Mead 1430 Amphibs on 11-EX

skywagon8a · Mar 15, 2022

Dan Gervae said:
I'll measure and compare the attach points against the Baumanns....My Baumann straights are parked right underneath the Meads in my hangar....Critical measurements being attach points in relation to step I'm thinking.

There is a thought. Compare the float deck fitting's locations in relation to the spreaders and step between the two sets of floats. Perhaps you could just use the Baumann struts on the Meads? Or mix and match between the two. Are the Baumanns for a Tcraft or Cub?

I'm using Citabria struts on my Cub. Just changed some of the fittings.

Dan Gervae · Mar 15, 2022

skywagon8a said:
There is a thought. Compare the float deck fitting's locations in relation to the spreaders and step between the two sets of floats. Perhaps you could just use the Baumann struts on the Meads? Or mix and match between the two. Are the Baumanns for a Tcraft or Cub?

I'm using Citabria struts on my Cub. Just changed some of the fittings.

My Baumann's are on my Tcraft, but an aquantance has a set of Baumann1500A's rigged for his PA11 and he said I could take his struts and recreate them if I wanted....If they match up dimensionally it might save some time.

skywagon8a · Mar 15, 2022

Dan Gervae said:
My Baumann's are on my Tcraft, but an aquantance has a set of Baumann1500A's rigged for his PA11 and he said I could take his struts and recreate them if I wanted....If they match up dimensionally it might save some time.

That is a foot in the door. It beats starting from scratch. Also even if there is a small difference, it may be satisfactory. The tolerances are not tight. There is always room for tweaking. What I've told you gets you in the ball park.

The step on mine is aft of EDO's installation by an inch or two. I see no reason to move it as the performance is very satisfactory.

BC12D-4-85 · Mar 15, 2022

This may not be worth noting but I had a set of 1320's on a PA-11. The struts were wrong and placed the floats and step more forward than EDO intended. The struts were for J-3 with the fuel forward from the PA-11's. Once loaded the float heels sunk and nothing could be put in the rear baggage. Getting on step the rear spreader was submerged while the nose portion rose and thus overall flotation was lost. The plane would settle until more hull speed was achieved. It flew ok but the water performance was dismal if not dangerous. I discovered the strut/rigging error too late (from Eddie Peck) and ended up changing floats then the plane. My point is floats too far forward or rear CG and that's what apparently can happen. Too far rearward for the weight or forward CG and they'll easily take water over the bows.

Gary

Douten · Mar 16, 2022

Dan, The struts on the (1430?) Baumann straight floats are different than we used on the 1500A's the cubs sat squatty on the Baumann straight floats that is why we used the measurements off my 1320's (it looks right) when they did the struts for my floats. Joe had access to a plane out there maybe a PA-18 95 to check measurements with. If you need measurements PM me. Douten

skywagon8a · Mar 16, 2022

This is the beginning. Suspend the fuselage (or whole airplane), leveled. Position the floats underneath. Tools needed: Tape measure, precision level(s), plumb bobs, pencil, paper and patience. The first one took about 100 hours, now I have it down to about 50.

Start

Finished

Dan Gervae · Mar 16, 2022

Any idea what paint I should use on these floats to color match them? I haveno Idea what top coat is on them since the previous owner painted them yellow (they were white) and he had a guy do it so he didn't know what type of paint it is....I plane a light coat of color match yellow over this darker yellow they are now? I think I'll just sand the top and sides and leave the bottoms the current shade of yellow....not sure yet. These are all Carbon Fiber construction.....then I need a good antiskid for the tops.

BC12D-4-85 · Mar 16, 2022

Paint weighs keep them light for that PA-11

Gary

skywagon8a · Mar 17, 2022

Yellow is difficult to match, leave them alone. You likely won't notice the difference since they are separated from the plane with the struts.

