DHC-2 Ownership Cost

[SJ]

I'm curious from folks here what the cost of ownership of a wheel equipped radial DHC-2 might be. I've checked on insurance, hangar, and of course fuel flow, but am wondering about annuals, AD's, etc and what one might expect. I note that Kenmore gets $750 per hour for dual instruction, but they also get $375 for dual in a cub.

No, I have not lost my mind YET.

sj

P.S. the Beaver is Laura's favorite airplane, and her birthday is coming up... :-)

[RaisedByWolves]

Seems hard to find a decent one. I have a friend looking. They are workhorses and it shows.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[C130jake]

I'm curious from folks here what the cost of ownership of a wheel equipped radial DHC-2 might be. I've checked on insurance, hangar, and of course fuel flow, but am wondering about annuals, AD's, etc and what one might expect. I note that Kenmore gets $750 per hour for dual instruction, but they also get $375 for dual in a cub.

No, I have not lost my mind YET.

sj

P.S. the Beaver is Laura's favorite airplane, and her birthday is coming up... :-)

I have a buddy that had one til last year, I can put you in touch. It was on amphibs. Great flying machine.

Jake


Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=93960)

[cubdriver2]

I'm curious from folks here what the cost of ownership of a wheel equipped radial DHC-2 might be. I've checked on insurance, hangar, and of course fuel flow, but am wondering about annuals, AD's, etc and what one might expect. I note that Kenmore gets $750 per hour for dual instruction, but they also get $375 for dual in a cub.

No, I have not lost my mind YET.

sj

P.S. the Beaver is Laura's favorite airplane, and her birthday is coming up... :-)

Just do it. You'll be as old as Timmy before you know it

Glenn

[cubdriver2]

I think Algonquin works on Matt's

Glenn

[mvivion]

I worked a Beaver for several years in Kodiak. It was on amphibious floats. Actually, the floats were the vast majority of maintenance on that plane. The P and W 985 is a great engine, with proper pilot technique. Consistent and thorough warm up and respect of limits is key to keeping that engine happy. Kenmore long ago significantly increased their average time between overhaul by mandating warm ups.
otherwise very reliable engines. Some use a bit of oil, but I’ve flown really tight ones.

The airframe is arguably one of the toughest, most durable ever built. There’s a reason that lots of Alaska coastal air taxi operators went to Cessna 206s, but many have now gone back to Beavers. Load haulers, but they tolerate the work much better.

Consider the average total time of virtually all Beavers.....the one I flew was “low time” when I flew it, at 7000 hours or so. That was in the 80s. It was sold then and went to an air taxi. It’s still flying air taxi in Kodiak....a year round gig, btw.

Theyre tough in other words. I was devastated when management replaced that Beaver with a new 206.

MTV

[aktango58]

Seems hard to find a decent one. I have a friend looking. They are workhorses and it shows.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I know where there is a really good one, Birdcage and all front off and replaced less than 100 hours ago, all new paint also I believe, but a great shop.

Cost: 1,500 hour engine costs 50k. AD on the crank requires tear down.

30 gallons an hour is what I flight planned for.

5 year AD on the tail.

Plan on cost to maintain around 10% of the value, or in the 30-40k per year. That includes bird cage inspections and all the stuff that keeps them up.

Prices seem down on Barnstormers. I will be glad to check you guys out on them.

[Paul Heinrich]

I owned N1966B for about 15 years. It was my first airplane and I loved everything about it. I bought it from Desert Locust in Kenya. Apparently Hangar 9 thought it was a real beauty, too, and they honored it by making an exact copy of it for their RC model line.

As prices of new 2-seat rag wings climb towards $400,000 I often wonder why more of us don’t buy and fly Beavers instead.

http://www.dhc-2.com/id610.htm

https://www.horizonhobby.com/product/dhc-2-beaver-30cc-arf-110/HAN4545.html

[SJ]

Great input, folks! Keep it coming!

sj

[Troy Hamon]

No idea how much annuals cost, but they are sure fantastic airplanes to operate.

[Paul Heinrich]

Like all airplanes, the expense of annuals depend on how well the plane has been maintained. Spares are readily available through Viking Air in B.C. and Kenmore in Seattle, WA. P&W 985s likewise are well supported.

Kenmore builds new EDO 4930s and all its component parts.

Both Viking and Kenmore rebuild Beavers from the ground up.

I can’t imagine that annuals would cost more than for a 206 or 185.

[dgapilot]

Never maintained a Beaver, but had a Howard DGA-15 for quite a while. There are only a couple ADs on the R985, one on cylinder cracks, one for loose cylinder nuts/studs, and one for crankshaft counterweight bushings. Figure engine overhaul at 1200 hours (the crank bushings require 1600 hrs). P&W parts for the most part are less expensive that Lycoming parts. Engine accessories are more expensive.

On the Howard, I figured 60 hours for the annual. Repairs were extra. Seemed like every other year I need at least one part that cost over a grand, in between years nothing but normal servicing. Spark plugs I would run 200 hours between servicing, change the fronts every other 100 hrs, and the backs on the opposite 100 hour. Kept 9 spares so I’d have them cleaned and ready to go. My engine burned about 3/4 quart of oil an hour. If it sat more than about 10 days, the snot box would overflow and run all over (snot box=sump drain 1 gallon can). I changed oil every 50 hours, had an Airwolf external filter. Oil tank was 8 gallons. Mine had automatic mixture control and I would run about 17.5 gph at 1850 rpm and 25 or 26” MAP. Most guys find 20-24 gph is normal.

