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Experimental Cubs & Extreme Stol Devices, Flaps,slats,sl

Here we are in 2007. I linked-in to this thread from the "flap rigged to adjust aileron" thread and I thought I'd make a comment to revive this thread on STOL and High-Lift devices.

Took delivery yesterday of a set of Waynes' leading edge slats. I was surprised when I unpacked the box at the light weight. This new project they're going on is really getting me excited now.

I suppose I'll be commenting greater in the next few weeks as covering commences and then as the project wraps up.

P.S. Mod-12 replica with squared-extended wings, adjustable droopy ails., slats, aileron-coupled spoilers for roll-authority, extended span flaps and ailerons, adjustable wing incidence(up to 4 deg), bigger elevators, bigger fin and rudder, greater pitch-trim range (more jackscrew range).

P.P.S. 230HP


Dave,

Adjustable wing incidence? Similar to Lil Cub? Photos?

thank you,

Jonny
 
JohnnyO. the incidence is ground adjustable. It was set to 4 degrees and there was no reaon to go back to less.

Photos of it are scattered thru my photos on this site.

Airplane finished up pretty heavy, but with the big incidence, slat, and droop ailerons it flew great even at 2450 pounds gross.

Not a ripper off the ground or as short a lander as it would be at a more normal weight, but very cool and easy to fly.

After about 30 hours in it I didnt bother with selecting no droop ailerons, even in 18 mph crosswinds.

with the roll spoilers it had great roll authority.
 
Glad it's working so well for you Dave!

On that wing there doesn't appear to be a need for droop ailerons due mainly to the spoilers and not the cuff but what part does the increased incidence play? I understand it is a system and probably hard to determine but without the cuff would you still keep the incidence and no droops?
 
more thinking out loud.....

  • so If you had this inflight incidence changeable easily(twist stays constant), I was worried how to keep it in sync/same on each wing... But then It dawned on me, maybe thats NOT what you would want, maybe you would want some differential control of each wing's incidence(maybe not whole possible incidence travel)using the stick(side to side), and then would this allow you to do away with the ailerons(and all associated parts and weight(flaps too??)) or make them smaller/lighter????
  • would you need flaps if whole wing could greatly change incidence so easily?(now redundant system??) or maybe full length flaps?(if no Ailerons)
  • if it would work, think of all the small parts(weight) it would eliminate, or at least help offset the weight penalty for the incidence changing system....
  • how "strong" does this adjuster need to be?? the current weakest link is the spar attach fitting on wing is where that bolt goes through, thats where they always break... it never breaks the -5 bolt, maybe gives it a bow once in a while after you rip wing off in a wreck, but thats not a normal load.....


Mike,

Which is the weakest link? The spar attach fitting at the fuselage or at the lift strut?

thanks,

Jonny
 
Glad it's working so well for you Dave!

On that wing there doesn't appear to be a need for droop ailerons due mainly to the spoilers and not the cuff but what part does the increased incidence play? I understand it is a system and probably hard to determine but without the cuff would you still keep the incidence and no droops?

Am not sure exactly what you are stating in your first sentence. could yu word it differently?

I am stating that I select droop ailerons for all regimes where flaps are deployed. Droops are 20 degrees max. I love the droops since the spoilers augment roll authority so well.

I would recommend increased wing incidence for any Cub that wants to land slow and takeoff short and see over the nose on short slow final approach

This aircraft has a mew owner. I see it flown without droops selected for takeoff amd landing. Oh what a crying shame!!
 
Maybe you didn't understand but you answered my question anyway. I'm doing 8 degree droops and it's nice to have advice from someone who endorses them.

What are you building next?
 
8 degrees of droop will be nice, and roll authority may be just fine, especially if your feet are not lame. Roll spoilers like the Helio "lift interrupters" are the great equalizer with aileron droop in the 20 degree max range, I have found.

My next build needs to be a decent size home shop so I can get to working on something after dinner in the winters without heading back to the airport.

Probably a certed -18 next, for meself. .......have two frames and a ton of wing parts, tailfeathers and gear. Some parts are even new!! Like it to be 180 HP and basic ac for low weight, speed of assembly, and low cost!

Thanks fer askin'
 
In 2016 I built the shop part of my hanger at ID5...hydronic heated and 80' from the house if I ever get around to building it. Current house is on the market with a 2300 sf shop also heated in the floor...only way to go!! With any luck at all I'll end up with close to 180 hp in the LSA. It's a 160 hp 0-320 so I hope the throttle body and better ignition and exhust will add a bit...we'll see but it should be strong.
 
Have read read this thread multiple times. There is so much rich stuff such as the post below, that it alone is well worth reviving.





Peaple'
Its been kind of quiet here lately so i'm going to bring up a problem in slow flight that
few is anyone thinks about. When ever we what to show our stuff and demo our
slow flight capibilitys we pull every thing we can out of our plane to lighten the load.
On take off this is all good due to accellerating a weight to flight speed. This is not
allways true for slow flight ones in the air. Many of the striped out planes out there
are nose heavy when real light. I know this dosn't sound right at first but give it some
though. take a yard stick and tape a axle to it at the one ft mark and take two
blocks put on a scales with the axle across. Tape 10 oz. to the short end and 5 oz.
at the far end. It balances. Now move the axle to the 14" mark. The short end with
the 10 oz. falls. If you push down on the 5 oz. end look what happens to the scales.
The weight reading goes up. This is like your plane, if you iare using a lot of pressure
to hold up your nose your wing is like the axle point. You are increasing the wing load.
Your wing is trying to carry more than needed. If a small amont of weight is in the
aft bagage but still in CG. it will reduce the wing loading more than enough to make up
for the weight added in the bagage. The plane will handle better on aproach and
on the ground you can get on the brakes with out nosing over. Don't worry about
take off, after you get it parked where you want it you can throw out the rocks.
Wayne
 
Have read read this thread multiple times. There is so much rich stuff such as the post below, that it alone is well worth reviving.

my stepfather always told of Denny Thompson and his Maule... he would alway load a 5 gallon pail of nice state runway gravel off the side, and throw it in the rear of the baggage if empty, then dump it out on whatever remote strip he was landing at, and going to load up whatever... helped improve the remote strips too...
 
Mike.
About anything Denny Thompson ever did with a Maule or a Cub was worth paying attention to. He had an approach
to landing; that would net you less forward momentum, than any other type. We used to refer to it as "helicoptering" a Cub. Lots of guys tryed to imitate Dennys
technique, with very few true impersonations....... Fellow
pilots used to comment " Denny could land shorter with NO brakes than most of us could WITH brakes! ( low preasure in those days)
Denny was the master craftsman in a PA-18. Sorta like Bob Hover , maybe one guy out of thousands; Would ever have their natural talent, for "top of the class"airmanship.
 
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