WhiskeyMike
MEMBER
West Boxford MA
Does anyone have the installation instructions for the Ferguson tips? "Upper Valley Aviation exhibit no. 2a report 101-250 dated august 30, 1965.
Thanks in advance!
Thanks in advance!
Wing Tip Shape Summary
- Thread starter Bill Rusk
- Start date
Cub junkie
Registered User
My Moms basement
Should be plenty of pictures on this board of tool time Tim's 2+2 with the wag aero tips. Good looking airplane/wing tips, don't know if they are good or bad for performance. Wing tips and their merits are highly subjective
SpainCub
Registered User
Wing tips are "really, really" hard to design and have added benefits. Most of them just add drag (yes, even those that are STC'd.) The Day and Night looks to be a bit toward the Horner type, but looks slim in size, so it is working almost like the bow... you gain mostly with the extra cubic feet of wing you get from this mod.
I'm tempted to say that the fenced tips, with a little tweaking to excite the air and keep outside air flow back without a tendency to creep over and decrease upper pressure should be the best performer on the low end of the flight envelop, on the high end (cruise) you will always get some extra drag, you can extend the TE to move the vortex further out and help building down wash over the tip, flattening out some what the load distribution of the wing (more fit) and/or extend the LE to make them work like a vortilon on the tips. I think Bill Husa (or some one close to him) did something like this for the Glassair Sportsman 2+2... I think.
I'm tempted to say that the fenced tips, with a little tweaking to excite the air and keep outside air flow back without a tendency to creep over and decrease upper pressure should be the best performer on the low end of the flight envelop, on the high end (cruise) you will always get some extra drag, you can extend the TE to move the vortex further out and help building down wash over the tip, flattening out some what the load distribution of the wing (more fit) and/or extend the LE to make them work like a vortilon on the tips. I think Bill Husa (or some one close to him) did something like this for the Glassair Sportsman 2+2... I think.
King Brown
Registered User
Nova Scotia
Aviation Consumer 25-30 years ago had a good look. Decided Mr. Piper built a good wingtip.
SpainCub
Registered User
Have a read here on TN 2440... Please note what JimC has to say on the subject, he is highly qualify to give a better assessment on the subject than I am.
However, I am encouraged as I have been getting very interesting results in the CL_max range of my airfoil. I have a shaped endplate that is substantially different to the image you provide, taking into account total chord for the endplate and some additional feature to excite the air flow from high pressure area to the exterior of the wing span. In other words, increasing the airflow on the lower camber and increase vortixity further back on the wings TE. This works best on a high camber airfoil and for droopy ailerons., so I am not sure how it applies to USA 35B MOD....
Here is a hint:
From some estimates, you can expect a 3-6% gain as per the paper and another two-folds of that over all for the vortixity effect on the Max L/D ratio (slow flying) but . You will still loose some 2-5 mph (guesstimate) with the added drag on the airplane.
I really liked the idea of adding slotted wingtip to a cub, JimC brought that up a long time ago, so I hope that he can take some time from with his day job work and we can encourage him to get this done soon to see how it works...
BTW, giving it some thought, anyone have plans for the droopy ailerons some have in their cubs? I was considering a mechanism that, when flaps, and droopy ailerons are enabled, a spoiler would be used to gain aileron authority for slow flight. I know Alec mentioned that it was not working as expected on the Double Ender for extremely slow flight, but it would be interesting to test it.
However, I am encouraged as I have been getting very interesting results in the CL_max range of my airfoil. I have a shaped endplate that is substantially different to the image you provide, taking into account total chord for the endplate and some additional feature to excite the air flow from high pressure area to the exterior of the wing span. In other words, increasing the airflow on the lower camber and increase vortixity further back on the wings TE. This works best on a high camber airfoil and for droopy ailerons., so I am not sure how it applies to USA 35B MOD....
Here is a hint:
From some estimates, you can expect a 3-6% gain as per the paper and another two-folds of that over all for the vortixity effect on the Max L/D ratio (slow flying) but . You will still loose some 2-5 mph (guesstimate) with the added drag on the airplane.
I really liked the idea of adding slotted wingtip to a cub, JimC brought that up a long time ago, so I hope that he can take some time from with his day job work and we can encourage him to get this done soon to see how it works...
BTW, giving it some thought, anyone have plans for the droopy ailerons some have in their cubs? I was considering a mechanism that, when flaps, and droopy ailerons are enabled, a spoiler would be used to gain aileron authority for slow flight. I know Alec mentioned that it was not working as expected on the Double Ender for extremely slow flight, but it would be interesting to test it.
Last edited:
skywagon8a
MEMBER
SE Mass MA6
Drooping ailerons are good. BUT, keep the control for drooping separate from the control for the flaps. There are times when you will want flaps down and the ailerons not drooped.
skywagon8a
MEMBER
SE Mass MA6
Don't remove the aileron droop system. Separate it from the flap system so that they operate separately from each other. I found that drooping ailerons reduce stall speed by 5-7 knots. Mine use a 172 flap motor to operate. No connection to the flaps. They are very helpful for take off into the wind. I agree with you on cross wind activities. I don't use them in crosswinds.
DW
Registered User
pacific northwest
I had mine separate from the flaps on off any time I wanted them...I would get maybe 3 to 5 slower if I was doing straight in approaches but working it in around trees in tight turns just didn't like the feel..another thing is I think you lose a little in aileron authority because of the springs in the system.
my complete system was about 4 1/2 lbs
my complete system was about 4 1/2 lbs
skywagon8a
MEMBER
SE Mass MA6
skywagon8a
MEMBER
SE Mass MA6
skywagon8a
MEMBER
SE Mass MA6
Only one of the four that I mentioned is in a Super Cub. I can not remember the details of the Cub, though I do not think that it had any springs. It was connected to the flap handle. I havn't seen that plane for a while, so it will be difficult to verify.
If it was connected to the flap handle then there are two springs in the system right there. I believe they are also referring to a system where the ailerons droop independantly of any flap setting.
skywagon8a
MEMBER
SE Mass MA6
Not the flaps. The flap handle.
Dakota tips. They slant cleanly up and out finishing rounded square. I previously had madras droop tips, and what i noticed most upon changing is much improved field of view, as well as i believe better aerilon response. Im pretty new at it, so color my opinion so.
Sent from my Milestone X2 using Tapatalk 2
Sent from my Milestone X2 using Tapatalk 2
Attachments
Thanks Charley for the quick reply. I just finished installing the Wag-Aero tips what's a little disappointed with fit. The install required the judicious heat gun. As there were big gaps on the bottom of the tip and still has some gaps. I probably should be sending the issue to Wag-Aero. I would understand If the airfoil was non-standard but the cub airfoil has been around for some time. I have not flown the plane yet with the new tips, be interested on how they perform.
