Which Floats Are Best?
- Thread starter Raven
- Start date
Crash
GONE WEST
Nikiski Alaska
Alex Clark
Registered User
Life Long Alaskan
The not so good ones you can afford, are always more enjoyable than the ones on the web page that you can't.
behindpropellers
Registered User
NE Ohio
Raven said:
What is your gross weight? That makes a difference.
Crash
GONE WEST
Nikiski Alaska
In talking to Matt at Aerocet, he said they have a new process that will knock 10 to 12% off their current float weights. They will start using it next year on the 3500L Cessna 180/185 floats. He said one of their future projects is to get the 2200's for the Super Cub STC'd and they will use the new process. This should be the ultimate float for a Super Cub if they come in about the weight as Baumanns. Take care! Crash
mvivion
SPONSOR
Bozeman,MT
Well......
You have a lot of choices for floats since you are in the experimental category.
Baumanns and Wiplines are both great floats, with big flat decks and big lockers. That counts for a lot. They are also expensive, because they are all relatively new.
If you want the no-joke best performing floats out there for a Cub, though, find a good set of EDO 2000 floats. They don't have flat decks, and they don't have big lockers, so if those are important to you, don't go there.
There are thousands of 2000's out there, lots of them rigged for cubs. There is also some junk out there, so watch out.
Frankly, the 2000's will outperform anything on the market in this class, if kept at a reasonable takeoff weight (under 2000 pounds).
Another less expensive option for experimentals is the Montana Floats. I've not flown them, but they are well built, good designs, and are available as a kit or built. Prices are substantially cheaper than certified floats as well.
MTV
You have a lot of choices for floats since you are in the experimental category.
Baumanns and Wiplines are both great floats, with big flat decks and big lockers. That counts for a lot. They are also expensive, because they are all relatively new.
If you want the no-joke best performing floats out there for a Cub, though, find a good set of EDO 2000 floats. They don't have flat decks, and they don't have big lockers, so if those are important to you, don't go there.
There are thousands of 2000's out there, lots of them rigged for cubs. There is also some junk out there, so watch out.
Frankly, the 2000's will outperform anything on the market in this class, if kept at a reasonable takeoff weight (under 2000 pounds).
Another less expensive option for experimentals is the Montana Floats. I've not flown them, but they are well built, good designs, and are available as a kit or built. Prices are substantially cheaper than certified floats as well.
MTV
floats
Registered User
Central Florida
Aqua makes a good float with flat deck and big hatches for storage. With the 115hp I'm not sure if you could use the 1500's or if you would have to go with the 1900's. I've got 1500's on a J3 with 100hp and have been happy with them.
I would think that you could use the 1500's, and you can buy them certified or as a kit for experimentals which will save a lot of money and get you a design that has been approved for the Super Cub.
A lot of Maule owners use Aqua's, and Brown's SPB in Florida uses them on all of their Cubs. Good design and very sturdy.
Gregg Anderson
From the Dark Underbelly of Florida
I would think that you could use the 1500's, and you can buy them certified or as a kit for experimentals which will save a lot of money and get you a design that has been approved for the Super Cub.
A lot of Maule owners use Aqua's, and Brown's SPB in Florida uses them on all of their Cubs. Good design and very sturdy.
Gregg Anderson
From the Dark Underbelly of Florida
I`m building an exp. 160 hp supercub. I will put a set of pk1800 because they are 50 pounds lighter than edo 2000 . They were on a 7GCB , i hope my cub will have a lower EW. than the champ. Anyone with these floats on a supercub yet? Any comment?
Frenchy
Frenchy
aktango58
FRIEND
18AA
Auquas?????????
Best water handling float I have ever flown, can step turn like nothing. With any weight they loved the water.......
Tried to get PK floats on a 12. Not a chance. Under exp it would be easy. I even know where an inexpensive set happen to be.
If I was flying exp., I would look out there for some of the not certified float manufacture places. They are the ones with all the great tecnology, after all, how long did we fly with Airstreaks, Bushwheels, and what ever else we could sneak past our mechanic?
Best water handling float I have ever flown, can step turn like nothing. With any weight they loved the water.......
Tried to get PK floats on a 12. Not a chance. Under exp it would be easy. I even know where an inexpensive set happen to be.
If I was flying exp., I would look out there for some of the not certified float manufacture places. They are the ones with all the great tecnology, after all, how long did we fly with Airstreaks, Bushwheels, and what ever else we could sneak past our mechanic?
mvivion
SPONSOR
Bozeman,MT
I agree that the non certificated float market is a great source of floats for an experimental airplane, but I'd be a little skeptical of a claim that they have all the technology.
Sorry, but there isn't much new technology out there in any kind of floats. Oh, sure, a few folks are building floats out of composites, but even those really aren't "new" materials.