Hope that helps.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mam90]

Like a guy told me once “the bigger the dog, the more it eats”. However, life is short SJ, so I’d say go for it. When I was about 19, I bought a Cub I couldn’t afford. Flew it for a year and sold it. It was a great year!

[BC12D-4-85]

Best airplane ever. Don't miss an opportunity to own one.

Gary

[Paul Heinrich]

For me at least the 2-3 128 gallon fill-ups needed to get up to and back from my Canadian fishing hole started to be painful once AvGas started climbing above $2.50/gal.

The 6 walleye filets per trip ultimately no longer justified having a half million dollar asset sitting around in the hangar.

It’s kind of funny: I used to go hunting in Alaska twice a year. I bought the Beaver so I could explore and hunt without the expense of hiring an air taxi service to haul me around. But after I bought the airplane I never returned; I was too busy paying for the airplane, then the hangar, then the 12, then the wife, the 2 kids, etc., etc., etc.

[Utah-Jay]

I'm curious from folks here what the cost of ownership of a wheel equipped radial DHC-2 might be. I've checked on insurance, hangar, and of course fuel flow, but am wondering about annuals, AD's, etc and what one might expect. I note that Kenmore gets $750 per hour for dual instruction, but they also get $375 for dual in a cub.

No, I have not lost my mind YET.

sj

P.S. the Beaver is Laura's favorite airplane, and her birthday is coming up... :-)

I’m sure she won’t see this :)

[cafi19]

I’m sure she won’t see this :)

Oh whatever! :-)

It has been a dream since I first saw one! I am definitely a bad influence. Had a chance to buy a $59K project a long time ago and didn't have the money then. Would have sold my sole to own a small interest. Now it is a possibility. Scary and super exciting. I figure we wont have a long love affair (me and the plane....as you can tell....sj is a keeper just for thinking of this) but what fun it could be!!!

cafi

[algonquin]

I do all the maintenance on a Beaver and love working on it. Also flying it is truly a treat. What is hurting the price is the AD’s the feds have come up with. Many beavers have 15,000 to 30,000 hours and range from wheels only to salt water float ops. The AD’s don’t take any of that into consideration.
The tail is every other year, the bird cage is 15 yrs then every five etc. also the elevator control rod needs to be changed and reinspected.
now here is the real kicker.... the turbine MK III is the beaver to own. PM me if I can help you with this stuff, I’ll do my best.

[Dirt911]

If you gave that airplane to your wife, you’re setting yourself up for years of adolescent (in other words pilot) jokes.

definitely the coolest airplane to fly though

[mvivion]

Ummm, just as a point, I’ve never run a 985 in cruise at more than 22 gph, leaned out. And that’s loaded and on floats.

FWIW.

MTV

[1934A]

Can we look forward to beaver.org, or is that name already taken...?��

[BC12D-4-85]

Here's some experienced Beaver discussion from a great bush flying website. Cruise though their Bush Flying pages for more. It's been 44 yrs since I flew one for a summer but I recall it well:

http://www.avcanada.ca/forums2/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=55513

Gary

[FdxLou]

SJ
Just ask Gary D.
Lou

[KevinJ]

Just to clarify, is Laura’s dream a wet Beaver or a dry Beaver? From my limited understanding, acquisition, maintenance, etc is substantially more on a wet Beaver. Personally, I’d be looking for a wet Beaver. Guessing there aren’t many in Arkansas to look at? SJ may have his work cut out on this Beaver hunt.

[skukum12]

KevinJ, grow up.

[aktango58]

Working 135 world, I flight plan 30 gallons an hour.

Book says 5 gallons for taxi, take off and climb... believe it! Training will be 30 I bet, as you are on power for take off lots.

Warm the engine, be smooth and observe redline. That is the best advice for keeping costs down.

[Olibuilt]

Located in Quebec, Canada, Air Tunilik has a few for sale.

http://www.airtunilik.com/our-planes (http://://www.airtunilik.com/our-planes)

[Steve Pierce]

Kenmore long ago significantly increased their average time between overhaul by mandating warm ups.

SJ, take note. ;)

[SJ]

SJ
Just ask Gary D.
Lou

I asked hiim first... :)

sj

[kevinmax]

And give Tulsa aircraft engines a call to understand just how much an overhaul would cost if it came to that. Either due to timing out from the crank AD, or something goes wrong inside.

They're popular among pacific northwest operators when kenmore is too booked up. Had ours done there a few years back. Great work, but not cheap.

Kevin
510PW


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[CenterHillAg]

Talk to Younkin about the 985 too. After flying behind engines from a handful of the shops, I’ll take a Younkin any day of the week. I’ve never flown a Beaver but have a couple thousand hrs sitting behind 1340’s and 985’s on AgCats, and the 985 is by far my favorite of the 2. It’s just a well designed, reliable engine that still doesn’t have much competition in its class. I currently have a 1300 hr engine on my backup plane that’s still running great, burns 1 gal/8 hrs of oil. I usually warm up for 30 mins minimum, 45+ on a cool day, and 20 min cooldown at the end of the day. Running them hard and adding 50 rpm to any power setting kept pressure out of the heads and running smoother, 31”/2150 initially, 30”/2050 once the load was light, 29”/1950 heading back to the strip. I limited myself to 35” on takeoff, I can count on one hand the amount of times I needed 36.5”, and it was always my fault for overloading. Keep the mags dry or you’re in for a long dryout and warmup. Beware of cylinders with Tulsa’s “barrel reconditioning,” they’re gonna pop. Don’t touch any engine controls until you’ve made the runway if a jug pops, it’ll keep running and get you home. I’m not sure if you can see the cylinder heads on a Beaver, but watch for them twitching if you can, any time I saw the engine twitch while flying I knew something was happening, either mag issues or a jug about to pop.

