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Thread: Oops, darn it...

  1. #1521
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...rash-1.5471317


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  2. #1522
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    We lost a Citabria 7GCBC's wings today in Fairbanks likely due to snow load and rear wind. A full winter's snow of at least 16 lb/sq ft and 10 mph wind. The plane had drooped it's controls for a few weeks and the rear wood spars were finally slightly bending down at the tip. Rear struts failed in two places but the jury struts and front spars remained straight. Wings twisted from the root to the tip. It's been generally unattended for several years but the local owner cleans it when notified by the airport. Pics later but what a shame.

    Gary
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  3. #1523
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    Yet another very sad Part 135 accident near Bethel: https://app.ntsb.gov/pdfgenerator/Re...relim&IType=FA

    Read it carefully and note the tough conditions versus level of experience and alleged equipment onboard.

    Gary
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  4. #1524
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BC12D-4-85 View Post
    Yet another very sad Part 135 accident near Bethel: https://app.ntsb.gov/pdfgenerator/Re...relim&IType=FA

    Read it carefully and note the tough conditions versus level of experience and alleged equipment onboard.

    Gary
    GPS into flat terrain......

  5. #1525
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike mcs repair View Post
    GPS into flat terrain......
    From the Prelim NTSB: "The airplane was not equipped with a tracking device, functional ADS-B, recorder devices or a GPS with non-volatile memory." Not sure what all that means if true.

  6. #1526
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BC12D-4-85 View Post
    From the Prelim NTSB: "The airplane was not equipped with a tracking device, functional ADS-B, recorder devices or a GPS with non-volatile memory." Not sure what all that means if true.
    no SPOT or Spider trax like device:
    maybe had ADS-B, not working/turned on: because??
    no voice recorder:
    GPS that couldn't save where it had been:

  7. #1527
    Gordon Misch's Avatar
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    Ugh. Poor visibility over flat snow. Tough conditions. A shame.
    Gordon

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    My SPOT: tinyurl.com/N4328M (case sensitive)

  8. #1528
    aktango58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike mcs repair View Post
    no SPOT or Spider trax like device:
    maybe had ADS-B, not working/turned on: because??
    no voice recorder:
    GPS that couldn't save where it had been:
    Pretty much sums it up...

    Saw a post on FB that the FAA had sat in on the pilot's training and check ride, (if not given the checkride).

    Very sad. pay attention to what the weather is doing around you.
    I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!

  9. #1529
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    Flying into the mid-day sun filtered through an indefinite ceiling over flat featureless white ground, and possibly also frozen moisture crystals or snow. Don't get much tougher VFR.

    Gary

    Edit: Sun angle about 13 degrees above the horizon 2/6/20 almost head-on the flight. Light gets scattered and wavelength filtered through clouds and ends up "flat" yielding few shadows or terrain features like Gordon notes above. Ground is essentially flat tundra with no real trees for contrast. Visually merging cloud and ground layers are typical for that condition. Pilot per FAR 135.243 (b) and (c) may have been limited to VFR due to flight time. Deviate and save yourself or others as required in my opinion.
    Last edited by BC12D-4-85; 02-28-2020 at 12:14 AM.
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  10. #1530
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    Someone flying along the Colorado River from Moab to Grand Junction yesterday.
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  11. #1531

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    Water skipping will be fun, and expensive.
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  12. #1532

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    Wonder how many GoPro mounts and flying cowboy stickers are on it?
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  13. #1533
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    Wow, they didn’t just roll it over and fly home?

    MTV
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  14. #1534
    RVBottomly's Avatar
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    Interesting exhaust setup. Or maybe I'm not used to looking at them from that angle.

    But that poor front left strut. Almost looks like someone stomped on it.

  15. #1535
    RVBottomly's Avatar
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    I saw another photo of that cub in the Colorado:

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    If he flipped straight over, I think he had to pass below a low cable--looks like a river crossing tram.
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  16. #1536
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    I don' see prop damage in the photos I have seen.

    Did it go in under power?
    I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!

  17. #1537

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    Quote Originally Posted by KevinJ View Post
    Wonder how many GoPro mounts and flying cowboy stickers are on it?
    looks like it might be a fellow Texan.

  18. #1538

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    That line is even hard to see in the picture. That gives me the willies when you see it from that angle.....I also wondered about the prop. Looks pretty intact even though the spinner is crushed.

  19. #1539
    courierguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvivion View Post
    Wow, they didn’t just roll it over and fly home?

