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Thread: O320 Narrow Deck on PA-12

  1. #1

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    O320 Narrow Deck on PA-12

    OK, I'm looking at this PA-12 with a mid-time narrow deck O320 150HP. What are the drawbacks for this engine? Can I upgrade it to 160HP, and how complicated is that? How much can I plan on spending on trading it in for a wide deck B2B 160HP?

    Thanks in advance for your input.

    Randy

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    From what I've been told, the wide deck is more desirable because the 160 upgrade is less expensive than the narrow deck. Narrow decks can still be converted. Not quite sure what it's going to cost though.

    My engine started out as a narrow deck but was converted to a wide deck 150, but honestly I like the 150, good power and good fuel burn. If I were going to upgrade, I'd go all the way to 180 just cause I'm not sure that 10 extra horses is worth it to me. I'm young and greedy.

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    My fatherinlaw has a narrow deck 160 on his Pacer, he likes it because it weighs less than the wide deck. But his also came with it like that.

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    fatcub's Avatar
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    PA-12 Fat Cub

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    Darrel Starr's Avatar
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    I have an early 0-320 (no suffix #) that we converted to 160 hp when we majored it 6 yrs ago. Converting the case involved installing longer cross studs ($150 x ? 8?) and align boring the case for thicker shell bearings (later cases possibly wouldn't need this machining). The total bill was, as I recall, about $2000. You could probably trade for a wide deck case for similar money. You also will need "banana" plates for the base of the cylinders. Also, the engine builder told me that the 160hp cylinders had a different part number than the 150hp ones. I bought new 160hp cylinders from Superior so I didn't get into that but I remember the builder was not enthusiastic about reusing the cylinders for some reason.
    I called Lycoming before spending the money on the engine. The tech rep told me that the design had changed to the wide deck in order to make it easier to service the cylinder base nuts -- no other reason, nothing really wrong with the design.
    I doubt the cases are significantly different in weight.
    To change the serial #, stamp a "C" as stated on a Lycoming service bulletin. Both 150 and 160hp versions are covered under the same FAA Engine Specification so converting from one to another is a minor change not requiring a Form 337, just a log book entry.
    Darrel

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    RedBaron's Avatar
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    So did ya get the -12 Randy?

    RB

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    aktango58's Avatar
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    30 pounds I am told.

    got the 150 narrow deck with all but a carb to make it a 160 (came this way)

    The deal is, when you want to trade it in for a reman, they will not take a narrow deck.


    I like the engine. Works great. Fly it! then fly it more. I am in and out with a 180 cub, and worked along side the 160 cub. Just fly it.
    I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!

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    this would be a title NimpoCub's Avatar
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    Re: O320 Narrow Deck on PA-12

    Quote Originally Posted by Randyk
    OK, I'm looking at this PA-12 with a mid-time narrow deck O320 150HP. What are the drawbacks for this engine? Can I upgrade it to 160HP, and how complicated is that? How much can I plan on spending on trading it in for a wide deck B2B 160HP?
    No drawbacks at all. Very good engine. Keep flying it.
    Yes you can upgrade a narrow deck but for about the same coin you can get a wide deck. No diff in the wide deck except the cylinder bases are thicker & use a different bolt system. Weight is the same. If you go to a 180hp there is the weight penalty of the heavier engine, AND bigger prop.

    My recent experience (with a famous builder in Kraploops BC) is $15K plus my good running narrow deck. Been told I'll get 170+hp burning premium mogas (after the break in). Your price will vary of course, depending on what you want done (& the goodie list).
    This guy is an engine guru, knows all the answers as he's done something like 1500 engines. Name's Bart, # is 1 800 264 6019

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    I take it that banana plates are not required on O 320 A 150 hp.?Or am I just missing the plates?

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    I went through this in 2011? PA12 with runout narrow deck. Sent it to LyCon and they sent me an overhauled widedeck 160 with all the bells and whistles. If I recall it cost me about $1500-2000 more than if I just got the narrow deck overhauled locally as a standard narrow deck 150. The comparison with the tired old 150 to the hot-rodded 160 was awesome, although you get used to the extra power real quick. Fuel burn difference was negligible. I went through Dan's Aircraft in Anchorage. It wasn't a big deal and shipping was in the neighborhood of $300 round trip. I would do it again.

  11. #11
    Gordon Misch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by don d View Post
    I take it that banana plates are not required on O 320 A 150 hp.?Or am I just missing the plates?
    I have an O320 something, narrow deck, 150 HP. No banana plates, and I'm certain that it's proper because it was Factory Overhaul.
    Gordon

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    The narrow deck 150 and 160 hp cylinders are slightly different. The Lycoming 160 hp cylinders have one less cooling fin at the bottom of the cylinders and the barrels are stronger for the 8.5-1 compression pistons. The cylinder base flange is flat for the banana plates. The difference in the case -27 and -39 is primarily in the cylinder base studs. The 160 hp cylinder base studs are about 1/8" longer. I just finished an O320 A2B conversion to the O320 B2B. 505B AD on the crank, traded the -27 case for a -39 case. Lycon did the "O" ring groove on the case and supplied the engine bearings to use the A2B crank. I had millennium 150 hp cylinders with 258 hours. Had to do some machine work on the banana plates to fit the cylinder base flange. Lycon did the porting. Went with the 2 piece cam....with bit of an advance. LEES exhaust and dual impulse mags.... Should go good.....


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

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    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    150 hp narrow deck doesn't use the plates, only the higher compression 160 hp. You can refer to the parts manual for verification.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

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    I don't know Steve Pierce other than these forums. He sure is willing to share his wealth of information. Wish I knew him in person. Maybe some day. Thank you Steve!!

    Don Dressen
    Fruitland, Idaho

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    Eddie Foy's Avatar
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    Pierce is a crotchety old fart from Tennessee. Tends to fall down in the rocks and owie himself. His call sign is Cabra. Short for mountain goat.

    "Put out my hand and touched the face of God!"

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    Eddie Foy's Avatar
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    On a serious note. Steve has forgotten more about rag wing Pipers than I will ever know!
    "Put out my hand and touched the face of God!"

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