I’ve went on way too long, but I’ll always love the 985. Unfortunately the economics of maintaining them correctly will make their commercial use continue to drop, 2 years into running a PT6 and I’ll never go back.

[Paul Heinrich]

54656

[cafi19]

Just to clarify, is Laura’s dream a wet Beaver or a dry Beaver? From my limited understanding, acquisition, maintenance, etc is substantially more on a wet Beaver. Personally, I’d be looking for a wet Beaver. Guessing there aren’t many in Arkansas to look at? SJ may have his work cut out on this Beaver hunt.

She isn't picky. I just love that big ol' radial engine and the sound of it. Sure I would love a beaver on floats. Although Beaver Lake (no kidding) is just down the road from here....we would need amphibs to get to it. Now you are talking a much bigger nut that we want to crack....I think.

[Utah-Jay]

She isn't picky. I just love that big ol' radial engine and the sound of it. Sure I would love a beaver on floats. Although Beaver Lake (no kidding) is just down the road from here....we would need amphibs to get to it. Now you are talking a much bigger nut that we want to crack....I think.
It’s your birthday, get amphibious :)

[skywagon8a]

Look at several models of the Stinson Reliant. They would be less expensive than a Beaver, yet give the same appearance and sounds. Roomy and comfortable to fly. I had a 1933 Stinson SR, used to call it my mini-Beaver. :???:

[BC12D-4-85]

https://alaskaslist.com/1/posts/10_Transportation/59_Aircraft/596140_Dehaviland_DHC_2_MK_1_Beaver.html Belonged to a remote property neighbor until a few years back.

Gary

[algonquin]

The reason I said the Turbine was the plane was almost no maintained for pvt. use Beaver and the factoryTurbineis a MKIII which is exempt from some of the very expensive AD’s. The resale is also way better, they are going up every year. The Barron kit changes the angle of incidence on the wings and tail , big difference in slow flight.

[mvivion]

Talk to Younkin about the 985 too. After flying behind engines from a handful of the shops, I’ll take a Younkin any day of the week. I’ve never flown a Beaver but have a couple thousand hrs sitting behind 1340’s and 985’s on AgCats, and the 985 is by far my favorite of the 2. It’s just a well designed, reliable engine that still doesn’t have much competition in its class. I currently have a 1300 hr engine on my backup plane that’s still running great, burns 1 gal/8 hrs of oil. I usually warm up for 30 mins minimum, 45+ on a cool day, and 20 min cooldown at the end of the day. Running them hard and adding 50 rpm to any power setting kept pressure out of the heads and running smoother, 31”/2150 initially, 30”/2050 once the load was light, 29”/1950 heading back to the strip. I limited myself to 35” on takeoff, I can count on one hand the amount of times I needed 36.5”, and it was always my fault for overloading. Keep the mags dry or you’re in for a long dryout and warmup. Beware of cylinders with Tulsa’s “barrel reconditioning,” they’re gonna pop. Don’t touch any engine controls until you’ve made the runway if a jug pops, it’ll keep running and get you home. I’m not sure if you can see the cylinder heads on a Beaver, but watch for them twitching if you can, any time I saw the engine twitch while flying I knew something was happening, either mag issues or a jug about to pop.

I’ve went on way too long, but I’ll always love the 985. Unfortunately the economics of maintaining them correctly will make their commercial use continue to drop, 2 years into running a PT6 and I’ll never go back.

Just reminded me of having mag blocks in my oven in Kodiak, on the phone talking to our old Chief of Maintenance, asking if he really thought this was a good idea..... His response: Well, you’re doing it the way I told you to, right?

Flying fine next day. He sent me a waterproof “Bra” that covered the gap between the cowl and the boot cowl. No more wet mags. Look at the line of Cessna 190/195s at Oshkosh....same device.

Agree on power settings. Same COM told me when I was checking out in the Beaver: “If you’re looking at trees in the TOP of the windscreen, I’d better find knuckle prints in the windshield as we look at the wreck. But if you don’t wreck, then you call me and we’ll decide what to do. I pulled a bunch once, called him the next day, while my underwear was in the wash.

MTV

MTV

[aktango58]

Look at several models of the Stinson Reliant. They would be less expensive than a Beaver, yet give the same appearance and sounds. Roomy and comfortable to fly. I had a 1933 Stinson SR, used to call it my mini-Beaver. :???:


http://www.seaplanesnorth.com/1933-stinson-jr-sr/

That one will cost less than a couple years insurance on the Beaver!!

MTV- Spot on with the power advice. I have always been taught to cruise at the 8s or 9s, (28/18; 29/19) depending on load. Keep it under red for take-off and bring prop/throttle back together to reduce vibration and internal issues.

Of course, then the mechanics always tell you that if something is in the way, make sure the throttle is bent forward before you hit, but let them know if you don't hit so they can check the cylinders for separation and torque before the next flight.:???:

Flaps are the important part though. flaps to turn.;-)

[Paul Heinrich]

Wouldn’t it be crazy expensive owning a Turbo Beaver for private use? Don’t turbines cost big money just sitting around doing nothing. Isn’t the fuel burn way more per hour, too?

I suppose if you’re crazy rich....

But if you’re thinking about owning a TB, wouldn’t a turbine otter be a better option? They use the same PT6, but carry twice the load.