    MTV
    Only the Kitfox pilots do that! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQ3WByjahOc

  20. #1540
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    Don’t know what happened or if the cable was a factor, sure glad the pilot is ok. I grew up in that country. You are playing with fire flying in any of those canyon bottoms. I see those guys videotaping that stuff out there and it gives me a cold shiver. Came upon a smoking hole in the ground that was once a JetRanger. The rotor system was sheared off and laying behind and under the wire. 35 years have passed and the scene still visits me some nights.
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  21. #1541
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    Quote Originally Posted by gbflyer View Post
    Came upon a smoking hole in the ground that was once a JetRanger. The rotor system was sheared off and laying behind and under the wire. 35 years have passed and the scene still visits me some nights.
    Was that in the southwest, Arizona or new Mexico? A fellow who I taught to fly seaplanes did that to himself about that time with a helicopter. Two people. I think that he had been doing some lifting work and was on the way home for the day.
    N1PA
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  22. #1542
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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    Was that in the southwest, Arizona or new Mexico? A fellow who I taught to fly seaplanes did that to himself about that time with a helicopter. Two people. I think that he had been doing some lifting work and was on the way home for the day.
    CO. Black Canyon of the Gunnison River just above the forks where the high tension lines cross.

  23. #1543

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    no big orange balls i take it?

  24. #1544
    PerryB's Avatar
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    Not on the cable anyway.
    After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says WTF !
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  25. #1545
    SJ's Avatar
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    Flaps are fully down, might have just been over braking on landing?


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    "Often Mistaken, but Never in Doubt"
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  26. #1546
    courierguy's Avatar
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    Anyone getting the idea to follow the Yellowstone River from the south, up to where it intersects with the Missouri, (a great scenic flight BTW) be advised there is one particular set of smaller wires about 40' above the river (but big enough), in an area that is far from any development/in the middle of nowhere, with the poles hidden by trees. We all look for the poles right? They are a pretty good indicator of wires are after all, but when the poles are obscured a bit it can up the ante quite a bit. Balls on the wire...ha! Nope, in this case ( I went around twice for another look) just the wires themselves were the indicator that you might have a real problem if you don't pull up real soon.

    Making up somewhat for this bit of excitement was the big sand bar where the rivers tied in, custom made for a fat tired plane to land on and obverse the current flow.

    Anyone following the Snake downstream out of Alpine WY, over and down from the dam about 8 miles, there are a large set of lines about 300' above the river. Their unusual height, though on not so tall towers, is because the river cuts so deep there and the towers are up on the bluffs. The few balls have faded and shifted their position, well off to the side. This situation is a perfect storm for the unwary pilot:a scenic and somewhat heavily flown route, and no notice on the SLC sectional. Someone, me I guess, needs to lobby the Feds to get a call out on the chart for them, a heads up. They've been on my radar for over 20 years, and I'd feel terrible to hear about an accident due to them. 43.488811° -111.428655° if anyone is interested, and yes the river has a lot of great gravel bars!

    I HAVE been preemptive in personally taking down 2 abandoned MET towers, unlit, galvanized grey/no paint or lights, and 150' high! New regs on these things make these older ones technically illegal, or at least out of compliance. Hard as hell to see, and cable braced, cut a few cables with a battery operated cutoff wheel and they come down real easy, kinda fun too. The companies that put them up, after the wind farm idea falls thru, don't take them down! They are not worth the labor involved. It's up to us (no one else cares, maybe birds) to contact the landowners and get it done. They are always in quite remote areas, and have no ready vehicle access, if a road was cut in for it's erection it is long grown over. As a result, the light gauge tubing and cabling are left on site, though I did pack out a few hundred feet of the cable for misc. use, that was my pay.
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  27. #1547
    hotrod180's Avatar
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    Just SE of the Concrete WA airport is some low ridges that I sometimes fly between instead of above.
    I was flying up that way a couple years ago, and saw that someone had a tower logging show going on.
    (if you don't know what that is, google it or watch Axmen on TV)
    The cables spanned from one ridge to the other-- that definitely coulda ruined someone's day.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!
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  28. #1548
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    I was a bit disheartened with the latest post with the Carbon Cub upside down in the river but it has brought up a good point. I fly our local river a lot just above the water. Several years ago I had my head up my ass and didn't verify I was where I thought I was. Decided this new bar looked worth investigating and dropped down to take a look. Saw and powerline, pushed the nose over and jammed the throttle in. Before I knew it I was carening down through the trees. Wasn't pretty, had to hike 5 miles to figure our where I was on the road system for Cathy to come a get me. Fracture my jaw in 3 places, broke my arm and there were other injuries that came up later. Lesson i learned was always fly high cover, verify everything and take nothing for granted. I love flying the river, landing on gravel bars and such but the older the get the more I learn and the more careful I am. Learn from me being a dumb ass so you don't have to.