And, while the hull designs change a little, hulls have been around a loooonnnng time, and it's pretty well known what works and what doesn't. Even in some of the newest and "innovative" floats, one would have to stretch a point to claim any seriously new technology.
I too would seriously consider the experimental floats, such as those produced by Montana, mentioned in my earlier post, for an experimental category airplane.
That said, the Cub this guy is describing is basically just a Cub, and one of the advantages of floats that have been in production for a long time is that they've stood the test of time, and people can tell you how they'll perform on a Cub.
Just some rambling, sorry,
MTV
Sorry, but there isn't much new technology out there in any kind of floats. Oh, sure, a few folks are building floats out of composites, but even those really aren't "new" materials.
And, while the hull designs change a little, hulls have been around a loooonnnng time, and it's pretty well known what works and what doesn't. Even in some of the newest and "innovative" floats, one would have to stretch a point to claim any seriously new technology.
I too would seriously consider the experimental floats, such as those produced by Montana, mentioned in my earlier post, for an experimental category airplane.
That said, the Cub this guy is describing is basically just a Cub, and one of the advantages of floats that have been in production for a long time is that they've stood the test of time, and people can tell you how they'll perform on a Cub.
Just some rambling, sorry,
MTV
ground loop
Registered User
Anchorage
I wonder if the plastic that Landis is using would make a great float? It seems that every float has its strength and weaknesses. The composites just weigh to much.
If Gary Landis is out there, could you tell us what material you think would make the lightest weight float?
I want edo performance with a float that has 300 lbs more floatation than edo 2000's and weighs 35 to 40 lbs less. I think someone thinking outside the box can get this done.
While I am dreaming it would be nice if these floats had an accessory fuel storage option, with pump!
If Gary Landis is out there, could you tell us what material you think would make the lightest weight float?
I want edo performance with a float that has 300 lbs more floatation than edo 2000's and weighs 35 to 40 lbs less. I think someone thinking outside the box can get this done.
While I am dreaming it would be nice if these floats had an accessory fuel storage option, with pump!
Floats
I think these Clamars are pretty good. More bouyancy and less weight. Plus you don't have to pump them out! Experimental only of course. I don't think they go down to 1650s though.
http://www.clamarfloats.com/
I think these Clamars are pretty good. More bouyancy and less weight. Plus you don't have to pump them out! Experimental only of course. I don't think they go down to 1650s though.
http://www.clamarfloats.com/
Crash
GONE WEST
Nikiski Alaska
$24,500.00 for a set of 2200 Clamore straight floats is no real deal. Experimental only, no resale value. No reputation or company track record. Fiberglass with kevalar, remember Fiberfloat of the 1970's. The longer they were in the water the heavier they got. Not worth a plug nickle today.
A few years ago Carolina skiff was the new rage along the Yukon river. A big wide fiberglass skiff. A lot of natives purchased them. Now you don't hardly see them anymore. The reason... they weighed a ton after a few seasons in the water. A couple of things about aluminum floats. One, the skin can't take on water. Two, I know how to buck rivets, I don't know how to work with injection epoxy fiberglass. Take care. Crash
A few years ago Carolina skiff was the new rage along the Yukon river. A big wide fiberglass skiff. A lot of natives purchased them. Now you don't hardly see them anymore. The reason... they weighed a ton after a few seasons in the water. A couple of things about aluminum floats. One, the skin can't take on water. Two, I know how to buck rivets, I don't know how to work with injection epoxy fiberglass. Take care. Crash
cub_driver
Registered User
Big Lake AK
Crash
What makes Aerocet such a hot float? They have been taking the market by storm.
My friends that have them really seem to like them and have not experianced the problums you have mentioned. I know of one person that had to do a field repair, he commented it went well he just needed to get it good and dry.
The first fiber floats where a little undersized for a cub. They soon produced a larger set that performed vary well on cubs. Atlee dodge produced rigging for the floats untill the company was bought out. The floats where never put back into production after that. Thats the history of fiber floats as I know it.
Cub_Driver
What makes Aerocet such a hot float? They have been taking the market by storm.
My friends that have them really seem to like them and have not experianced the problums you have mentioned. I know of one person that had to do a field repair, he commented it went well he just needed to get it good and dry.
The first fiber floats where a little undersized for a cub. They soon produced a larger set that performed vary well on cubs. Atlee dodge produced rigging for the floats untill the company was bought out. The floats where never put back into production after that. Thats the history of fiber floats as I know it.
Cub_Driver
mvivion
SPONSOR
Bozeman,MT
Fiber floats also tried several other "innovations" that didn't quite work out. For example, they tried "spoilers" on the bottoms of the floats instead of water rudders. That was good for some things, but eventually, the pilot would land with one partially extended, and fail the hydraulic steering system. Bummer, bleed the hydraulics out in the bush assuming you got to shore with no steering.