[wireweinie]

The REAL turbine Otters have Garrett 331's, lol.

Web

[stewartb]

Beavers are a handful for a private operator. Big and heavy. You need equipment or a crew to handle it. My bro-in-law had one for a while. A nice one, too. Way too much plane for an empty nester private pilot. I always liken my 180 to a Suburban and my Cub to a 4 Runner. A Beaver is like a WW2 deuce and a half. Loud, drafty, smelly, and slow. Not a great choice for date night unless your date is with 6 other big guys.

[DCB]

Don’t listen to the naysayers...a Beaver is just a big Cub! I’ve had the same PA18A for 33 years and operated a 185 for 20 years before trading up to a Beaver 7 years ago. There’s no doubt you’ll burn more gas but you’ll be flying with a big smile the whole time! For me I didn’t need a Beaver as much as I just wanted one...and I don’t need to justify my choice. Make sure you get a good one as there’s definitely some out there that have had a hard life. Hard to believe but I think the Beaver is lighter on the controls than the Cub, and almost as capable in tight spots. The biggest difference I find is the Beaver is more like a truck where the Cub is a motorcycle with wings. Good luck with your search...it’s only money!

[kevinmax]

Don’t listen to the naysayers...a Beaver is just a big Cub! I’ve had the same PA18A for 33 years and operated a 185 for 20 years before trading up to a Beaver 7 years ago. There’s no doubt you’ll burn more gas but you’ll be flying with a big smile the whole time! For me I didn’t need a Beaver as much as I just wanted one...and I don’t need to justify my choice. Make sure you get a good one as there’s definitely some out there that have had a hard life. Hard to believe but I think the Beaver is lighter on the controls than the Cub, and almost as capable in tight spots. The biggest difference I find is the Beaver is more like a truck where the Cub is a motorcycle with wings. Good luck with your search...it’s only money!

^^^^^ This!

We had a Briggs powered "Power Tow" at home base, KRNT, and a Bogert tow bar in the plane. Whenever we were at an away airport, there was ALWAYS an admirer that was happy to help push on a strut while I steered the T/W. Not that hard to move.

They attract attention like no other plane I can think of. Lots of thumbs up from the corporate jet pilots as we taxied by.

Kevin
510PW


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[stewartb]

almost as capable in tight spots

:roll:

[BC12D-4-85]

Even with my less than 500 hr experience I could put a Beaver on/in any spot I could a later C-185 with we'll over 10x the time. They are that good when properly equipped and the pilot aware. It's an amazing aircraft.

Gary

[petey451]

Beavers are cool

[SJ]

Really appreciating all the input folks. I'm buried with other things so I am largely letting Laura do all the research. We have recieved a lot of great additional info on specifc planes by email, facebook, pm, etc.

I find it fascinating that it has never really "come up" much before that so many of you have owned or operated Beavers.

sj

[supercrow]

Even with my less than 500 hr experience I could put a Beaver on/in any spot I could a later C-185 with we'll over 10x the time. They are that good when properly equipped and the pilot aware. It's an amazing aircraft.

GaryIn the mid seventies, I watched Charlie Coe ( Great pilot for Folsom's in Greenville Me) take 14 young boy scouts ( probably 100lb average weight) and two 18 ft cedar and canvas canoes out of Bear Pond (Rainbow twp) in north central me. I was in the pond with my old 39 j-3 fishing. The pond is deep, oblong in shape, and about 18 hundred ft. Only about 1500 is usable because of rocks and the tree line at that time was about 30ft. high at the lowest end where he went out. It wasn't even a challenge. He used about a third of it to break water and made it look easy. At the Greenville competitions I have seen him get it out of the water with a super cub easily.

[TurboBeaver]

StewB,
I commonly used to haul 3 passengers out of the old backwater where Upper Talarik runs into Lake Illamna, with Valhalla Lodges Kenmore Beaver.(1981/87)
If it was too rough to land in big lake. It was measured 700'........... Try that with your Cub.... Course it's about dryed up there nowadays.LoL.

[WWhunter]

Not meaning to get this thread off track, but how does the Noorduyn Norseman compare to the Beaver? Fabric verse metal of course, but a brute of a plane that has a big BA sounding radial also. One in Park Rapids, but rarely see it flown.

[mvivion]

Not meaning to get this thread off track, but how does the Noorduyn Norseman compare to the Beaver? Fabric verse metal of course, but a brute of a plane that has a big BA sounding radial also. One in Park Rapids, but rarely see it flown.

A fairer comparison for the Norseman would be the Otter. They’re both larger than the Beaver, and much larger engines.

MTV

[mvivion]

Short field? A Beaver?


https://youtu.be/qvwnkjZAjHo

[SJ]

Short field? A Beaver?



https://youtu.be/qvwnkjZAjHo

Laura flew in that plane when Russ owned it.

sj

[MTBR12]

I vote for this one.
http://www.seaplanesnorth.com/1957-dehavilland-dhc-2-beaver/

[SJ]

I vote for this one.
http://www.seaplanesnorth.com/1957-dehavilland-dhc-2-beaver/

Already sold

[MTBR12]

If they are good, they’re gone��

[reliableflyer]

Even with my less than 500 hr experience I could put a Beaver on/in any spot I could a later C-185 with we'll over 10x the time. They are that good when properly equipped and the pilot aware. It's an amazing aircraft.

