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guide arrested for buzzing

ground loop

Registered User
Anchorage
In todays Anchorage Daily in the Alaska Digest section there was a short blurb about a guide in Dillingham who got arrested for buzzing hunters in a small aircraftand flipping the bird, among other crimes. It might be of some general interest if someone who knows how to do those kind of things posted the link.
 
DILLINGHAM

Hunting guide faces several charges

A registered hunting guide was accused Tuesday of using his plane to threaten other hunters and pilots near Dillingham.

Edward Byron Lamb, 37, was arrested and charged in his hometown of Dillingham on Tuesday after an investigation found he had allegedly used his plane to dive-bomb several hunting camps in September during moose-hunting season.

Charges included 10 counts of third-degree assault, two counts of reckless endangerment, four counts of hindering lawful hunting, two counts of failure to salvage meat and one count of failure to remove meat from bone, according to court papers.

Witnesses told investigators a small plane said to be Lamb's buzzed their camp, sometimes within 20 feet, with the pilot angrily "flipping them off" and swearing at them, the court papers say.

Lamb allegedly told investigators that other hunters had been hunting "in areas he normally hunts with clients," according to the document.

Lamb is scheduled to appear this morning in Dillingham Court.
 
Tensions can run kinda high around that time of year. I had a run-in with a couple of morons last year.
The old "Homestead Gentleman" are fast disappearing.


xx
 
Alex,

These kinds of folks been around Alaska for thirty years that I know of.

More these days, but it only takes one to ruin your day.

MTV
 
Having been here since the late 50s, (except while off with Uncle Sammy), I guess 20 plus years of stinkers still seems new...

Of course even some of the old timers were pretty odd. Having lived in a couple of villages proved that...
But in the old days, nobody really went looking for them when they disappeared.





xx
 
The Diggler has an point, but I'm not sure the accusers are home grown either. Mabey guide versus guide in this issue.

I won't bother with someone trying to make a living or someone from outside trying to enjoy all the money they are paying for the experience. There is an understood who stomped on who feeling that I like to honor. Trouble is that if a service from town sees you somewhere, they will try it too. If is good they will land on you, or once you vacate they will take your improved spot.

I keep wondering if someone used a spot set up and improved by someone else in this whole thing. I've also made a place or two that have become guided spots. I just don't go back after the Otters start comming. That is what a cub is for. Go where they can't. But once again I think we have cub against cub and guide against guide as an issue here.

Diggler come on up, but I'd like to see you get out of a cub- unguided- but paying full out of state.

"Luke" I suspect you don't want to talk because of the charges and lawyers and all that. They have been a long time comming - the charges and lawyers- but I figure you have a story too. I just wonder what happened to get you so riled up.

Those charges are a load and most must have come as observation after the incident. I figure, if true, (and that is the problem with a long simmering case to look for other violations) you fly a lot better than you think. If your thinking got you to use the cub as a weapon - it's worse that raising a firearm. It might have been better if the blue shirt was at Koksetna to sort things out right after they happened.

Good luck if you were in the right.

GR
 
diggler said:
Alaska constitution was forward thinking in that it addressed this issue and proclaims that all fish, game, timber and minerals belong equally to all residents of the state.

How about non residents? I figure I have just as much of a right to hunt public lands in AK if I want to as a resident, as long as I buy a permit.

Nope you don't! :eek: The law is quit clear on subsistence! The locals get first dibbs.

Well we have been fighting over it for 20 years anyway....... :-?
 
The locals get first dibbs

This is true! An excellent case in point was the mass slaughter of the Nelchina Caribou herd by Anchorage hunters, while the locals had to fight getting shot at when hundreds of hunters showed up to kill the caribou when they crossed the Richardson. I was there, and I had bullets flying over my head while some idiot from Anchorage shot from the back of his black Dodge truck while the caribou were trying to cross the road! :bad-words:
Now there's more chance of wedding a nun than even an Alaska resident with less than 35 years in Alaska hunting getting a Tier II permit to hunt this herd. A good turn but far too late.
Obviously Byron made some mistakes and lost his temper or whatever--which isn't acceptable no matter WHAT industry you're in--but there is a problem there with what's going on in my opinion: It can be frustrating at times when you are trying to make a living hunting game, and all of a sudden 30 camps spring out of the tundra because the caribou passed through and some air taxi out of Anchorage is dropping off people "en-masse" to slaughter these animals--suddenly your pristine hunting grounds for these high-paying return clients has turned into a Tennessee coon hunt! Sure, I suppose they have a right to hunt, and should be treated with respect, but it is kind of sad when you see the numbers declining in the herds and you know it isn't just wolves or bears. :evil:
This problem doesn't lie with the individual hunter however, but with the management programs currently in place. And losing your temper and "going off" on a couple "idiot hunters" no matter where they are or what they've done is NEVER justafiable.
Personally, I try to always LAND and talk to the people, find out where they are coming from and what they are doing, telling them who I am and what I do, and I ask them to respect what I am TRYING to do in the same area and you know, I've NEVER once had a problem! Getting angry and vindictive never solves anything in my opinion.
And wanton waste is a HUGE No-No in my book, it totally nullifies the whole purpose of hunting to me, since I grew up hunting to put meat in the freezer for winter. There have been times though when the meat can't be "salvaged" immediately, obviously because of weather and guides who are naturally unwilling to pack a whole moose 12 miles to where I am stuck sitting in my airplane listening to the briefer tell me how foggy it is everywhere within 150 miles. But the meat gets taken out first chance I get--at least in camps I'M flying for.

