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Thread: PA-14 STC search.

  1. #1
    SpainCub's Avatar
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    PA-14 STC search.

    Hello all,

    I need some help location STCs for my new to me PA-14.
    Currently I need to find the best STC that would allow for a O-320 with the stock engine mount (long) and original cowling.

    Also, I would like help with STC SA4-412

    I can´t seem tho find the owner, this is what I got from the FAA DB:

    STC Number:
    SA4-412

    This certificate issued to:
    Bates Aviation Inc

    STC Holder's Address:
    940 East 120th St.
    HawthorneCA90250
    United States

    Description of the Type Design Change:
    Large PA-18 tail surfaces.



    I might just be in need of coffee or having a brain fart this morning.


    Thank you all,


    JM

  2. #2

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    Are you thinking of buying the 14 out of South Africa?

    I don't believe there is a STC, for a 12 or for a 14, for a O-320 conversion without 18 tail feathers or a beefed up motor mount.

    It is my understanding that that particular plane has neither.

    It seems to me that, at 50K US plus VAT and shipping, it is no great buy.

  3. #3
    SpainCub's Avatar
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    Thanks Paul,

    Did you get pictures for the SA cub? I had some have a look at it and he did not take picture…. he did tell me that the airplane was in pretty bad shape, but what do you expect for an all original 14?

    I am looking at the Ken More Air-Harbor STC, contacted them but I have had not feedback. My goal is to fully implement the Crosswind STC (waiting on Charly to purchase) and use the Ken More STC to use M74DM prop for cruise. No need her for fast climb.

    Any one have further input? I was hopping to keep the original Cowling…. I really like the look vs the short cowling.

    All the best.

  4. #4

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    I am not sure what your country's requirements are, but the seller must provide a certificate of airworthiness for export in order to deregister it from SA and, at least in the United States, the aircraft must then have a conformity inspection prior to it being issued a US certificate of airworthiness and registered in the US.

    If Spain's Aviation Authority has similar requirements, that would mean the aircraft, as it sits in SA, would not qualify for either a certificate of air worthiness for export or for a new certificate of airworthiness and registration in the importing country because the 150 hp engine modification was not done in accordance with a valid STC.

    Also of note is that the engine is very close to TBO and is most likely beyond the recommended 10 year overall requirement suggested by Lycoming. That means that even if you can import it, you would not be able to use it in a commercial operation. (Be sure to verify the engine and prop model--Charlie's STC only apply to certain models).

    If, as your friend who looked at it suggested, it is in rough shape, you are looking at a complete rebuilt from the ground up. As I see it, what you are buying is an unairworthy collection of airplane parts and that, therefore, the purchase price should reflect that.

    If you haven't purchased it yet, you will probably want to add up the cost of making it the way you want it. If you are going to put Charlie Center's STC on it, you will need a new short motor mount and wall new engine cowlings, PA-18 tail Feathers, and likely an engine overhaul. Right there you're looking at $30 - $50,000 USD.

    Add to that a complete recover, avionics, and any modifications you want, and you are looking at spending around $100,000 in addition to the purchase price of the plane.

    If the plane was airworthy as it sits, and you didn't want or need to change it, it might be worth what they are asking, assuming the price included VAT, export fees, re-registration in your country, and shipping.

    Otherwise, you will likely be upside down in the plane before you ever lay eyes on it.

    You may be wealthy enough not to care what it costs. If so, have at it and enjoy!

  5. #5
    SpainCub's Avatar
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    Paul, I own 14-177 but since you mention it, I might offer them $25K for the airplane it´s cheaper to get it to Spain than the US and for that price I can always make it an adventure...
    Just dreaming, I am financially committed at the moment and the wife said, it´s either me or another plane... and now I have a new to me PA-14 in the hangar

  6. #6
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Kenmore has an STC for the O-320 but you must sleeve the bottom tubes of the engine mount, add Tri-Pacer crossover exhaust and balanced tail feathers.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

  7. #7
    SpainCub's Avatar
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    Steve, how do I reach them?

  8. #8

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    Here is the Link to Kenmore Air Harbor's STC list page: http://www.kenmoreairharbor.com/stcs.html

    Kenmore's STC does not apply to PA-14 series aircraft.

  9. #9
    SpainCub's Avatar
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    Paul, thank you for that... Yes I see that the 14 is not in the STC.... my search if further widen! Any takers?

    Regards,

    Jose

  10. #10
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    I have a PA14 coming in for annual in a month. I could have sworn the O-320 was installed via the Kenmore STC.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

  11. #11
    SpainCub's Avatar
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    Great Steve, I look forward to your info with the proper STC number. Charly over at Cross Winds also commented on this particular STC...
    Regards,

    Jose

  12. #12

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    What did Charlie say about the issue?

  13. #13

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    I will pull the STC next week and forward on the information on the 0-320 installation on my PA-14. It looks like Kenmore did a one time STC for a left-hand door STC on a PA-14 that references a 0-360 installation (on a -14). I could not find the 0-360 installation STC for a -14, other than Charlie Centers. Does anybody have a 0-360 STC for a PA-14 that lets you keep a cub style cowling?

    Ed

  14. #14
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Tab cleaned my office and I found the PA14 Lycoming O-320 STC. I was wrong, it was not a Kenmore STC but Susquehanna Aero Marine STC# SA1-573. Looks like it is now owned by Copper River Airmotive. Call Dee and I bet he can fix you up. http://www.crairmotive.com/forsale.htm
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

  15. #15
    SpainCub's Avatar
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    Great info Steve, thank you!!!

    Regards,

    Jose

  16. #16

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    Does that STC require SC tail and beefed up motor mount?

    Can you post the installaton requirements, please?

  17. #17
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    Hi did you come up with an STC? I’ve been trying to contact Copper River Airmotive based off of this thread, but no luck hearing back yet.. I have pa-14 side cowlings and a nose bowl, everything is mounted and fits well with an O/320 A2B but no paperwork on the project so before I got spending money I’m looking for some data that fits as close to he parts I have here. I have roughly 10 inches from the firewall to the back of the motor...


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  18. #18
    BC12D-4-85's Avatar
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    UNIVAIR has one listed SA83AL-501, same as from Stoddards in Anchorage.

    Edit: I see it uses the short mount so maybe not what you want.
    Last edited by BC12D-4-85; 10-04-2019 at 11:52 PM.

  19. #19
    mworks's Avatar
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    Hey to confirm, I just spoke with Copper River Airmotive today and their STC uses the long mount with drawings to beef up the lower tubes!


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  20. #20
    Alex Clark's Avatar
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    I did a float rating with a guy who had a PA-14 with a 180 horse, a squared tail and doors on both sides. It was a very zippy 14.. I sent him an e-mail but have not heard back...

    I think the gross weight was still an issue. Did anyone every come up with a gross weight increase STC for a 14??

  21. #21

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    Roger Borer (now his daughter, Karen Byerly) has his STC for the 14 to go to 1935lbs. I bought it for my 14!
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  22. #22

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    Mine was done with Mc Kenzie Flying Service inc. STC 5A4-78, which I believe Jerry Russell holds now or at least as of 2008 when I talked to him last.

    Roger Borer STC for the 1935 # but I thought Charlie Center might of had one as well but maybe those were field approvals.


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  23. #23

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    My understanding in talking with Karen is that her father partnered with Charlie center in the acquisition of the stc. They both ended up with a sellable STC. Not sure how that works but it's what she articulated to me. I have not looked at prints for the Charlie Center 1935# but she told me they are identical. I bought several of the Borer 14 STC's from her.

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