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Thread: Demer tips

  1. #1
    Jerry Burr's Avatar
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    Demer tips

    Wanted a set of those ugly, heavy, no good Demer tips. Madras or what ever name they go by. Got some in the back yard you want to get rid of, let me know. Thanks. Jerry.

  2. #2
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    I've got a pair Jerry. On is cracked where it appears the two halves go together. I will take some pics and send to you.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

  3. #3
    bobnall's Avatar
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    Jerry,

    I have one good left side "Texas" tip and one damaged right side tip. I'm told it's repairable. Let me know if interested.

    -Bob

  4. #4
    Stocky's Avatar
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    Extended Wings

    OK guys here it goes.

    I found, and bought a set of unused Madras tips complete with all the hardware and associated paperwork. A fella I met out at birchwood had been storing them in his hanger. I decided a little while back when I got some damage to a bow on my -12 due to hanger rash, now would be the time to convert. When I started to look around at other airplanes on Lake Hood, I thought I would do some measuring to see how much wing area I would really gain. Here is what I found in measurments from the last full rib (next to the aileron) to the outside edge of the tip. (These are all approximations, they seem to vary by 1/2 inch or so)

    Stock wingtip 28"

    Demers (Madras) per STC 12"

    Some other extension plus Demers (Madras) 24"

    Much to my surprise, by my rough calculations, putting on the Madras booster tip as per STC causes a total loss of approxiamtely 9-10 square feet. Granted that a stock, cub wingtip isn't a high lift sort of airfoil, but I'm pretty sure it creates some lift. With the unknown extension, the wing square footage is about the same as a stock wing except it is a true airfoil most of the way out.

    Now here comes the point of this post. Who holds an STC that would allow me to add that extra 12" of wing on, before I install the tip to regan that area? This is a one time shot, because the Madras STC has you cut the cap strip tangs at the end of the spar. Most of the extensions I've talked about with people, have these strips bent outward to accept a flat piece of aluminum and therefore a new rib and butt rib. If I cut them off, they're gone.

    The airplane was recovered about ten years ago, so a full teardown to extend the ailerons and add flaps is not desired right now. I've read the discussions about the pro's and con's of these tips and extensions without changing the flight controls, and have decided to do it. I'm just looking for the knowledge on how? The extension portion that is?

    Any help is greatly appreciated, the couple of guys I've found via the FAA registry and internet search that had this combination were not really too interested in helping me out.

    Thanks,
    Tim

  5. #5
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    TJ has the paperwork in his photo gallery for bending the capstrips up. The Pacer I just bought with a friend has them with the cut of spars and there is a Tri-Pacer here with the bent up spar cap. Big difference in wing area as you noted.
    Steve Pierce

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  6. #6
    behindpropellers's Avatar
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    Re: Demer tips

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Burr
    Wanted a set of those ugly, heavy, no good Demer tips. Madras or what ever name they go by. Got some in the back yard you want to get rid of, let me know. Thanks. Jerry.
    I thought I had PM'd you about a month ago on a set I saw on ebay....

  7. #7
    T.J.'s Avatar
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    delete

  8. #8
    Stocky's Avatar
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    Which doesn't

    T.J.
    Which mod is it that doesn't require them to be cut off?
    Tim

  9. #9

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    Demer tips

    demers= madras= big droop=cut off spar andddddddddddddddd

    plane booster=fergusson=texas tips= smaller droop= extend spar

  10. #10
    Steve's Aircraft (Steve)'s Avatar
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    The Madras (Demer) tips, manufactured in Madras Oregon, required the spar caps to be removed. That STC is currently dormant because Ace Demers passed away. The Plane Booster tips that required the caps to be straightened to give an extra 9 " of wing was bought by Cub Crafters. Cub Crafters has since changed the profile of the tip so if you damage one, you also have to replace the opposite one at the tune of $650 each.

    Steve

  11. #11

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    Do they work. And just what is the advantage or advantages.

  12. #12
    T.J.'s Avatar
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    delete

  13. #13
    Stocky's Avatar
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    Will it work?

    So, can I install the Demers with the extensions from ???? or does the spar tips have to be cut-off?
    Tim

  14. #14
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Anybody have a Demer/Madras left wing tip sitting around? Have a Pacer with a damaged one, can be fixed but will be a pain.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

  15. #15
    mike mcs repair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    ..a damaged one, can be fixed but will be a pain.
    back when i was young and skinny... and nothing was impossible... but maybe not cost effective... a touch of tinfoil to form it and some fiberglass.. good to go!!


  16. #16
    txfirefighter628's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    Anybody have a Demer/Madras left wing tip sitting around? Have a Pacer with a damaged one, can be fixed but will be a pain.
    Havent been on the threads for a while, been studying for my A&P test, but I have a set of Madras tips off my PA-12, not sure if they will fit a PA-20 wing though. I think Chris has a set off a colt project also if you still need one.

  17. #17
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    We fixed the damaged tip. Thanks.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

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    Demer tips still available?

    Quote Originally Posted by txfirefighter628 View Post
    Havent been on the threads for a while, been studying for my A&P test, but I have a set of Madras tips off my PA-12, not sure if they will fit a PA-20 wing though. I think Chris has a set off a colt project also if you still need one.
    Any chance you still have the demer tips? Need to replace the right one on my PA-12

  19. #19

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    I have a set of Madras tips for my PA-12. Let me know if your interested.


    Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org

  20. #20
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by comptamos View Post
    Any chance you still have the demer tips? Need to replace the right one on my PA-12
    What condition is your right one in? It's only fiberglass......fixable. I'm not a fiberglass person, but I would not be afraid to tackle it if it were mine.
    N1PA

  21. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    What condition is your right one in? It's only fiberglass......fixable. I'm not a fiberglass person, but I would not be afraid to tackle it if it were mine.
    Its in pretty rough shape. Doubt it's fixable.

  22. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by tbone View Post
    I have a set of Madras tips for my PA-12. Let me know if your interested.


    Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org
    Yes possibly. We bought Dakota tips but realized we're going to have to replace outboard ribs and modify the aileron. I'm not a huge fan of the drooptips, but we might be stuck with them now. Where are you located? Can you send pics?

  23. #23
    gntw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by comptamos View Post
    Yes possibly. We bought Dakota tips but realized we're going to have to replace outboard ribs and modify the aileron. I'm not a huge fan of the drooptips, but we might be stuck with them now. Where are you located? Can you send pics?
    Was wondering why the Dakota tips wouldn’t fit on I just ordered a set from Dakota to replace demer tip because the owner of the plane doesn’t like them and wants to change. Can’t see why they won’t fit

  24. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by gntw View Post
    Was wondering why the Dakota tips wouldn’t fit on I just ordered a set from Dakota to replace demer tip because the owner of the plane doesn’t like them and wants to change. Can’t see why they won’t fit
    It looks to me like with the droop tips (I'm not actually sure if mine are madras or other to be honest. Do you know how to tell? ) the 2 ribs are shorter than the Dakota cub tips so we have to replace them with longer ones. Then modify the aileron so it goes straight into that junction rather than curving forward like it originally was to match up with the bowtip wing.

  25. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by comptamos View Post
    It looks to me like with the droop tips (I'm not actually sure if mine are madras or other to be honest. Do you know how to tell? ) the 2 ribs are shorter than the Dakota cub tips so we have to replace them with longer ones. Then modify the aileron so it goes straight into that junction rather than curving forward like it originally was to match up with the bowtip wing.
    Google search comes up with lots of pics of tips, not sure how many different kinds of droops there were made, here is link https://www.google.com/search?q=madr...bih=1024&dpr=2

  26. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by supercub1999 View Post
    Google search comes up with lots of pics of tips, not sure how many different kinds of droops there were made, here is link https://www.google.com/search?q=madr...bih=1024&dpr=2
    Click image for larger version. 

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  27. #27

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    Anybody know which wingtip is on this PA-12?

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    Quote Originally Posted by comptamos View Post
    Anybody know which wingtip is on this PA-12?
    You have what are called Plane Booster tips. Attached the .pdf stc manual link. If you compare your wing tip to a Madras you will notice the Madras excessive droop from the leading edge back to the trailing edge of the tip, your Plane Booster tip does not have that droop, they are a strait edge along the bottom of the tip, no droop. The float has Madras tips, the Super Cub has Plane Booster tips like yours
    https://www.supercub.org/forum/attac...3&d=1329012675

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  29. #29
    gntw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by comptamos View Post
    It looks to me like with the droop tips (I'm not actually sure if mine are madras or other to be honest. Do you know how to tell? ) the 2 ribs are shorter than the Dakota cub tips so we have to replace them with longer ones. Then modify the aileron so it goes straight into that junction rather than curving forward like it originally was to match up with the bowtip wing.

    ok I was just checking ours has full length ribs and ailerons are already squared off thanks for the reply

  30. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by supercub1999 View Post
    You have what are called Plane Booster tips. Attached the .pdf stc manual link. If you compare your wing tip to a Madras you will notice the Madras excessive droop from the leading edge back to the trailing edge of the tip, your Plane Booster tip does not have that droop, they are a strait edge along the bottom of the tip, no droop. The float has Madras tips, the Super Cub has Plane Booster tips like yours
    https://www.supercub.org/forum/attac...3&d=1329012675

    Ok thanks! I've also read that cubcrafters has modified the design slightly meaning I couldn't just buy one side. Do you know if this is true?

  31. #31

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    I have never dealt with CC and they may not sell you anything but the entire STC, which may not be a bad way to go, its under 3 thousand I believe, these wing tips rock, they create a lot of lift over a stock wing.

    Another option is to make a deal on these Madras on ebay https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pier-Pacer-...s/114607482244

    Offer a hundred bucks, he will counter 3 and and you get them for 2. Than you can do it or take them to a body shop and see if they will take about 3 inches of that droop off and make them strait from the leading to trailing edge and shape it to match your Plane Booster tip.

    Or keep searching and calling around, I am sure someone has a good right tip. I have seen them on craigs list on barnstormers.

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    I would post some pictures of yours and see if someone thinks it can be fixed, might get an offer from someone that could use the money and can make it look new again. Is it hangar rash, ground loop? What happened to it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by supercub1999 View Post
    I would post some pictures of yours and see if someone thinks it can be fixed, might get an offer from someone that could use the money and can make it look new again. Is it hangar rash, ground loop? What happened to it?
    Ground loop. Doesn't seem repairable to me but open to the idea! Click image for larger version. 

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  37. #37
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    It's a big tear, but certainly fixable.
    N1PA

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