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Thread: windy outside..palmer ak?

  1. #41

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    It's windy around Lake Hood / Spenard. Had to spin the cub around which wasn't fun. A friends -12 took damage over in the fingers.

    Surprising how many guys don't watch it closer.

  2. #42
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    from www.adn.com

    A Cessna 180 with two people aboard flipped in the wind at Lake Hood, coming to rest in the choppy water with its floats sticking in the air. Both of those aboard got out safely.


    kinda reminds me of those poor people still missing in Katmai.... even with this nice close up picture in a small water way, if floats ended up scum side up they are very hard to see, especially from the air.......

  3. #43
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    another former customer just retied down 9908D that came loose , emailed, and was looking for owner info, googled it for him.... seems he's unlisted, if you know him call him and tell him....(Greg Sternquist, 14650 Wildien Dr, Anchorage, AK 99516)

    N9908D
    Do you know how to get registered owner. He came untied and I retied him. Want to tell him to check
    strange how people don't check on their planes when we get a blow.....

  4. #44
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    NOAK48 PAFC 250146
    PNSAFC

    PUBLIC INFORMATION STATEMENT
    NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE ANCHORAGE AK
    545 PM AKDT FRI SEP 24 2010
    ...WIND REPORTS FROM ACROSS SOUTHCENTRAL ALASKA...

    THE HIGHEST WIND GUSTS RECORDED TODAY AS OF 5:30PM ACROSS
    SOUTHCENTRAL ALASKA.

    -------------------------------------------
    SITE GUST
    -------------------------------------------
    BETWEEN WASILLA AND PALMER 78 MPH
    VALDEZ AIRPORT 62 MPH
    PALMER AIRPORT 61 MPH
    ANCHORAGE INTERNATIONAL AIRPORT 59 MPH
    WASILLA AIRPORT 52 MPH
    MERRILL FIELD IN ANCHORAGE 48 MPH
    KENAI AIRPORT 46 MPH

  5. #45
    StewartB
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    The highest wind velocity report on ANC's METAR history is 36. My planes have endured worse. I'm not home to attend to them but a friend checked them and didn't seem too concerned. Not much I can do anyway, except play golf.

    Beauty day in Texas yesterday. Heat index at 104. There was a very entertaining thunderstorm late, too. Today, more of the same. Love it!

    SB

  6. #46

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    What the hell, it looks like January up there already. You poor SOG's.

  7. #47
    bigrock's Avatar
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    Stewart, what part of Texas are you in?

  8. #48
    bigrock's Avatar
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    Stewart, what part of Texas are you in?

  9. #49
    StewartB
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    College Station. My daughter's a senior at A&M. We're regular visitors. Someday residents. I really like it here.

    Stewart

  10. #50
    bigrock's Avatar
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    If you like to bass fish you should come up and go fishing with me. I have 30 acres of private waters. We caught 20 this morning, three were over 5 Lbs. I am 160 miles north east of you. Not far considering you came from Alaska.

  11. #51
    bigrock's Avatar
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    If you like to bass fish you should come up and go fishing with me. I have 30 acres of private waters. We caught 20 this morning, three were over 5 Lbs. I am 160 miles north east of you. Not far considering you came from Alaska.

  12. #52
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike mcs repair
    hear someone is on mt. susitna with tie downs that wont hold, trying to hold the cub down by hand.... that don't sound promising....
    sounds like they went over edge into ravine... made it through with just one elevator needed...

  13. #53
    cubpilot2's Avatar
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    Ouch!! I was hoping we would avoid this sort of thing

    http://www.adn.com/2010/09/24/147053...iew=large_view

    Major bummer! Whos is it?
    Ed

  14. #54
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubpilot2
    Ouch!! I was hoping we would avoid this sort of thing

    http://www.adn.com/2010/09/24/147053...iew=large_view

    Major bummer! Whos is it?
    ouch..

    hard figuring what happen there, looks like one right rope broke, yet it looks to have extra tiedown on it, and ropes, post flip tied up?

  15. #55
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    I survived the March '03 windstorm with only (relatively) minor damage to my cub, which was on the Merrill ski strip at the time.

    Now I have a 180. What tie-down tips or mods specific to a 180 do y'all have? I'm all ears...