Dan Gervae · Mar 18, 2022

The Mead spreader bars are 9” farther apart than my Baumanns. The floats are very close dimensionally overall, but the attachments will have to be done the old fashioned way since the attachments with reference to the step are not similar.

skywagon8a · Mar 18, 2022

What is the relationship of the individual spreaders in comparison to the step? If one is the same you may have a starting point.

Dan Gervae · Mar 18, 2022

When I line the step up side by side…the front deck mounts are about 2” farther forward on the Meads and the rear are almost 7” farther back from the Baumanns side by side

skywagon8a · Mar 18, 2022

Oh well, it was a thought. I wish I lived closer to you, it will be a fun project.

Dan Gervae · Mar 18, 2022

skywagon8a said:
Oh well, it was a thought. I wish I lived closer to you, it will be a fun project.

It’s a good time of year for the effort…I wish you were closer as well! Thanks for the tremendous help you’ve given from afar

BC12D-4-85 · Mar 18, 2022

I grew up in the UP...this is a nice time of year to visit despite the lake effect weather

Gary

Dan Gervae · Mar 24, 2022

My ew CG is 13.9 (range is 12.9 to 22.7) My Datum is LE of wing. My CG solo with 24 gallons of gas and 20lbs baggage is 14.2 (most common config) with me, 18 gallons of gas, a 175lb passenger, and 20lbs baggage is 17.3.... If i use between 14.2 and 17.3 at shoulder level and swing 10 degrees aft for step placement (I'll use 14.5" for example). The step comes very near to lining up with the lift strut attachment.....proves out in the drawings and I measured a similar installation. I saw pics of the plane Pete mentioned that Clamar setup too far aft on the Legend Cub and you can easily see the step is quite a distance aft of this location. I plan to make my rear strut adjustable as well.

Dan Gervae · Mar 24, 2022

here is a side view of a Carbon Cub SS on Mead Floats…note approximate step location…I’d guess with the CC340 180 hp he is more nose heavy than me

Dan Gervae · Mar 25, 2022

I found the CubCrafters bulletin on float install on their website. Pages 173-196

https://cubcrafters.com/c/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/SSC10000AFM-Rev-H-Statement.pdf

BC12D-4-85 · Mar 25, 2022

This may have been mentioned earlier but here's a similar thread from 2009:

https://www.supercub.org/forum/showthread.php?36366-Rigging-floats&

Gary

Dan Gervae · Mar 25, 2022

In the Cubcrafters drawing, they show 6 degrees incidence at the chord line....which equates to about 4 degrees to the flat bottom. This illustrates the 10 degree swing from average CG to find step location....around 24"-24.25" aft of the leading edge of my wing

skywagon8a · Mar 25, 2022

Dan,
The fuselage must be level.
The angle of incidence of a Cub is about 1.77 degrees.
Subtract that from the 6, giving you 4.23 at the bottom of the wing.
That is 1 degree more than my Cub. Your Cub with 100 hp may like the higher number. Just keep in mind you may want to shift it up or down during testing.

A3310184.pdf (supercubproject.com)

Dan Gervae · Mar 26, 2022

Douten checked his PA11 for me this morning. He has Baumann Amphibs on his….he dropped a plumb Bob from the leading edge and measured to the step… he got 24” ….sounds like a trend…he also has between 4-4.5 degrees from deck of floats to bottom of wing. Thanks Douten!!!!

Dan Gervae · Mar 29, 2022

Cutting 6061 material for some fittings…I bought this cool bandsaw jig for my Milwaukee saw…there’s even a little attachment for vertical cutting…my Scott diaphragm brakes need some boosting for the amphibs, so I got some North Rivers…I’m adding a reservoir and some valves to keep them topped off and/or from locking up with temp changes etc.

skywagon8a · Mar 30, 2022

Dan Gervae said:
so I got some North Rivers…I’m adding a reservoir and some valves to keep them topped off and/or from locking up with temp changes etc.
View attachment 60700 .View attachment 60701

;-) I used to assemble and test each unit before shipment. Lubricate the cylinder walls and O rings prior to assembly with a light grease, like Vaseline. Then cycle the piston in and out a few times to ensure free motion. Place a dab of grease between the plunger and piston. There may be slight motion between the two. Also a dab of grease between the pedal and the ball end of the plunger.