Gary

I flew Beavers for lodges years ago. At one lodge we operated periodically out of Shannons pond in Dillingham, about 1500 feet long as I recall. One operator would haul only one or two guests with luggage with a 185. With the Beavers we would regularly haul at full gross weight. They are very different planes for different purposes.

[BC12D-4-85]

I went into Shannon's a few times with a C-185 but well loaded @ ~3600+ preferred Aleknagik Lake. My Beaver experience was limited and consisted of mainly heavy Dehavilland wheel skis and 4930 floats @ ~5100. I flew some on tires and was pleased with the full flap ~65 approach and landing on bar strips. Plain wing - stalls were real. Now there's all manner of wing mods I see locally.

An earlier POH with some performance charts: https://washingtonseaplanepilots.org/resources/Seaplane%20POHs/DHC-2-Beaver-POH.pdf

Gary

[L18C-95]

A Broussard is a nice mil-spec DHC-2 substitute

https://www.planecheck.com?ent=da&id=48515


Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org

[L18C-95]

54674

A nice DHC-2 UK resident


Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=93960)

[cubdriver2]

A Broussard is a nice mil-spec DHC-2 substitute

https://www.planecheck.com?ent=da&id=48515


Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org

I think they come with a wine rack

Glenn

[BC12D-4-85]

I think they come with a wine rack

Glenn And a cheese tray for snax

Tyler Cook owned one locally for a few years. Not sure but I heard the FAA liked to do periodic drive-bys as it was licensed in a weird category - exhibition something? Anyhow it eventually disappeared south along with the owner.

Gary

[peterdillon]

The AD's are the biggest cost and pain on the Beaver. Viking has the TC and when they are slow they soon dream up a few more. In their defence there are many high time salt water Beavers and some bush ones that haven't had much maintenance over the years. Some AD's are quite expensive. In the about 10 years we have had ours the main cost is in AD's. The Canadian regs have about 4 times as many AD's. The US didn't adopt many of them so much better id US registered. We burn around the 22 gal in cruise which doesn't sound bad but it takes more than 5 gals to warm her up on a cool day. Ours is on the big Aerocet about 20 knots slower than a 185 or 206 on floats so fine on short flights but something to consider if your going long haul. Ours just turned over 4000 hours and other than a carb heat gauge we haven't put a thing on it other than normal maintenance since we got it. You really need someone that is very familiar with Beavers to do a pre-buy if your looking at one. There are many things to check that a Cessna or Cub guy would never find that are 10's of thousand to fix. Take your time and find a really good one. They are out there for sure just not advertised. They are kind of an old mans airplane as everything happens in slow motion. Engine management is the only learning curve as nothing the same as an opposed engine.
The Norseman is kind of the opposite. Almost no AD's and no new ones as not many in the air to create them. Flies lot like an overloaded 185 and just as fast. Approach speeds are 90-100 compared to 70 in the Beaver. The ultimate for hauling boats. Other than a bit slower hardly any opposite rudder with a 16ft Lund. Boats are latched from the float to the steel wing struts which keeps the boat out of the slipstream. Good manners on the water so okay for private use. Just as loud on the inside as the outside.
While the Beaver is a wonderful plane to fly in a lot of ways the Norseman is much cheaper to buy and own for private guys and will haul a load a Beaver wouldn't dream of. For the same money I would buy a primo Norseman long before I bought a bagged out Beaver. 5473754738

[skywagon8a]

A Noorsman is a lot more classy than a Beaver.

[SJ]

Norseman even harder to find than a Beaver!

sj

[skywagon8a]

Norseman even harder to find than a Beaver!

sj
Look in Red Lake Ontario, the Noorsman capitol of the World.
I still say any model of the Stinson Reliant would give the same thrill for less cost. Remember many of those old airplanes are out of the FAA's line of sight, so AD notes don't show up.

[SJ]

Look in Red Lake Ontario, the Noorsman capitol of the World.
I still say any model of the Stinson Reliant would give the same thrill for less cost. Remember many of those old airplanes are out of the FAA's line of sight, so AD notes don't show up.

Just say'n the lady wants a Beaver... likely no substitue will qualify :)

sj

[algonquin]

Just watched the video of the short field landing, our Beaver with the Barron 3000 kit and turbine slows to 42 kts on short final and when pulled into beta just stops. Never measured it but short. T/o when light it leaves the ground before you get to Take off thrust. Amazing aircraft, I often wonder if the bigger company’s didn’t have a hand in some of the over the edge AD’s to eliminate some of the competition in the commercial markets. It’s hard on operators to take a bird off line in season to do AD’s.

[wireweinie]

I've had several old guys tell me that the horsepower from the turbine conversions on -2s and -3s should have been there all along. It was just not available, for the weight, from the piston engines at the time.

Web

[algonquin]

Our’s is a MK 3 , with a -20, everybody wants a -27 or 34 engine for even more hp but for my boss it’s a play airplane and perfect. The stretched fuselage is a game changer with the changed angle of incident on the wings and tail and cuff on the wings. It flys so rock stable under 50 Kts. Makes short field landings a breeze.

[algonquin]

Oh, forgot to mention ours is a MK3 factory Turbine not a conversion. I think it was the second to last one made.this changes things for some of the bigger maintenance items for the good.

[Paul Heinrich]

I been told that the original PT6 was a dog, especially on hot and high days. Rumor has it they wouldn’t even get off the water before hitting the redline temperatures. Even the -20 upgrade suffered the same problem.

The choices now are -27 and -135, I think. Those are the same power plants that Vazar, Viking, and Kenmore use to turbine an Otter.

