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What price for 1975 PA-18?

M

Mark McClellen

Registered User
McCall, Idaho
I've got a Smith/ Turbine Cubs of Wyoming kit on order but have come across a 1975 PA-18 that I'm interested in purchasing. It has 1420 hrs airframe and engine, original fabric in good condition, 3'' extended gear, 31" Alaskan Bush tires and tail wheel, Micro vg's, Borer prop and single Icom com radio. It has complete logs, no damage history and has lived inland (Montana and Idaho) for it's whole life. One jug was replaced last annual and engine checked good otherwise with no corrosion. The aircraft appears clean and well kept. Could some of you nice folks please advise me as to what a fair market value might be? Thanks,

Mark McClellen
 
Mark

Just my opinion so please consider it as just that. The engine is 20 years old. Chances are the cam is pitted and it is likely that it will not go to 2000 hrs. You are taking a gamble there.
The fabric is 21 years old and if it has been inside most of its life is probably in fairly good shape. The problem is that in 5 years when your Smith Cub is done and you are ready to sell this Cub the fabric will be 26 years old and it will probably need to be recovered. So potential buyers may look at it as a flying project and will not want to pay top dollar. This might not be a bad deal if you were, or are, planning to keep it and do the engine soon then the fabric in a few years and just keep it up over the years, but if you think you may want to sell in a few years then ask yourself if you would want to buy that airplane in 5 years and what it would be worth at that time.
I would also guess the owner wants 70 to 80K (or more) and I am not sure if it would be really worth it. It has had very little money put in it for 20 years. The next owner is going to have to pump some money there. The all original Supercubs from the late 70's look good at first glance but do require a careful look at the likely investment required in the near future.

Just something to think about.

Bill
 
Engine and fabric are 31 years old. I would plan on new fabric and paint and engine overhaul within the near future, nothing that 40,000 bucks won't fix. If it has been hangered its whole life and you buy at a good price, you may be able to fly it for 5 to 10 years and sell it without taking to big of a hit. I would get a thorough inspection done by some who knows what to look for. Corrosion in the engine and airframe can be very costly to repair and hard to detect from a "tire kicker" inspection.
It is always hard to put a value on something sight unseen, but at the risk of opening myself up for criticism, I would peg it at 50,000 to 62,000.
50,000 is a lot if you will have to put 40,000 into new motor and fab/paint.
If you look around you can find low time (300 to 500) with recent rebuild for 75,000 to 80,000, which should serve you well for the next 20 years.
Thats just my .02 :D
Rock
 
Sgt. Rock said:
Engine and fabric are 31 years old. I would plan on new fabric and paint and engine overhaul within the near future, nothing that 40,000 bucks won't fix. If it has been hangered its whole life and you buy at a good price, you may be able to fly it for 5 to 10 years and sell it without taking to big of a hit. I would get a thorough inspection done by some who knows what to look for. Corrosion in the engine and airframe can be very costly to repair and hard to detect from a "tire kicker" inspection.
It is always hard to put a value on something sight unseen, but at the risk of opening myself up for criticism, I would peg it at 50,000 to 62,000.
50,000 is a lot if you will have to put 40,000 into new motor and fab/paint.
If you look around you can find low time (300 to 500) with recent rebuild for 75,000 to 80,000, which should serve you well for the next 20 years.
Thats just my .02 :D
Rock
Click to expand...

Sounds like a another overpriced project. It would be interesting to see how much $$ this would fetch on ebay. I would not bid over 35K.... Plenty of $80K+ rebuilds sitting around for sale.
 
PA-18 pricing

Thanks for the imput guys. The aircraft in question has been maintained by the same mechanic that does my 185 and I trust his meticulous work and attitude. Never the less, I agree that with the age of the fabric and engine there is the potential for some big expense in the forseeable future. Somewhere around 50K seemed about right to me but even that my be too high. Thanks again.