That's just me though, maybe Byron should speak for himself.

RB
 
RB, Crash and the gang,

Been away a long time but oh how this sounds familiar. RB I remember the slaughter of the herd crossing the richardson, used to be limit of 5 either sex. (Caribou that is) I remember when the infantry from FT. Rich used to go up in military vehicles and lay down fire like it was a practice range. I once was pinned down for over an hour in the line of fire, Scared shitless and when it all settled I gutted out over 20 bloated caribou and took them to Chitna, and with the help of Jack John (remember him) we salvaged most of the meat.

The reason I quit hunting was over this crap over the subsistance/native/ non-resident/ outfitter, crap and having to spend nearly 20k in legal fees to prove my inocence!

Crash, You and RB are both right, it is a shame that a guy can't expect to raise his boys/girls in repect of both the land and the Fish and Game. It is a beautiful place and sure hope it can remain a great place to fly, fish, hunt and enjoy.

Tim

PS: hope to be back to building a cub in the not to distant future.
 
The natives really despise what they call "horn hunters". Typically hunters from the "states" or "over seas" that come here for "the big rack".

The guys from out of State do not have a corner on waste. Having been a cop in a couple of villages, I can tell you that certain indiginous personel can also be fairly wastefull. Like the guys in Fort Yukon who shot the hell out of grounded geese with their mini-14s. And then wanted to trade them for beer. Or another guy in Fort Yukon who killed over 30 moose to feed his dog team. That family had to draw straws on who had the least amount of convictions, while trying to get one of the kids to plead to that particular crime. How about the net strung all the way across the Sucker River that jammed up with dead fish while the owner was off in Fairbanks on a two week bender?

Unfortunately, goof balls come from all over and in all colors...
But so do the good folks, of which there are many both in the bush and out of state.
 
Well said Alex!! Those kind of people are all over the place. And there is little we can do to change it. It all comes from the way they are raised. I had a guy I would go on hunting trips with and he would trow garbage out the window, I would stop go back and pick it up. He didn't have a clue. I told him "Just throw it in my truck and I'll throw it out later" He just could not figure out why I would get so upset. Those kind of people will never change. It is the same with many things....No respect for anything!
Keith
 
Over time, hunters as a whole have become fractured into many competing interest groups and subgroups, all of which compete for the what is intended to be the harvest of wild fish and game. Within each of these interest groups there is a wide range of hunting ethics. It is the unethical hunter within the group that taints our perception of any particular group. We use these tainted perceptions as ammo to battle amongst ourselves.

I’m not a fan of the out of the state hunter, yet my brothers come here and hunt ethically. They come here for the meat that they take back with them. Nothing is wasted and the “horn” if it happens is simply an added benefit.

I’m not a fan of how some guides operate, yet I have coexisted with an extremely ethical operation in the Brooks Range that limits clients, coexists respectfully with other hunters, and has less impact on sheep populations than some of unethical antics of some of the local “subsistence” hunters out of Kaktovik.

I have seen plenty of abuse from all sides. Guides, air taxi outfits, resident hunters, non-resident hunters, native villagers all have provided me witness to wanton destruction of our game resource.

It’s the unethical hunter, regardless of group association ( native, rural, pilot, out-of-state guided, etc) that truly needs to hang. Our problem is we just don’t have enough rope in form of solid enforcement. We sure as heck don’t need any Fed’s but we do need a solid core of home grown State Fish and Wildlife enforcement officials that have the guts, determination, judgment, and backing to string up these violators in public for all to see.