Secondly, the early Fiber Floats had a suspension system, which turned out to be a VERY bad idea. In rough water, the suspension would start working till it hit the stops, and drove the longerons through the bottom of the airplane.
The floats were also a catamaran type hull, with a very hard chine. Step turns worked up to a point, then the chine dug in, and whamo.
I've heard rumors of Fiber Floats getting heavier, but I've never found anyone that could actually prove it.
I know of Aerocets that were weighed before and after a season in the water, with only a pound or two increase in weight. A metal float easily carries that much water in leakage that you can't pump out. By the way, that water seeps into seams and freezes, opening the seams over the years, so metal floats have some issues as well.
Frankly, the rumors of composite floats absorbing all sorts of water are mostly false, near as I can tell. If the glass were actually absorbing all that water, wouldn't it de-laminate very quickly? I've not seen signs of that.
I fly with a guy regularly who has an original set of Fiber Floats, modified to use standard water rudders and no suspension. They work just fine, and perform well.
That said, Crash, you are absolutely correct, that price would buy a good set of certificated floats that would have resale value as well.
MTV
Secondly, the early Fiber Floats had a suspension system, which turned out to be a VERY bad idea. In rough water, the suspension would start working till it hit the stops, and drove the longerons through the bottom of the airplane.
The floats were also a catamaran type hull, with a very hard chine. Step turns worked up to a point, then the chine dug in, and whamo.
I've heard rumors of Fiber Floats getting heavier, but I've never found anyone that could actually prove it.
I know of Aerocets that were weighed before and after a season in the water, with only a pound or two increase in weight. A metal float easily carries that much water in leakage that you can't pump out. By the way, that water seeps into seams and freezes, opening the seams over the years, so metal floats have some issues as well.
Frankly, the rumors of composite floats absorbing all sorts of water are mostly false, near as I can tell. If the glass were actually absorbing all that water, wouldn't it de-laminate very quickly? I've not seen signs of that.
I fly with a guy regularly who has an original set of Fiber Floats, modified to use standard water rudders and no suspension. They work just fine, and perform well.
That said, Crash, you are absolutely correct, that price would buy a good set of certificated floats that would have resale value as well.
MTV
ground loop
Registered User
Anchorage
A real well designed innovative float would have hydroplanes as well.
mvivion, I have never flown aquas on a cub or husky, have you? How do they compare?
mvivion, I have never flown aquas on a cub or husky, have you? How do they compare?
irishfield
Registered User
Penetanguishene, Ontario Canada
A set of Murphy 1800 amphibs sounds perfect for you. Older kit with .020 side skins, .025 rear keels and .032 step skins only weight 258 lbs complete with all spreaders and attach struts. Newer kits with .025 sides/.032 rear skins and .040 step skins ~ 267lb. The straight 1800's are VERY light and if you are interested I have a set with 20 hours on them, that were taken off for an amphib installation, sitting in my hangar.
If you want a bigger float, then it's CLAMAR's 2250 for straights or 2200 Amphibs. They use an infusion process that is ahead of Aerocets construction technic that guarantees minimal weight of resin with full strength of hull. This process also makes sure there are no kevlar or fiber ends protruding from the glass to wick water. They will not get heavier with time.
Cheers,
Wayne
If you want a bigger float, then it's CLAMAR's 2250 for straights or 2200 Amphibs. They use an infusion process that is ahead of Aerocets construction technic that guarantees minimal weight of resin with full strength of hull. This process also makes sure there are no kevlar or fiber ends protruding from the glass to wick water. They will not get heavier with time.
Cheers,
Wayne
ground loop
Registered User
Anchorage
The clamar floats don't need to get heavier with time, they are heavier to start with! 
mvivion
SPONSOR
Bozeman,MT
Also worthy of note that Aerocets use a honeycomb side construction and tops, but use conventional fiberglass bottoms. This relates directly to repairability in the field.
Build a high tech composite float, bust it in the field, and you may not be able to repair it.
Ask the guys who've bruised an Extra 300. It takes some serious mechanics to fix one of those composite wonders.
MTV
Build a high tech composite float, bust it in the field, and you may not be able to repair it.
Ask the guys who've bruised an Extra 300. It takes some serious mechanics to fix one of those composite wonders.
MTV
harneymaki
Registered User
Esko, Minnesota
EDO.... Earl Dodge Osborne.....
I learn something new here every day!
http://www.edocorp.com/pr2004/04r0302.htm
Thanks
Paul
I learn something new here every day!
http://www.edocorp.com/pr2004/04r0302.htm
Thanks
Paul