MarkMcClellen
 
Mark, Before I jumped on the "cam is rusty" bandwagon I would look at the logs close. If the time on is is spread out and it never sat for several years in a row I think it would have a good chance of making TBO and beyond. I can't think of a much better climate for one to live in and survive than around here. As far as the fabric If it looks good, has no brittle spots on the bottom trailing edge of the controls or the back of the wings AND the mice have been kept out I would not worry about it at all. Go along the bottom of the wings, tap on the fabric and listen for mouse turds bouncing around. Mouse smell is also a giveaway.
Dave
 
Bill Rusk said:
Mark

. The engine is 20 years old
The fabric is 21 years old


Bill
Click to expand...

You're showing your age Bill. Believe it or not, 1975 was more than 20 yrs ago, although it seem like 10. 8)
 
Yea, I figured somebody was going to catch that one. Took longer than I expected. :D .

Never do math in public

Bill :oops:
 
Re: PA-18 pricing

Mark McClellen said:
Thanks for the imput guys. The aircraft in question has been maintained by the same mechanic that does my 185 and I trust his meticulous work and attitude. Never the less, I agree that with the age of the fabric and engine there is the potential for some big expense in the forseeable future. Somewhere around 50K seemed about right to me but even that my be too high. Thanks again.

MarkMcClellen
Click to expand...

Mark,

If any of the guys that commented owned a 1975 Supercub with 1400TT, original engine, and original fabric, they'd be telling you it's worth a lot more than $50K. And with what you've said about it, it probably is.

I don't care what the log times are on an airplane. There is ALWAYS a potential for big expense. A fresh cover and pretty paint do not an airplane make. Some people are really good at putting lipstick on a pig. If the subject plane still has the original cover, you should have a pretty good idea that it hasn't been cobbled together over the years. That's worth something.

Stewart
 
I flew my previous Clipper 1500 hours and had lots of fun on a set of wings that were covered in the late 70s that had a cracking finish and an engine that went to 2600 hrs. since 1949 and did not have a bad cam when torn down. That was a great airplane until it met an unfortunate demise.

58sunnfuncrash0402b.jpg
 
Hey Steve, Was that the same engine that would have been on when I flew 5293H in the early 70's. If so then it sat outside in southern Virginia for awhile before my Dad sold it. We didn't fly it much either.
Marty
 
Just for reference.. Lansing Community College here in MI just sold a 1954 L21B they've had since it's return from the Italian Air Force in about 1980. The school did a ground up in '82 with Razorback. The motor (O290-D2)was done, also by the students with instructor supervision. Total of about 300hrs since '82. The only upgrade was lifetime struts and forks a few months ago. Seemed like a solid airplane but cosmetically maybe a 6 at best. Went on sealed bid for $36,600.
The school got two of these back in '80. The other one is fully assembled sans the cover sitting in their classroom. Awesome reference tool for a builder or rebuilder.
 
When I left to go look at it I figured it had to be worth $40K, at least. When they opened the hanger door my opinion dropped to about $30K
I convinced myself it was worth $35.5 and that's what I bid. It looked good on paper but it has no appeal in person. I'm not at all disappointed I didn't get it. Especially based on the fact that you could not have brought it to the standard of the L21B I just sold for less that $20K.
Probably a good airplane but not something one could be very proud of without alot of tlc and cash.
 
It would be a great price for a 150 and a good price for a 135, which is what it is. Probably why 35 didn't buy it..
 
1975 SuperCub Price

The aircraft in question is a 150Hp model and the seller passed on my offer of 50K. He's gone now for a month so I imagine we'll resume discussions when he returns. Not sure if I want to go too much higher.
Thanks again to all who have responded with price/value opinions.

Mark McClellen
 
Kind of a different topic: How many of you have encountered that strategic phone call when you were negotiating for a purchase? I first encountered it when Linda and I were looking at a Beemer Coupe. The guy wanted too much for it, and we were getting ready to bid him a polite goodbye, when his phone rang, and he told the thing on the other end how they had better make him an offer, since he had a prospective purchaser in mind (meaning us, I guess). We forgot about polite, and left him talking to whatever it was that called. I was not there, but the same thing happened to some friends when buying a Cub - even if it was a real call, the proper thing to do is to say "I'm sorry - I'm busy right now. Can you call back?"

This is the kind of thing that, for me, will kill even a good deal.
 
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