put it as far forward as possible it will work better. I do open window but it cool the back seat passenger too much. If I was flying down there I would get as much venting as possible.
    DENNY

  7. #7
    Eddie Foy's Avatar
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    My left side window is a full slider. Does not have the forward fixed portion.
    "Put out my hand and touched the face of God!"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lefoy84 View Post
    Looks like I will be making a new boot cowl for my PA18 certified. I dont like the vent in front of the windshield. I especially dont like how the cable goes thru the firewall twice. There has to be a better way. I will be putting a snap vent in the left front side window.

    What say you all? any alternate ideas?
    I put a corresponding snap vent on the right side window and one in the front of each D window. The right side front snap vent moves an amayzing amount of air and the back vents when rotated backwards act as exhaust... Works wonders but I wouldn't give up the boot cowl vent at gun point because it cools your feet and helps distribute air from the heater.
    Remember, These are the Good old Days!

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    Quote Originally Posted by cubdriver2 View Post
    It always amazes me that 95% of super cub guy's close the door. WTH. I have hours of ski time with the door open. What are you guys afraid of, falling out.

    Glenn
    Nope, Heights.
    Likes Tennessee liked this post

  10. #10

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    I do not ordinarily fly in super cold environments. I have never actually used that vent on a Super Cub - but am puzzled as to why cables through the firewall pose a problem? The vent is behind the firewall, is it not?

    The Decathlon does have a vent problem - I did a little fiberglas tube to blow air on my nose after the first three slow rolls. Now I need some way to shut it off without spending $300 for one of those eyeball deals.

    For normal stuff I just installed those round deals in the window. Point them forward - mucho air. Point them aft - no air. They are simple circles of plastic, bent at about a 30 degree angle to scoop air - or not.

  11. #11
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    I like the original vent because it blows cool air on the firewall. PITA to install in a new bootcowl but once it is done it is done.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

  12. #12
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Location is important. The original location which you want to get rid of has the highest pressure for greater airflow, so is really the best location. The center base of a windshield due to the shape slows down the air velocity increasing the pressure. Stay away from the sides of the wraparound for two reasons. After flowing around the cowling, the air flows away from the sides and the hot cooling air from the engine is there. That air is hot enough so that my Cub gets some heat through the fabric, very warm.

    Consider the wing root fairing just below the center leading edge. Make a box with the air entering just behind the windshield with a flap to close and direct the air. Sort of like the Cessnas.
    N1PA

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    You can't beat the fresh air vent on the left side of the PA 22/20but it would be a little work

  14. #14
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yarddart View Post
    You can't beat the fresh air vent on the left side of the PA 22/20but it would be a little work
    The Super Cub has hot engine cooling air exiting the cowl door right there.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
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  15. #15
    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
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    Cabin Vent Options

    Quote Originally Posted by cubdriver2 View Post
    It always amazes me that 95% of super cub guy's close the door. WTH. I have hours of ski time with the door open. What are you guys afraid of, falling out.

    Glenn
    When it's really hot out, close the bottom door, you don't get the hot engine air. Cubcrafters doesn't have the vent on the boot cowl and uses the snap vent. Ask little wing how his works in his cub.

    When it gets cold I turn the heater on and then use the factory vent to blow the hot air back. Works well

  16. #16
    Eddie Foy's Avatar
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    Maybe I can engineer a way to open and close the existing cowl vent without running a looped cable thru the firewall.
    "Put out my hand and touched the face of God!"

  17. #17
    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lefoy84 View Post
    Maybe I can engineer a way to open and close the existing cowl vent without running a looped cable thru the firewall.
    They looped the cable through the firewall so you can pull it open. Otherwise it would be a push open.

  18. #18
    wireweinie's Avatar
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    Change the lever on the vent? Besides going through the firewall twice, that cable has an extremely tight bend in it.

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  19. #19

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    Rig your cab heat to be cab cool.

  20. #20
    cubdriver2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tempdoug View Post
    Rig your cab heat to be cab cool.

    I like that idea. The Tripacer vent on the left side works great, I have it open a little all winter. And if you hook your heat up like I did here it will blast you out of the front seat with the bottom T closed off. Most 10F days I only have half the heat on.

    Glenn

  21. #21
    Eddie Foy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RaisedByWolves View Post
    They looped the cable through the firewall so you can pull it open. Otherwise it would be a push open.
    I can live with that. I will run the cable in from the rear. Swapping the cabin heat cable to the vent is not a bad idea either.
    "Put out my hand and touched the face of God!"

  22. #22
    Chicken Hawk's Avatar
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    How about just a pivot bracket made as light as possible? Might be same weight as section of removed cable. Excuse the crude drawing, but you get the idea.

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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  23. #23
    Chicken Hawk's Avatar
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    Or a sleeved push/pull rod if you have a fairly straight shot at it........just kicking some ideas out.

    Attached Images Attached Images  

  24. #24
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Piper had a good design in my opinion. The control is high and to the right. It is pulled out to actuate. It is not in the way when actuated. Never seen an issue with the cable looping back through the firewall.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

  25. #25
    Eddie Foy's Avatar
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    Steve,

    I have had issues with mine. I dont think it had been closed in a loooong time before I got the plane. Took a lot of cussing and lubing to get it to work. That 180 bend puts a lot of friction on it.