Jerry
 
Jerry,

I don't disagree with most of your statements. I will say, though, that the difficulty nowadays in enforcement isn't with the officers, but rather with fact that there is no political will to enforce game laws for fear someone might be offended.

Live in the bush? Want to kill a cow moose? Just say "funeral moose". Game, set and match.

MTV
 
Mike,

The point I was trying to make was to keep that home grown help in the enforcement end. These local guy's know the ropes and make better officers.

I totally agree with your point about political will and attempted to convey this in my last sentence by using the word "backing".

Jerry
 
Maybe the horn hunters should be forced to take the hornes and leave the meat for the wolves - that way none is wasted and thats one less the wolves have to kill (theoretically)

I heard they use to do this in Canada - don't know if its true
 
Isn't Byron, aka Luke, the one who reported broken Landis 2500's?
Perhaps they were not so much broken as shot up. Those are pretty tough skiis.
 
Just say "funeral moose". Game, set and match
.


Ah yes, the dreaded Potlatch Moose. every time somebody died in the village, it sounded like a South American firing squad was practicing for the next election cycle..


xx
 
Crash said:
I hope Byron did not really do this. I would be very disappointed in him if it is true. Crash

I agree. I always enjoyed his commentary on this site. It is ashame if it is true, he has so much to lose in a situation like this... his very livelihood and lifestyle, one that many people in the lower-48 envy.
 
cubflier said:
Over time, hunters as a whole have become fractured into many competing interest groups and subgroups, all of which compete for the what is intended to be the harvest of wild fish and game. Within each of these interest groups there is a wide range of hunting ethics. It is the unethical hunter within the group that taints our perception of any particular group. We use these tainted perceptions as ammo to battle amongst ourselves.

And this is not good, hunting as a whole is under enough pressure as it is with the anti's and other issues. Hunters shouldn't contribute to these issues themselves.
 
Alex Clark said:
The natives really despise what they call "horn hunters". Typically hunters from the "states" or "over seas" that come here for "the big rack".

The guys from out of State do not have a corner on waste. Having been a cop in a couple of villages, I can tell you that certain indiginous personel can also be fairly wastefull. Like the guys in Fort Yukon who shot the hell out of grounded geese with their mini-14s. And then wanted to trade them for beer. Or another guy in Fort Yukon who killed over 30 moose to feed his dog team. That family had to draw straws on who had the least amount of convictions, while trying to get one of the kids to plead to that particular crime. How about the net strung all the way across the Sucker River that jammed up with dead fish while the owner was off in Fairbanks on a two week bender?

Unfortunately, goof balls come from all over and in all colors...
But so do the good folks, of which there are many both in the bush and out of state.

Like the two nondalton residents at the pebble mine who chased a caribou around on an ATV and riddled it with a 22 until it eventually expired. Or the folks in platinum (I think, it's been a decade or more) who just laid waste to a bunch of caribou on a frozen lake, and the officer who followed the snowmachine trail back to the village got held at gunpoint. Or more recently, the villagers who shot 4-5 musk ox out in somewhere between the yukon and the kuskokwim and left them there, or the guy in Tuntutuliak who shot the region's only moose, and the village refused to let officials come into town to investigate.

And these are only the ones that make it to the pages of the Anchorage daily news.
 
Christina Young said:
And this is not good, hunting as a whole is under enough pressure as it is with the anti's and other issues. Hunters shouldn't contribute to these issues themselves.

Christina,

It is truly a case of "the enemy within".

I volunteer help the Alaska Outdoor Council fund raising efforts. They are the best hope we have at combating the anti's. They use the typical venue's of public awareness and political lobby.

It is extremely difficult to portray a united front in the political arena with all these fractious groups. We deal with the forces that divide these groups such and federal subsistence regulation, geographic separation, different modes of access etc, as best we can. But there is nothing that you can do to overcome the division created by the unethical hunter within these groups. They truly make it difficult to defend the freedom of the hunter against the constant bombardment of those that would celebrate the opportunity to steal this precious tradition.

Jerry
 
Perhaps they should deal with people who engage in irrational slaughter of wildlife like they do with poachers in Africa: Shoot them on sight. I wouldn't lose two minutes sleep. People like that need cull'n.
 
Had an interesting conversation with a longtime (as in grew up there) Dillingham resident. According to him, this is habitual behavior for the individual, that he has a history of not just buzzing, but coming so close that he almost hits plane, tents, etc. and also flying directly at other airborne aircraft, as descrbed in this thread:
http://www.supercub.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=8238&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Apparently this is neither the first incident, nor an isolated incident, that enough people have finally gotten fed up and agreed to testify that the authorities had to take action.
 
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