I strongly believe that a piston Beaver on EDO 4930s and powered by a 985 was and remains the best all-around airplane for remote camping, hunting, and fishing, either alone or with your pals. A Beaver on floats is no problem whatsoever for one person to manage in the air or on the water.

As I pointed out, as prices climb on 2 seat ragwings, Beaver ownership and operation by a private owner starts to make more sense. On the plus side, you can share your secret fishing hole with 3-4 of your friends with all their gear (and the hundies in their wallets to share the cost of fuel) all in one trip.

I bought mine from Desert Locust for $110,000. That, a paint job and a Kenmore interior put me behind the yoke for under $150,000. The bank returned my collateral 3 months into the loan after they appraised it at $435,000, which I then used to buy the floats. In effect the bank financed it and my first PA12 100%. It was the best investment I ever made and owning 66B were the best years of my life.

I’m thankful I bought it in my mid-30s. Had I waited until I turned 50 or retired I never would have been able to buy or enjoy it given my health problems.

So SJ, pull the trigger and don’t look back if it will make you and your bride happy. I never heard anyone say they regretted owning a piston Beaver.

[Paul Heinrich]

Were I in the market today, the first thing I would do would be to send a personal, hand written card to Harrison Ford and politely inquire if he would like to liquidate some or one of his toys that see little use or if he knows one that might be for sale.

It can’t hurt to ask. The only dumb questions are those that aren’t asked.

[mvivion]

The Beaver I flew in Kodiak was sold by the government at auction in 1985-ish for $22,400 on Bristol 4580 amphibious floats. All operating mechanisms in the floats had been replaced the winter before. Plane was basically original stock civilian model. Engine had a cracked accessory case, which id been flying with for some time. Buyer flew it to Kenmore and traded floats for 4930s an overhauled engine. Prop was like new. He then leased it out for years. He told me once that plane made him a LOT of money.

Back then, everybody was buying shiny new Cessna 206s, and Beavers were cheap.

Plane is now back in Kodiak, working for a living, as always.

MTV

[TurboBeaver]

If you just wants ride around behind a round engine the Norseman might be a consideration? But there is a dam good reason you won't see one in Shannon's Pd or Slop Bucket Lake....... I am guessing your looking for a " Big Cub" sorta airplane. The Beaver will scratch that itch. A good lite one on 4930's with the big Ag Blade is at the top
Of the heap in STOL floatplanes. If you simply want to ride behind a round engine buy a Cessna 195? It's not STOL but it is Cool........
Having flown lots of different Beavers, there are dogs, there are good ones on the wrong floats and props, there
are good ones, and there are " really good ones". If you think you have a crush on your Cub, get behind an R985
In a lite Kenmore Beaver, and you will have a true love affair with an airplane! Lol.
Rumor has it SAS in Talkettna is selling theirs.......
(Sheldon's old outfit). Might wanta check it out.
Good Luck!
E

[BC12D-4-85]

https://alaskaslist.com/1/posts/10_Transportation/59_Aircraft/596140_Dehaviland_DHC_2_MK_1_Beaver.html...

Previous owner had it restored. Very nice.

Gary

[skywagon8a]

https://alaskaslist.com/1/posts/10_Transportation/59_Aircraft/596140_Dehaviland_DHC_2_MK_1_Beaver.html...

Previous owner had it restored. Very nice.

Gary
1500 hours on the engine. Add the cost of an overhaul.

[aktango58]

https://alaskaslist.com/1/posts/10_Transportation/59_Aircraft/596140_Dehaviland_DHC_2_MK_1_Beaver.html...

Previous owner had it restored. Very nice.

Gary

How long since that rebuild???

Not being critical, but ski flying can be brutal on an airframe. Worth looking at, but the price is actually more in the $370,000 range because the engine will get swapped once it arrives home.

I totally understand the desire for a specific plane. Right now is a GREAT time to buy a beaver in the market. Alaska companies are struggling. Some got loans and such last year and held on, even improved their fleet. Now they are asking what will happen next year?

The Birdcage AD and service bulletins need to be reviewed before getting serious about a particular plane. Big dollars if they need removed for repair.

I would suggest NOT the big paddle prop. You are not looking at big loads on short lakes, and the paddle props shake like mad coming down in the idle area... not a good thing for instructing.

Alaska Aircraft Sales has an older beaver sitting for sale. Been there for a while, price might be reasonable. No clue on condition.

[mvivion]

Man, I’d take a Hamilton Standard prop with AG 200 blades any day. Get it properly balanced and it’ll hum.....and sing. Only reason Kenmore got the three bladed props approved was to please whiny neighbors.

MTV

[peterdillon]

SJ If Laura drags out her research out and you save your cash till next year we should be ready to let ours go :-)
4150 tt NDH, all the logs, about 200 hrs since $650,000 restoration with mostly factory new parts.



54782

[aktango58]

[QUOTE=peterdillon;799684]SJ If Laura drags out her research out and you save your cash till next year we should be ready to let ours go :-)
4150 tt NDH, all the logs, about 200 hrs since $650,000 restoration with mostly factory new parts.

Looks like a stock nose, and upgraded windows, tip tanks and appears unmolested wing. Alaska Door?

Laura would look FANTASTIC in that front seat. Well, let's be honest, she looks FANTASTIC all the time, but imagine the smile on her face in that pretty plane!

(I imagine SC.ORG memberships are going up in price to help with the fuel bills!)

It's only money.

[SJ]

SJ If Laura drags out her research out and you save your cash till next year we should be ready to let ours go :-)
4150 tt NDH, all the logs, about 200 hrs since $650,000 restoration with mostly factory new parts.