  16. #56
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slowmover
    I survived the March '03 windstorm with only (relatively) minor damage to my cub, which was on the Merrill ski strip at the time.

    Now I have a 180. What tie-down tips or mods specific to a 180 do y'all have? I'm all ears...
    one thing i thought of while i was retieing that guys 180 and cub.. was how the normal tie down knots was sliping up the main rope, if not soft.. so thought if its your normal spot and your ropes, tie a not in main rope a foot or 18" below your wing and do your tie down knot below this... then it will not slip up past that point and start bouncing, and untieing themselfs

    plus how rotten his ropes were getting... buy NEW ropes!!!

  17. #57
    Matt 7GCBC's Avatar
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    Just want to say thanks again to Dave Calkins, Clay, Star and whoever else was out there saving my plane while I was at work. I'm down at the S end of Lake Hood on an exposed dock which started coming apart with the wind and waves on Friday. The downwind float got stuck under the dock and put the whole thing in danger. By the time I arrived two aircraft across the south pothole by the museum had sunk and the 180 had just flipped on takeoff. My craft was taking a pounding, but had been pulled back and stabilized with the tails on the wall. My neighbor was still working to stabilize his and it looked like it was almost lifted too far by the waves and wind a couple times.
    Thanks again to all of you who were there for me.
    Matt




  18. #58
    StewartB
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    Quote Originally Posted by slowmover
    I survived the March '03 windstorm with only (relatively) minor damage to my cub, which was on the Merrill ski strip at the time.

    Now I have a 180. What tie-down tips or mods specific to a 180 do y'all have? I'm all ears...
    180s that are loosely tied can rock with the gusts and "walk" a gear leg under the plane until it collapses. I've seen one get close but have only heard of actual failure. Tie the plane snugly. Big tires allow more movement so consider that. I use the pull down tie rings for everyday but when the wind really gets after it I wrap the rope around the strut. I routinely use a yoke gust lock but in the wind I try to add external locks. All airplanes ride the wind better when facing nose to the wind rather than tail to, but spinning the plane can be more dangerous than leaving it secured as is. Do all you can and hope for the best. The best tip is to tie it down well every time. Good ropes, good earth anchors, tight lines, three points tied, etc. It'll benefit your planes while you're traveling and unable to attend to them.


    SB

  19. #59
    StewartB
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    Looking at Matt's pictures reminds me of how much I don't miss floats.

    SB

  20. #60
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    current gusts palmer 64 kt = 73.6 mph

    Site M/A Day Time Sky Conditions VIS Weather Temp DP Wind(kt) Alt RH Chill Peak

    PAAQ AP 15 0228 CLR 2 1/2 S- 16 -6 04045G65 939 36% -9 65
    PAAQ AP 15 0235 CLR 3 S- 16 -6 03041G62 938 36% -8 65
    PAAQ AA 15 0253 CLR 4 S- 15 -5 03040G63 940 40% -9
    PAAQ AA 15 0353 CLR 4 S- 15 -5 03041G58 942 40% -9
    PAAQ AA 15 0453 CLR 4 S- 16 -6 04040G59 946 36% -8
    PAAQ AA 15 0553 CLR 5 S- 15 -8 04040G64 950 34% -9

  21. #61
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    A little windy at Lake Hood the last couple days too... Anyone know who is in Space 102?

    METAR PALH 150753Z 36026G46KT 6SM BLSN CLR M09/M19 A2934 RMK AO2 PK WND


    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Lake Hood Winds Dec 2010.jpg 
Views:	95 
Size:	622.9 KB 
ID:	245

  22. #62
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobK View Post
    A little windy at Lake Hood the last couple days too... Anyone know who is in Space 102?

    METAR PALH 150753Z 36026G46KT 6SM BLSN CLR M09/M19 A2934 RMK AO2 PK WND


    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Lake Hood Winds Dec 2010.jpg 
Views:	95 
Size:	622.9 KB 
ID:	245
    forgot to tie down the tie down shack eh?

