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Thread: Where can I find a hand pump for Hyd. skis?

  1. #1

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    Where can I find a hand pump for Hyd. skis?

    Looking for a hand pump for my Fli-lite 3000 skis, I have the one with the round reservior on the pump, but I am looking for something a little smaller. I looked on barnstormers, but no luck.

    Thanks in advance!!

  2. #2
    StewartB
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    Lance,

    What do you mean by "the one with the round reservoir on the pump"? My Fluidynes and FliLites use the identical pump and both have the remote reservoir mounted on the firewall. A friend has a Fluidyne pump with a reservoir built-on but it looked to me like he could remove it if he wanted. Do you have a picture of yours? Just curious.

    Stewart

  3. #3

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    I will give posting a pic a try!!


  4. #4

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    the other side




    I think I can make it work ok by mounting on the floor on the passengers side. I can reach it ok there, and it seems like it will be easy to pump for the pilot or the passenger. Getting in and out of the pass side isn't much more difficult than usual.

    I just thought it might be easier if I found the right one, the one with the reservior on the firewall. I plan on taking the pump out in the spring, so we won't be working around it in the off season.

  5. #5
    StewartB
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    Thanks for the pic. I've never seen one like it before.

    Stewart

  6. #6
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    [quote="lancef53"]the other side




    This pump is the hydraulic power pack, for the gear and flaps, from a Republic Seabee. It is also the same pump which EDO used for their 339JHS amphib floats for a PA-18.
    N1PA

  7. #7

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    Thanks for the info--where would you put this thing in a Cub? It is pretty big.

  8. #8
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lancef53
    Thanks for the info--where would you put this thing in a Cub? It is pretty big.
    EDO installed it on the floor in the center directly forward of the stick between your feet. The one in your picture has had one of the selector handles removed. EDO had set it up so that you could control the gear in each float separately. You could do the same for skis. Perhaps you could raise one ski to help making tighter turns?
    N1PA
    Thanks Beaverpilot thanked for this post

  9. #9
    StewartB
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    Lance,

    My Cessna's pump is on the floor, tucked against the tunnel on the passenger side. I never removed it until I changed my interior and during all those summers nobody ever complained. I did remove the handle. Your pump probably doesn't take up much, if any, more space than my Fluidyne pump by the time it has the shroud on it. Your hydraulic lines look like you'd need to stay away from the tunnel, though. Maybe you could build a pedestal that would lift the pump a bit and allow you to overlap the tunnel a little?

    Stewart

  10. #10

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    Yes, that was my original thought, to raise it up by the tunnel. The problem with that is the fact that I have an Avion panel, and it seems like it is a little lower than a normal panel. If I have the pump lifted up to set it on the tunnel, the handle interferes with the bottom of the panel. I want to use the setup before I think about shortening the handle to closer the the length of the regular pump. I will check out a couple of options this afternoon and maybe post a couple of picks to get some feedback.

    I gotta run now, time for the kid's church christmas program!!

  11. #11
    StewartB
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    You might be able to bend the handle to conform to your space.



    Stewart

  12. #12
    Cubus Maximus's Avatar
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    another PA-12 hydraulic pump installation:












  13. #13

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    I mean no disrespect to anybodys equipment here but it just floors me with the junk we all have to work with in aviation it is 2009 nearly 2010. I can think of many other ways that are much cleaner simpler lighter to move those skis up and down, BUt i guess it would not be certified what a joke our so called government agency is that is suppose to be helping us promote aviation.

  14. #14

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    Here is where I was thinking of placing the pump, it seems to be out of the way of the passenger.



    Sorry it is sideways, I rotated it once, and I couldn't get it to post. When I tried again, it had distorted the picture and made it look real wide.

  15. #15
    N5126H's Avatar
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    Looking at those pictures tells me you folks need to get with the modern age. My pump in the cub mounted under the panel with the selector on the side panel and the reservoir on the fire wall. My 185 has the pump and selector mounted inside the center console nest to the flap handle and the reservoir on the firewall. Both handles remove for summer use and you cannot even tell there is a pump there. Whip has a very nice little pump half the size of the one pictured here in the cub. Stainless line is much better looking than copper tubing as well.

