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J-3 wing fuel tank options?

CubLite

CubLite

Registered User
BUCYRUS, KANSAS
Are PA-18 18 gallons tanks legal to put in? What paperwork is needed? What are other options other than new Wag-Aero 11 and half gallons tanks that don't allow for the removal of the main fuselage tank? Does anyone out there have used tanks that they want to sell that would work? I'm torn between keeping it real light and getting at least a little more range out of it.

Pat
 
I have a WAG aero wing tank in my J-3 and it holds 12 gallons. It works great except for the times I forget to turn it off and over fill the 12 gallon main tank. You notice it when the fuel smell gets real strong and gasoline starts running up the windshield. ...Clyde Davis
 
Atlee Dodge sells an STC that allows the installation of the PA-18 fuel system into a j-3. Here is a list of some of Atlee's J-3 STC's.

SA 455 AL PA-18 Fuel System Installation
SA 456 AL PA-18 Wing Lift Strut Installation
SA 457 AL J-3 to PA 11 Forward Tubing Structure
SA 458 AL PA-18 Trim System Installation
SA 459 AL PA-18 Baggage
SA 460 AL PA-18 Pitot Static System
SA 461 AL PA-18 Landing Gear Cabane Installation
SA 462 AL PA-18 Front Seat Installation
SA 463 AL PA-18 Elevator Control System
SA 464 AL PA-18 Rear Seat Installation
SA 465 AC PA-18 90hp Boot Cowl, Windshield & Skylight Installation
 
I use the 11 gal Witte tank. I have been happy. Might be cheaper to get a PA 11 or a 90 HP Super Cub, if you are thinking of changing a lot of stuff. A good stock J3 is beginning to be worth something.
 
I had a stock J3 and Steve (the other Bijou Boy) had a PA11. I had the 12gal fuselage tank and his PA11 had two 18gal wing tanks. He became my flying fuel supply to get us between the long fuel stops so I know what you are looking for in extending your range.

When I recovered my J3 I put in Clarence Witte's 12 gal wing tanks. I wasn't interested in keeping it stock. I also extended the baggage compartment so I could carry bulky camping gear.

Depending on what you want to do with your J3 you should consider Bob's point about selling your stock J3 and getting a PA11. I think an 11 is about the nicest flying Cub that Piper made.
 
i am curious why can't you put two wag tanks and headers in and remove the main tank? i would like to do this because i don't want 18s and i want to get rid of the nose tank.
 
My -11 didn't fly nearly as well as my -3.

Why not install the wingtanks and leave the nosetank installed as well?
 
Pat, my dad has a NOS PA11 left wing tank you might to able to talk him out of. If you do put in wing tanks you will have to weld in the X under the panel and get a header tank and clamps.
 
If you are legally minded (and I'm sure we all are :wink: ), the issue at hand is useful load. The J3, with a max allowable gross weight (on wheels) of 1220lbs just does not have much useful load. I challenge any of you to put two "American size" adults in a J3 and be able to legally put more than one hour of fuel in.

Everyone that brings up the subject of more fuel says it is for more range. I think this gives the is-impression that they want to sit in a J3 NON-STOP for more than two hours. I think they really mean they want to be able to go airport hopping for the day without having to buy fuel away from home base.

John Scott
 
Is there a tank that can be approved for a wood spar J3? If and when I get the '41 J3 back in the air, it would be nice to have a reserve when going to local fly-ins more than 2 hrs away. Trouble is, my 65hp '41 has only 1100 lbs. gross limit unless I upgrade that on rebuild.
 
You guys all are making good points that I have considered. Thanks Charlie for posting STC list. Don't want to change anything but the fuel capacity, just like a good 2.5 hours with solid half hour reserve. Don't think 12 gallons quite gets me there w/ the C-90. Had one 18 gallon tank in the ole dog with the C-85 and was only a problem being short on gas a time or two in 15 years and 1600 hours of flying it. Steve Pierce is right-try finding a PA-11. Any other comments would be appreciated. Thanks.

Pat
 
Pat,Pat,Pat.....you should've just baught a Supercub and not worried 'bout all this non-sense !!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Couldn't resist !! :wink:
 
Steve,
Is it practical to install a J-3 engine mount on my 1947 PA-11 to get the thrust-line to match the airplane? Would the gains be worth it? (C-85-12) ...Clyde Davis
 
the back of the engine sticks up too high above the boot cowl for a straight swap, because the engine is mounted higher with the J-3 mount. be better to modify the engine mount for TL change.
 