  23. #63

  24. #64
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    http://pafc.arh.noaa.gov/pubfcst.php?fcst=NOAK48PAFC

    NOAK48 PAFC 160139
    PNSAFC

    PUBLIC INFORMATION STATEMENT
    NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE ANCHORAGE AK
    445 PM AKST WED DEC 15 2010

    ...WIND AND DAMAGE REPORTS FROM THE MATANUSKA VALLEY...

    STRONG WINDS AFFECTED MUCH OF THE MATANUSKA VALLEY LATE YESTERDAY AND
    TODAY. DAMAGE REPORTS RECEIVED SO FAR INCLUDE A SEMI-TRAILER TRUCK
    BLOWN OFF THE ROAD NEAR WASILLA LAKE...SEVERAL SIGNS BLOWN DOWN OR
    TORN OFF BUILDINGS IN WASILLA...AND SCATTERED POWER OUTAGES
    THROUGHOUT THE VALLEY. HIGH WINDS HAVE ALSO BEEN REPORTED TO HAVE
    DAMAGED AREA HOME ROOFS AND BLOWN COVERS OFF AIRPLANES AT THE PALMER
    AIRPORT.

    BELOW ARE THE HIGHEST REPORTED WIND GUSTS FROM THIS EVENT AS OF
    4:30PM TODAY. WITH THE WINDS GRADUALLY SUBSIDING THROUGHOUT THE
    VALLEY TONIGHT...THESE NUMBERS WILL LIKELY STAND AS THE HIGHEST
    RECORDED WINDS FROM THE EVENT.

    LOCATION WIND GUST TIME
    -------------------------- ---------- --------
    BETWEEN WASILLA AND PALMER 87 MPH 6:00AM
    PALMER AIRPORT 81 MPH 10:53AM
    WASILLA (PUBLIC REPORT) 78 MPH 12:35AM
    WASILLA AIRPORT 63 MPH 4:56AM

    KS

  25. #65
    glaciercub's Avatar
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    Was Blowing 80 plus at Palmer and yet 8 miles away My place (AK66) not even a whisp

    Crazy weather, am ready for spring!

    Be Safe Guys.........

  26. #66
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    FEB
    10

    This Day in Alaska History

    1979 A dozen aircraft were destroyed as 80 mph winds blasted through the Palmer Airport and the Mat-Su Valley.

  27. #67

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    Something I know something about, wind turbines that is. The good ones have automatic furling: basically the wind pressure on the tail, which is offset hinged behind the (preferred) 3 blade rotor, turns the rotor out of the wind. Pretty fool proof. These good units cost more, last longer, so cheaper in the long run. The big blows are what people remember, what is more important is the annual average when looking at wind turbine production of electricity. The BEST info out there on them and solar is at wwwhomepower.com

  28. #68
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 16-bravo View Post
    Here is what I found at Palmer Airport today. A sad day for a fellow cubber.







    needed to look this post up tonight, to remind someone why atlee hurricane tie downs are a necessity.... note that the lift strut is still tied down to the ground, but ripped from the wing.... also has killed people in flight, taking off after tie down damage has occurred... alway look up your lift struts and make sure wing to strut brackets are in line with lift strut and not bent....

    http://www.fadodge.com/aircraft-tiedowns/

  29. #69
    TurboBeaver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike mcs repair View Post
    needed to look this post up tonight, to remind someone why atlee hurricane tie downs are a necessity.... note that the lift strut is still tied down to the ground, but ripped from the wing.... also has killed people in flight, taking off after tie down damage has occurred... alway look up your lift struts and make sure wing to strut brackets are in line with lift strut and not bent....

    http://www.fadodge.com/aircraft-tiedowns/
    Good advice Mike! There are still so many guys that have no idea how weak that piece between the wing strut and spar really is . Everyone still thinks if you have strong enough
    ropes your all set.......wrong!
    Remember being up at Atlees shop one time and heard him explaining all of the merits of installing his "hurricane straps". He said the connection between the strut n spar was really a "design flaw" because of the distance between the bolts being to great (long) for the strength of the attachment brackets. He had done testing of factory brackets trying to produce the twisting moment produced when a Cub is subjected to
    50/60 knot winds ( gusts) at less than desired angles to the airplane. What he found was the bracket will always fail from the corner at the first bolt hole into the hole center with a tare, then as the next gust hits it it , it takes even less force to finish the tare from the center out to the other side corner.
    Now the wing has severed from the fuselarge...........exactly as in this photo. By installing a strap over the spar not only have you illuminated this
    "Fuse" or bracket with a known design flaw. Because of the leverages involved by the simply fact you are holding much further outboard because of the position of Atlees straps ( the plane will not dance around as much, when secured 3/4 of
    the way out the spar vs 1/2 way out)
    EVERTHING about the straps is better
    and I have NEVER heard of a wing coming off with Atlees straps if tied correctly. There is no other mod that can protect you in high wind like those straps; with the exception of good spoilers