54782

NICE... too nice...

[reliableflyer]

I would flight plan at 25 GPH. Held pretty close unless it was a long flight, not many takeoffs and light. If there are lots of takeoffs or the aircraft is heavy it eats lots of fuel.


I made the mistake one time leaving the landing light in during a long water taxi and the generator wouldn’t handle the load. I didn’t notice the warning light. Drug the battery down and it wouldn’t start. Hand propping a 985 with a three bladed prop on floats is time consuming, embarrassing and no fun. I just recently had my first shoulder replacement.

[kevinmax]

I would flight plan at 25 GPH. Held pretty close unless it was a long flight, not many takeoffs and light. If there are lots of takeoffs or the aircraft is heavy it eats lots of fuel.


^^^^^^^
We found this to be right on for our typical 2-3 hour flights.

Kevin


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[cafi19]

That is a gorgeous plane....but my guess is it will be hard on our budget....or well exceed it. I need to work a lot harder!

You are all awesome. We greatly appreciate your feedback, input and encouragement!

There just aren't that many listed for sale....and if you want wheels....that narrows it much more. The interesting thing is, how do you put a value on these things. There isn't one like another and the tt swings can be huge! How much do you deduct in your planning for a beaver with 30K hours verses 15K. The panels vary greatly...but that is more understandable. The mods, AD status (and the price to bring them current). There is a lot to consider.

I have talked to both Tulsa and Younkin about overhaul costs and timing. Talked to Kenmore about gear. All were super helpful. I'm afraid to dream at this point. It seems impossible to find one that suits our desires (yup...not a needs thing here at all). But if we don't do it now, we never will.

cafi

[BC12D-4-85]

My DHC-2 ride from 1977 (https://www.dhc-2.com/cn357.html) I drive by every day and wish time had stood still. They traded the 4930 floats years ago for some Kenmore mods and engine overhaul. Find a nice one and enjoy the best.

Gary

[StalledOut]

https://alaskaslist.com/-3/posts/10_Transportation/59_Aircraft/596140_Dehaviland_DHC_2_MK_1_Beaver.html

$295K https://alaskaslist.com/adpics/5fc17a0b2703c49885628acfa.jpgon wheels

[cafi19]

Yup....just called on that one. Sounds ok....needs and engine overhaul of course, no tip tanks (which seems like a big deal when it burns so much an hour). He is going to send me some info. We would prefer the yoke on both sides...this has the swing over Anyone have first hand knowledge of this plane?

[behindpropellers]

Yup....just called on that one. Sounds ok....needs and engine overhaul of course, no tip tanks (which seems like a big deal when it burns so much an hour). He is going to send me some info. We would prefer the yoke on both sides...this has the swing over Anyone have first hand knowledge of this plane?

Have you considered becoming an influencer? Lets just say a guy wants to sell his house and buy a beaver to travel around in....

[wireweinie]

She IS an influencer. Just look at the influence she has over SJ.

Web

[cafi19]

Just sayin' I am the lucky one here.

One other question, this plane has the lower air induction. I think there was a compelling reason for preferring the upper one....but now I can't recall what it was. Is it a maintenance thing?

[cubdriver2]

Laura, remember the biblical story of the slave and the lion with the thorn in it's paw? I look forward to my ride ;- )

Glenn

[Troy Hamon]

Just sayin' I am the lucky one here.

One other question, this plane has the lower air induction. I think there was a compelling reason for preferring the upper one....but now I can't recall what it was. Is it a maintenance thing?

There are operators who swear by the upper air induction for float operations on beavers because water spray does not get pushed in there. However, I can tell you that I fly a float-equipped beaver with the lower induction and it works great. So I would not make any decisions about buying a beaver based on the location of that induction scoop, just get the best airplane you can.

[Troy Hamon]

I will also add, have never flown a beaver without the tip tanks. Didn't know they existed. We don't use our tip tanks too often, but it is a huge bonus to have the option to do so.

[mvivion]

Just sayin' I am the lucky one here.

One other question, this plane has the lower air induction. I think there was a compelling reason for preferring the upper one....but now I can't recall what it was. Is it a maintenance thing?

1800 + hours in a Beaver with lower air induction, all in Kodiak, and all on floats....4580 floats, which a lot consider under floated. Never even gave it a thought.

MTV

[DCB]

I have upper induction but don’t think it matters. I had an engine rebuilt a couple years ago by Tulsa and can’t say enough good things - Rex was amazing to deal with and delivered on time and exactly as quoted. I have a couple hundred hours on it and am getting 10 hours to a litre of oil...and it doesn’t leak a drop which is unheard of! Sealand Aviation makes tip tanks so it’s not impossible to retrofit. They are indispensable for long trips.

[cubdriver2]

Yup....just called on that one. Sounds ok....needs and engine overhaul of course, no tip tanks (which seems like a big deal when it burns so much an hour).

Couple 55 gal drums of 100LL in the back and a hand pump for SJ on his birthday

Glenn

[cafi19]

Laura, remember the biblical story of the slave and the lion with the thorn in it's paw? I look forward to my ride ;- )

Glenn

Roar! I know I owe you big Glenn! Felt like I was being shoed like a horse...but I could walk again after that thorn removal!

Have heard good things about Tulsa, and spoke with Rex the other day. He was super helpful and I appreciated his information! Seems the ones in our comfort zone are in need of an overhaul at a miniumum.