John Scott,
You are right on...Here is a quick story on extra fuel..I sold my Super Cub..and purchased one of the nicest J-3's Cubs in the country...
with a 12 gallon wing tank, C-85-12 and Radio..My dear other half and I went to Georgia to pick it up..I am 6'2" 240 and she is 5'6" and about 140.
We litterally carried one small gym bag..It fit in the small canvas area behind us..
Well..We stopped to see Ruidoso Ron in Ruidoso NM...Wrong deal..I dumped the baggage before I tried to takeoff...The gym bag and the lady..
Well taking off out of Ruiodoso in a J-3 with 14 gallons of fuel and just me on board was very interesting..needless to say the airplane sure was confused..It was about 8:30AM and maybe 85 or so...And the airplane should have been dismantled and hauled out of there..
But when I met up with Ron and my gal in Alamagordo NM..Things were looking up...Well sort of..Filled the airplane " Both tanks " loaded the bags..Lady included and off we went...Ron was gone..we taxied into position and started our roll out...We used up 60% of the runway and got our first bounce..then 85% and bounce 2 and at 100% bounce 3 and 3 inches of the ground..It was about 95 out 11:00AM or so and after 30 mintes of flying toward White Sands was able to skid the airplane towards Hwy 53 to keep her out of the hot zones of White Sands NM..Following to corridor of the hiway towards western edge of El Paso...
We flew for over an hour before we saw 50 AGL!!!!!!!!!
Not good..But we kept going and going and onto Demming NM...Demming was different they had houses and a water tower on the end of the runway...We learned our lessons well and I just filled the nose tank..It was better getting off the ground but it sure was interesting reading
" Demming " on the water tank looking up at it...Anyway the moral of the story...Dnt do things to a Cub that she just ain't designed to handle..
Their is always a price..And I can assure you if I had not been flying 38 plus years with a ton of hours I would have eaten it big time..As it took eery bit of flying experience I had to keep the airplane flying..Well that was in June and the airplane was sold in September!
No more J-3's for me!
Oh yea remind me to tell you how many pillows Gastons gave me when I left for cushions and then I loaded up with one of those nice memory foam pillows when I left Steve's out of Graham....I came home with enough pillows in the back to outfit a small hotel....and still could not walk for a week!
I guess the romance of a Cub was when I was 15 1/2 traded a Model A for one and flew the hell out of it as a 6'2" 165lb kid who was flying at sea level....Now when people tell me I am not 16 any longer I listen...And flying J-3's well for me best left as a memory!!!!!!!!



Sam

8)
 
I've got an 18 gallon Super Cub tank in the left wing of my J3, it feeds the 12 gal nose tank. I like it for the reasons listed above. I'm on floats and like to be able to fly around and fish all day without worrying about finding fuel at a fish camp or marina.

Down here, Florida, it's hot most of the year, in the 80's this week. I've got a C85 with the 0-200 conversion for power, good bit of difference. I've flown with both tanks full and fishing gear loaded (expanded baggage and fish pole tube) without any problems. Add another guy and it gets sluggish, but will do it. I'm 6' and 190. I'm comfortable in the rear seat, and OK in the front when I've got a passenger.

The 18 gallon tank is a good way to go. Don't use it when you don't need it and only put in what you need for the day. It probably doesn't way much more than a 12 gallon tank once their both installed.

Gregg
 
My experiences in the desert do not include 240 lb pilots, but I have had success at Flagstaff, Mountainair NM, Vaughn, NM, and of course Deming, which is only a mile above sea level. In Flag, at 100 degrees and a C-65, I got my altitude by flying south. The Cub is as good as they get on hot, high days, but overloaded aircraft of any type will perform slightly differently at 7000 feet and 95 degrees. That's why the runways up there are two miles long.

Lemme see - a good J-3 weighs about 730# ( unless you are one of those guys who likes to weigh them) and that leaves some 530 or so # for passengers and fuel. Surely 130# of fuel is enough for a reasonable cross-country.

Removing the forward tank in a J-3 is probably one of those things where the cost outweighs the benefits. The wings must be modified, since the PA11 control cables are higher. You won't get any more leg room, since the tank is not the limiting factor; it is the way the forward spars mount.

There really are PA11s out there, and they are not much more than a good J-3. Actually, a good PA18 with a 90-105 HP engine is still under fifty, and there are a few of those left. A buddy just got a 150 HP for fifty, and it had good engine and fabric (no radios, though). Keep the J3 stock, and go get a good Decathlon if you want more interior room and speed. That's what I did.
 
Hi Sam... I just don't understand why you had so much trouble with that Cub. I have a 1939 J-3 with a 12 gallon wing tank. Susan and I are not exactly light weights and we've flown that route with little difficulty. We did take advantage of thermals and mountain waves to get traveling altitude but it worked. Our biggest problem with the J-3 Cub is having our R.O.N. stuff with us. We have been sending baggage ahead by UPS. We have that problem solved now. We just bought a beautiful PA-11 that has been restored from end to end. It looks just as nice as the Cub that you had. I think it is a bit lighter though. Anyway this summer Susan and I will go to the fly-ins with both Cubs and all of our stuff. Our solution to the problem is two Cubs. ...Clyde Davis
:p :angel:
 
My foster brother did a zero thrustline mod on our PA-11 back in 1969. It was worth doing, as was the O-200 installation. To this day though, I'd rather fly an O-200 powered J-3. On the -3, we use a removable 10 gallon belly tank when we want more fuel (rarely).
 
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