    Sent from my LM-X210 using SuperCub.Org mobile app
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  30. #70
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurboBeaver View Post
    Remember being up at Atlees shop one time and heard him explaining all of the merits of installing his "hurricane straps". He said the connection between the strut n spar was really a "design flaw" because of the distance between the bolts being to great (long) for the strength of the attachment brackets. He had done testing of factory brackets trying to produce the twisting moment produced when a Cub is subjected to
    50/60 knot winds ( gusts) at less than desired angles to the airplane. What he found was the bracket will always fail from the corner at the first bolt hole into the hole center with a tare, then as the next gust hits it it , it takes even less force to finish the tare from the center out to the other side corner.
    Earle, This needs some discussion. Which direction was Atlee applying the load? Sideways applied at Piper's tie down location as though the plane was tied down pulling on the rope, or in a straight line in the direction of the flight loads?
    If you are talking about the tie down direction, I'll agree. If in the flight load direction, I do not.
    N1PA

  31. #71

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    I was told they fail by getting hammered as gusts load the tie down and then subside,. With any slack in the line the gust lifts the wing to the limit of the rope and it bangs on the fitting. With big squishy tires our ropes are never immune to hammering the tie down attach. Bolt holes wallow out and fittings bend. That's why Atlee makes strut attach reinforcements. Hurricane ties take the strut out of play completely. The hurricane tie bracket goes over the top of the strut so the bolts aren't taking any shock. It's an elegant solution to tying down and far better than using stock rings.

  32. #72
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stewartb View Post
    I was told they fail by getting hammered as gusts load the tie down and then subside,. With any slack in the line the gust lifts the wing to the limit of the rope and it bangs on the fitting.
    Absolutely correct. The fittings are designed for flight loads not tie down side loads.
    N1PA

  33. #73
    TurboBeaver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    Absolutely correct. The fittings are designed for flight loads not tie down side loads.
    Pete,
    He was only refering to side loads from gusts while in a tied position.
    There was a well know wreck to alot
    of us guiding down on the peninsula in the 70's when a big blow came thru,
    Involving a Cub that was a F&G airplane, at their Lava Ck camp.The pilot was aware of the bracket weakness flaw. After the storm passed he visually inspected his closely and found a tare in one backet
    into the first spar hole. The outside was still holding. He made the desicion to try to fly it up to King Salmon........... Which was a poor one.
    Shortly into the flight they encountered some turbulence and the wing came off that side. The cub rolled over and into a small stream inverted. I cant remember his name. If I remember correctly the rear seat passenger got out and was able to get
    him out before he drowned.........
    I bought an 0290D2 engine from Don Johnson that came off his Cub down
    in a big blow that was tied with new 1/2" nylon ropes correctly. The ropes
    held but the brackets tore out. The guides told that after the wing came off, what is left just beat itself into pieces. There many dozens of cases
    of bracket failures recorded in Alaska.
    Atlee also told me if I ever got caught
    in a bad blow to simply chop a hole down thru your leading edge so you can tie rope right around the spars outboard of the struts........ I know this works as I had to do it one time down on the peninsula and saved my Cub. 4 miles away a friend lost his same nite!
    Yep. Bracket failure. Neither of us had
    a lick of insurance.
    Before the "Hurricane Straps". Atlee offered his "lift strut reinforcement" for the Piper U Channel bracket. Part# 3192. And I know there are hundreds of Cubs that simply installed those years ago and I cant say, I have EVER
    heard of a bracket failure, with his 3192 reinforcement either?????
    He certainly knew his stuff

    Sent from my LM-X210 using SuperCub.Org mobile app
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