  16. #16
    StewartB
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    I have the exact same pump in both airplanes, although they are plumbed differently for their respective applications. I've found them to be marvels of efficiency and durability. They're small, relatively light, simple, and they keep on working year after year. I've got no gripes and no motivation to change them. I considered the Cessna pump in the tunnel. It wasn't worth the effort for me. I demanded the 12 pump on the side wall. That was definitely worth it. I like stuff that works.

    Lance, If that pump has similar volume as a Fluidyne pump you should expect about 25 strokes to change your ski configuration. Is that location comfortable for you? Despite the comments, the purpose of hydraulic skis is to permit you to fly with wonderful versatility. You don't get style points for having the coolest pump. As long as it works and you like it, it's cool enough! I'd still be looking to rotate the pump 180* and mount it partially straddling the tunnel as far forward as it'll go. But that's just me.

    SB

  17. #17
    mvivion's Avatar
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    Lance,

    If you mount that pump there, are you going to be able to manipulate the pump adequately with a passenger in the right seat?

    I think I'd look for one of the small pumps as pictured in earlier posts. That's what I have in my 170, and it lives in the plane all year. Just remove the handle. Much neater.

    Of course, that would bring the discussion back to your original question: Where to find a pump?

    MTV

  18. #18
    irishfield's Avatar
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    Clamar has a nice little pump.. that is pump and selector in one. Used as back up for amphibs.. with plenty of strokes, but would cycle skis no problem. I would post a picture of the one I installed under an Elite panel.. but my FTP link is down to my website so I can't upload.



    http://www.clamarfloats.com/forsale.htm

    EDIT.. forgot I can upload in the gallery here...




  19. #19

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    5126H, I am looking for something different, that is why I posted.
    Maybe a little info on your pump would be helpful. By whip do you mean Wipaire? Do you have a model number, or maybe some pictures?

    Irishfield, thanks for the link--that looks like it would work, but I think I would rather have one like Stewartb has, if I could locate one.

    Stewart, Do you mean that you would have the handle facing the rear? It seems like it would be a little akward to pump that way.

    Mvivion-yes, it seems like it would work fine, without a passenger it is fine, with a passenger, they will have a job

  20. #20
    irishfield's Avatar
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    Stewards is just a, or similar to, Parker (Republic) 914 pump. Readily available thru any hydraulics dealer.. and then you need to add the 4 way valve. Clamar's has basically the same volume/stroke and is a combo pump/valve. I think it's parker too.. will see if I can grab a number off the one I showed above.. it's stored in the hangar for the winter.

    Here's the parker like Stewart's..

    http://www.parker.com/portal/site/PA...914-8D27&Wtky=

    Click the view technical service link... shows the details on the pump.. pumps in both directions of the handle.. in and out.

  21. #21
    StewartB
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    Great info, Wayne. My pump is a bone stock Fluidyne pump less the standard shroud. If I need parts I'll head to the Parker store. That Clamar pump looks good, too. I'd bet a guy could get it field approved.

    Stewart

  22. #22
    irishfield's Avatar
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    Also look at the Parker/Republic 910 series... has about 50% more volume per cycle and it's handle and fitting layout might allow a better plumbing layout for between the seats in the Cessna.

    http://www.parker.com/portal/site/PA...%20HAND%20PUMP

  23. #23
    mvivion's Avatar
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    GREAT source of stuff!! Thanks.

    THat 914 pump is basically the one I have in my 170 mounted on the tunnel between the seats aft of the fuel selector. Works good, compact, and not in the way. Remove the handle for summer.

    MTV

  24. #24

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    So how exactly does the valve work with those pumps? Anybody have a diagram or a good picture?

    Thanks for all the info!!

    I just saw one of those Clamar pumps today on a PA-12 with amphibs--pretty slick setup. I guess it takes about 50 pumpos to do its thing, how does that compare to skis?

  25. #25
    irishfield's Avatar
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    Probably 1/2 the pumps for skis... as 1/2 the cylinders of similar size!

    4 way valve and the one I use has center off (can't find the part # right now). Ports.. Pressure in = P/A/B/T.. inlet pressure from pump.. cyl in.. cyl out (talking direction).. tank. When you select A.. pressure goes to A.. fluid coming out the other side of cylinder has to be able to go thru B and out to Tank.. Ie non pressure side of cylinder has to be able to drain or cylinder can't move... same thing in the other direction.. Pressure into B.. A drains to tank.. or as many do and just tee it back into the reservoir feed line going to the pump inlet.