    I was lucky, small wire went through the leading edge.
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    Hit the strut first, slid up it and got caught in the tie down fitting.
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    Did this to the aileron.
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    Was not a good day.
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    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers
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  29. #1549
    RVBottomly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KevinJ View Post
    That line is even hard to see in the picture. That gives me the willies when you see it from that angle.....I also wondered about the prop. Looks pretty intact even though the spinner is crushed.
    I don't know that answer to this: if you have a prop-strike on water, do the tips bend back?

  30. #1550
    RVBottomly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    I was lucky, small wire went through the leading edge.
    Yowsa, Steve. Thanks for posting. You were being looked after.
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  31. #1551
    courierguy's Avatar
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    "didn't verify I was where I thought I was"!

    Not to be confused with not knowing where you are! A subtle difference perhaps, you KNOW where you are, and act accordingly. I too got bit once by just that situation. I had let my guard down, "knowing" that the steep ridge landing, requiring a fair bit of throttle and a brisk taxi rate up so as to not get bogged down, had a clear area on top big enough to make my turn around. Problem was, I had gotten this ridge confused with the one right next to it. I had over flown it a few minutes earlier, eyeballed it, decided not to land it just then, and continued on. Then a few miles away I changed my mind and re approached it from 180 degrees different and 1,000' lower, and got optically fooled into the "not where I thought I was" thing. Instead of a clearing when I fast taxied up in the clearing (with the up angle and the viz over the cowl blocking my vision)I found myself in almost waist high thick sage brush and ended up on the spinner. Very few other pilots have mentioned this scenario, NOW I am much more on my guard for the
    phenomenon. I landed exactly how and where I planned, but I wasn't where I thought I was, a sneaky thing to watch out for.
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  32. #1552

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    I think the props been forward when you hit water. Mike will probably try men here soon. Facebook has some more pictures he could’ve been doing a water assist landing and got low on power a bit too early. Hard to say, stuff happens.
    DENNY

  33. #1553
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    I was landing in Billington Sea pond just east of the PYM airport when suddenly I saw some wires right in front of my windshield. Pushed the nose down and just squeaked under them without touching. When I taxied back underneath them I spotted the poles hidden in the trees on opposite sides of the pond. I was in a Colonial C-1 and have no idea how the engine pylon missed the wires, it was that close.
    N1PA

  34. #1554
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Metal props bend forward when under power, back when no power.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

  35. #1555

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    FAA Accident report today says attempting to land on sandbar and hit cable and flipped over.
    John
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  36. #1556

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    Steve let's just not forget just how HOT it was the day we dragged ole' "Red1/2" out of there... Next time you get lost please do it in the winter!
    Last edited by OLDCROWE; 03-10-2020 at 10:34 AM.
    Remember, These are the Good old Days!
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  37. #1557
    cubdriver2's Avatar
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    Worth repeating what one of my older seaplane mentors always says. " The wires are there, you need to prove that they are not "
    Red placard that has been on his J4 floatplane panel for 40 years " THINK WIRES "

    Glenn
    Last edited by cubdriver2; 03-09-2020 at 06:46 PM.
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"
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  38. #1558

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    My seaplane instructor said the same thing. The wires are there. Prove that they are not.

  39. #1559

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    Awhile back I bought a cub from an IA representing the seller. Some weird "welts" on the leading edge of both wings got my attention. I brought it up with the IA who had been maintaining the plane since new, he informed me it was the result of a wire strike but assured me it was a non issue. Funny, no mention of the incident in logs, prop strike or otherwise. He assured me no prop strike and wings totally airworthy. I intended to completely rebuild the plane so wasnt too concerned over the matter.
    We struck a deal and arranged a time to dismantle and trailer the plane as well as meet the owner to deal with paperwork.
    On the agreed date I was introduced to the owner, a little crochety old cattle rancher who had used the plane to check on his stock, old age had set in and he quit flying.
    I brought up the wire strike incident with him and commended him on his good fortune. "Hell" he said "good fortune?!!, I flew into the only wires within 10 miles, the power lines leading to my house!!" but no prop strike? i replied, damn lucky! with that the IA proceeded to slink out of the the room as the owner went into detail how he firewalled the engine as a last ditch effort in hopes of cutting the wires. guess it worked.
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  40. #1560
    RVBottomly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
    he firewalled the engine as a last ditch effort in hopes of cutting the wires. guess it worked.
    We had an aerial applicator do that on our powerlines in the 70s. His prop and the knives on his landing gear made short work of the wires.

    It only took MT Power a week to get it restrung. And our applicator went home, checked things out, and came back to finish the field. (He mentioned how much easier it was with those wires gone....).
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