    Look at it this way. The vent is open 99 % of the time..That means it it sticking out. Mine was right next to my mixture and in the way when pulled out.

    If I attach it to the back, 99% of the time it will be pushed in and out of the way..I can place it near the edge of the panel.

    Call me wierd, but I like to minimize the numbers of holes in the firewall.
    Last edited by Eddie Foy; 12-18-2015 at 05:59 PM.
    "Put out my hand and touched the face of God!"

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    I was going to ask that. If minimizing the holes in your firewall is a big deal, go for it. Is it that you are afraid that a fire will come through the extra holes?

    If I were afraid of a fire in front of the firewall, I promise you I would never set foot in one of these things. I do not think small holes in the firewall filled with wires and RTV will cause additional problems if a fire occurs. You are in trouble from the get-go.

  27. #27
    nanook's Avatar
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    The top vent leaks water. Very poor design. Not going back in my boot cowl...

  28. #28
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nanook View Post
    The top vent leaks water. Very poor design. Not going back in my boot cowl...
    That's probably why Piper put the locking knob on it. Ya I know it is a pain to get in there to undo it.
    N1PA

  29. #29
    Eddie Foy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    That's probably why Piper put the locking knob on it. Ya I know it is a pain to get in there to undo it.
    I will bet that a lot of Cub owners, me included, didnt know it had a locking knob.
    "Put out my hand and touched the face of God!"

  30. #30
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nanook View Post
    The top vent leaks water. Very poor design. Not going back in my boot cowl...
    But you live in Alaska where your SC probably lives outside and probably rarely need it. I have not had any leaking issues. I do install new gasket on the vent when riveting together and on the door. Much needed when flying in Texas but I figured not so much in Alaska.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

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    Alaskan summers require ventilation. My new project will include an Ultimate Ventilator inlet vent at pilot and passenger positions as well as an aft baggage outlet air vent to allow air to flow through and out both for fresh air and to control smells when hauling fuel, power tools, wet dogs, etc. The ultimate ventiators are expensive but they direct air flow better than any other vent I've seen for Cub plexi.

  32. #32
    nanook's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    But you live in Alaska where your SC probably lives outside and probably rarely need it. I have not had any leaking issues. I do install new gasket on the vent when riveting together and on the door. Much needed when flying in Texas but I figured not so much in Alaska.
    it is actually a very poor design! A man made water trap. Much room for improvement there. I'm using the little threaded side vents.

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    The ultimate vent story. When I officially started the exhaust business in 1990, Mr. Dean Cochran was my mentor. He was a fantastic guy and a gentleman in every way. One day at lunch he pulled this funny looking little thing out of his pocket and asked me what I thought. I looked at it and said the machine work on it was fantastic but does it work. He explained that many of the T-18s use it and thought the RV crowd might be interested. I took one and mounted it my RV-4, and it worked very well. I asked Dean to get them made but his response was "no way, I'm retired, but if you want them, take this one, get them made and pay me a royalty. I did that, and in a short time I realized a bigger model was needed as the original style was for planes that cruised in the 180-200 mph area. I took the small one had it enlarged and called it the 100 mph model. Every trip I went on, I took the 2 sizes of vents along and showed them to anyone interested. I sold a few of them but wasn't really serious about advertising them. Then one day the phone rang and it was aircraft spruce and specialty. They had heard about the vent and wanted them in their catalog. The rest is history.
    the ultimate vent is made by starting with a solid billet of aluminum. They are quite work intensive, and precisely machined to make the disc articulate correctly into the wind and close correctly so they don't leak air. Yes, they are pricey, but they work well and will last a life time. They are also available direct from Clint at Vetterman Exhaust as he keeps a good supply of them. So that is the vent story-short version. I have 4 of them in my cub. 2 in front and 2 in the back. One of the neat things about them is air flow can be directed up toward your head or down toward your lap by just changing the position of the articulating disc. Hope you enjoyed the story. Larry Vetterman

  34. #34
    nanook's Avatar
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    How about a link to a picture

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    A picture would be good and I could do that, however I am 900 miles away at my kids for Christmas right now. I bet Clint would go over to my hangar and do it so I will try to get ahold of him. Larry v.

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    Here is a pic of the ultimate ventilator with Devils tower in the background. It was about 70 degrees that day and I only needed one vent barely cracked to give plenty of cool air. This was in a Cirabria. Clint
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    Last edited by Super11XP; 12-19-2015 at 10:34 AM.

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    This is the first I've heard of two sizes. Which is Spuce selling? How much difference is there?

  39. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by stewartb View Post
    This is the first I've heard of two sizes. Which is Spuce selling? How much difference is there?
    Aircraft Spruce sells the large ones. Vans sells the small ones. The large ones have a 1/7/8" disc whereas the small ones are about 1"

  40. #40
    nanook's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    That's probably why Piper put the locking knob on it. Ya I know it is a pain to get in there to undo it.
    Locking the knob doesn't keep the water out. $800 repair bill on a friends KY96 from water damage last Spring.

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