  26. #26
    StewartB
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    deleted

  27. #27

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    I'll post a picture of the backup pump for my Baumann floats on a C172. Neat little unit, looks similar to the clamar unit pictured above. Don

  28. #28
    StewartB
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    The data tag is marked "Teledyne Republic". There are no markings on the valve except 1,2,3, and 4 on the outlets. The selector has three detents. Forward for skis, center is off which blocks hydraulic fluid movement, and aft is wheels. The handle attach faces aft in my plane. I suspect this is how the pump was originally configured for a Cessna floor mount because the original shroud fits it like a glove. The aluminum angles are not original.

    SB

  29. #29

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    Hey Stewart,

    How did you mount the pump to the sidewall of the 12? As I recall the floorboards where the pump is designed to go (as shown in CubusMaximus's post) took an awful lot of stress from the back and forth pumping. And the pumping wasn't at all easy. Are you sure that your setup isn't crushing the tubes in front of the door post?

    And by the way, why didn't you install the pump on the floor? I can't imagine from the pictures that where you placed it is any more convenient than on the floor.

    Just wondering.

  30. #30
    StewartB
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    Fair questions. I wanted the pump off the floor because after 7 surgeries on my right knee I'm left with limited mobility in that leg. Some days are more limited than others. The pump would have presented one more obstacle for me when entering and exiting the plane, and frankly I have enough difficulty lifting my foot up and out now. After looking at a friend's Supercub with the pump mounted in about the same place I thought it would be a good choice in my plane. The installing mechanic fabricated tubing clamps using a larger tube than the ones we'd be clamping to. The clamp ID was essentially the same as the mounting tube's OD. He tigged some flanges onto the clamps and the stars aligned. The installation is very solid. I have no worries about the pump effort translating into stress on the airframe. In fact I was pleasantly surprised at the ease of pumping relative to what I was used to with Fluidynes on the Cessna.

    I assumed the pics Brad posted were of your plane. Are they?

    Stewart

  31. #31

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    Yes, I built 88M and sold it to a gentleman in Minnesota years ago. It is very nice still and I think it may be available, although unlisted.

    I am building another one, but lighter this time.

  32. #32

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    Thanks for all the great info, guys--this site rocks!!!

  33. #33

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    Here is the pump in my C172 amphib (Baumann 2550A's)' If you look at the larger photo in my gallery, you might find the parker part number.




  34. #34
    aktango58's Avatar
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    Resurection:

    I am getting the idea to start cutting my holes for brake line fittings on the fuselage. I have a little plat installed above the longeron in which I will attach a 45 elbow to, then I can simply attach and detach the brake line with the gear and not have that piece sticking out with floats...

    I have room to also put in hydraulic fittings for skis or amphibs, so want to confirm the size and number... looks like I need two per side, and is it 1/4" or 3/8" tube that is used?

    Thanks
    I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!

  35. #35
    bearsnack
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    I do believe it is 1/4 inch line, one for retract and one to deploy the ski on each side. There is some great photos of the "T" fittings on this website. Thats -4 size.

  36. #36
    SuperCub MD's Avatar
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    If you get the pump in Stewards photos, Edo makes a bracket that will install it down inside the tunnel. Kenmore probably has the parts and drawings.

    Airglas makes a elect/hydro pump for $1200, Wipes would work too but big $$$.

  37. #37
    www.SkupTech.com mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aktango58 View Post
    Resurection:

    .... I have a little plat installed above the longeron in which I will attach a 45 elbow to,......
    I have room to also put in hydraulic fittings for skis or amphibs,....

    Thanks
    pay attention to rudder pedals/hyd line routing on inside if you think of adding all them there.....

  38. #38

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    I have mine mounted on the side in front of the door like in the photo on the attached thread. Mounting on the floor usually involves some interference with brake/rudder cables or with operation of right rudder from the rear seat. This would involve welding on a mounting plate so depending on IA it may be a simple thing or not worth the hassle. Expect to put some kind of bend or angle in the handle.
    DENNY

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