Also be certain the spring is centered in the cylinder. This can be done by placing a Philips screw driver in the output hole.

Dan Gervae · Apr 1, 2022

Put the wear strip back on…getting them ready for the dangling.

Dan Gervae · Apr 4, 2022

I'm trying to do all my research before I put my floats on so I get it right...I am worried about shimmy issues for one....I seem to be missing something up where my shocks attach to the front leaf....there's no way this shock is just supposed to float freely on this bolt....there has to be some pieces of tubing or something to use as spacers....also, my home airport has fairly rough pavement with the annual tarring of the cracks routine....hopefully this doesn't cause problems. I plan to fly it to a nearby strip to practice before I attempt any landings back at home base. There is a 4000' grass strip nearby that is the nicest grass strip in Wisconsin IMO. I hope I can head off any issues by being dilligent and setting things up correctly from the start....I saw a set of Clamars with a teflon "puck" between the front fork and the leaf.....what does this accomplish?....take a look at the attched pic and let me know your thoughts on what to use as spacers in my front shock....there is a ball socket installed, but it can't just piss in the wind back and forth on that bolt.

skywagon8a · Apr 5, 2022

Dan,
You are correct to question this. One of the issues which effect shimmy on all types of nose gears is excess play at all or just one connection.
In this case you should use a bushing on each side, made of a material which is not compressible and will not support rust forming between it and the bolt, which is no more than a slip fit. Bronze? Brass? Phenolic? Use a liberal coating of anti seize compound between the bushing and the bolt. Because if the parts rust together, I'll be able to hear your new vocabulary from here.

Dan Gervae · Apr 7, 2022

I got the wear strips on and sealed on both floats now and I have most of the wiring figured out…waiting for my paint to be delivered…there were a few small gouges that needed repair from shipping damage that occurred…I decided to scuff them up and spray them with Stewarts EkoCrylic…Federal Yellow, same as my plane. I connected with a gentleman from Taveres FL that has a set of Mead floats on his CC Sport Cub…it’s been a huge help. He has well over 300hrs on his Meads and loves them. It was such a blessing to have another owner to communicate with. He winters in Taveres and Summers in Bentonville, AR….we are even talking about getting together for some flying. He’s at Sun N Fun now but when he gets home he is going to give me the rundown and take pictures and measurements of his set up…airplane people are amazing….I talked to him 5 minutes and he invited me to come down and fly his Cub to get first hand experience with the Mead setup…what a guy…pilots are awesome! We stick together

Dan Gervae · May 21, 2022

I got busy at work and also have been waiting for streamlined tubing for some time now. I got the floats painted…a quick scuff and coat and added some striping. I got the hydraulics fired up and have cycled the gear numerous times. I was telling a buddy that I’ve been waiting for my tubing to come and he asked what size? I said 3”…he says, “I have a bunch of that in my garage”! So, he drops off 18’ of it. Lol. Anyhow. Almost ready to hang the plane and build my rigging. Here are a few pics for an update.

skywagon8a · May 21, 2022

Dan Gervae said:
View attachment 61184

Pay attention for any condensation buildup in this compartment. Moisture and electric components don't mix. EDO's 2700 amphib floats had electric motors in the floats to operate the landing gear. There were so many issues of motor failures that they changed to hydraulics. Thus the new model 2705 for the same floats. Ben Wiplinger developed a conversion kit which eliminated the electrics changing to hydraulic.

A friend had a set of EDO electric floats on his 180 which gave him troubles. One time he had to land in a strange pond after dark with car lights around the pond in Ft. St.John BC because the gear wouldn't go down.

Mead 1430 Amphibs on 11-EX

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Upper Peninsula of Michigan

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Upper Peninsula of Michigan

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Upper Peninsula of Michigan

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