Have to look back at some of the ADs. Seems the more questions you ask, the more questions you have. I have started a spread sheet...but honestly, they are all so different from each other...I'm not sure it will help.

cafi

[DCB]

Actually, needing an overhaul makes assessing an aircraft easier - at least you know what you have once it’s done. A word of warning though... the basic engine overhaul can be only part of the cost. I think I spent about the same or more on the re and re costs and all the accessories and miscellaneous costs. So rather than budget $50k for the engine rebuild I would double that number. I never add up receipts when it comes to aircraft...I don’t want to know what my fun costs!

[BC12D-4-85]

Yup....just called on that one. Sounds ok....needs and engine overhaul of course, no tip tanks (which seems like a big deal when it burns so much an hour). He is going to send me some info. We would prefer the yoke on both sides...this has the swing over Anyone have first hand knowledge of this plane?

I've seen it up close pre recent Part 135 ops, and know one of the previous owners "S.T.L." Do an owner history search for 2014: http://www.aviationdb.com/Aviation/AircraftQuery.shtm You might contact him. He has a remote camp near mine but gave up flying a few back.

Gary

[TurboBeaver]

Just heard about one that's nicely tricked out that is going to be for sale very shortly, Whip Amphibians and Federal Wheelskis, big Cargo door, fancy paint. They bought a Caravan��. It's not advertised but I can get you a phone number? PM if interested.
E

[Paul Heinrich]

I don’t think they are in the market for an expensive, tricked out airplane.

My guess is they’re in the low to mid $300s.

[peterdillon]

Just sayin' I am the lucky one here.

One other question, this plane has the lower air induction. I think there was a compelling reason for preferring the upper one....but now I can't recall what it was. Is it a maintenance thing?

Upper induction was a military thing to reduce the dust being sucked into the intake for desert ops. Most if not all military beavers had the tip tanks and extra riveting on the wing and are easier to up-gross. Lower induction is fine as others have stated. I like the look of the upper better but no big deal. Military beavers also had the 2 skylights which can be left in with an STC when converted back to civilian.

[peterdillon]

I have upper induction but don’t think it matters. I had an engine rebuilt a couple years ago by Tulsa and can’t say enough good things - Rex was amazing to deal with and delivered on time and exactly as quoted. I have a couple hundred hours on it and am getting 10 hours to a litre of oil...and it doesn’t leak a drop which is unheard of! Sealand Aviation makes tip tanks so it’s not impossible to retrofit. They are indispensable for long trips.

Same experience with Tulsa engines. First class. On floats we never use our tip tanks as Aerocets have 2 huge compartments on each side so it much easier to grab fuel out of the float and add fuel standing on the float when needed rather than filling the tips but they do work well on wheels. You have about 4 hours fuel without reserve from the mains.

[wireweinie]

Why would you need an STC to leave the skylights in? Are they called out to be removed by some regulation?

Web

[Henny]

The theory, at least as I've been told by more than one person, is that the upper induction is less prone to carb ice because the air runs through the warm engine compartment prior to entering the carb, as opposed to the lower induction air going straight to the carb without any warming effect. Different environments, but I have had much more carb ice with the lower induction in Minnesota than I ever had in Alaska with the upper. On the flip side, I know some high-time Beaver guys that swear there is no difference between the two when it comes to carb ice.

I've used the wing tanks on both floats and wheels quite a bit. As has been said here many times before: "What is the mission?" If you never plan on flying more than a couple hours and gas is readily available, then they are probably not required. If you are headed somewhere remote an hour or two away, you can put whatever you need in the tips, burn the front tank down and then transfer the wings in and land with almost full internals. Transferring up to 43 gallons from the wings is infinitely easier than doing the same from 5 gallon jugs. The problem with tips is that if they are used infrequently, the seals can dry out, and then when you go to use them, they either won't transfer or you can't shut them off.

As far as engine overhauls go, I heard when I was down in Tulsa that Covington is more than likely going to get out of the radial business in the near future. I visited Tulsa Aircraft Engines and talked with Rex, and he assured me they are in for the radial business for the long haul. They have an impressive cylinder graveyard out back...

54856

[peterdillon]

From what I understand skylights were not available on civilian only military so to get back to civil they had to be removed in Canada anyway. There are actually a few things that have to be changed the get them back to civilian.

[aktango58]

Henny beat me to it:

WHAT IS YOUR MISSION???

If your intent is to fly the entire coast of Alaska, now you might be seriously wanting tip tanks. If you plan to fly it down in the lower 48 where the question is not 'where is fuel', but 'where is cheap fuel', you will be just fine without them.

Tips give you more range, agreed. As was stated by Henny, they require to be used to keep them working properly. Also, that is a bunch of weight out on the end of a wing that was not designed for it originally. So if you do short hops, you don't want that weight out there. Pretty standard view is to empty the tips quick so you land with them empty.

Desert Scoop- For salt operations folks preferred the desert (top) scoop to limit salt in the engine. Some say they have less carb ice... but there is a gauge to tell you carb temp, and a handle to adjust to keep it out of ice conditions... another non-issue.

Rule of thumb: Once a 985 makes it though 100 hours after overhaul, you can expect it to run to TBO. For value, figure out the actual cost to overhaul, including accessories, labor, shipping and such, and divide by 1,500, multiply that number by how many hours is remaining. Pretty simple on those engines as it really is a time limited engine.

There was a set of landing gear on Barnstormers recently... and many float beavers have landing gear in the hangar somewhere. It is just parts.

[mvivion]

The theory, at least as I've been told by more than one person, is that the upper induction is less prone to carb ice because the air runs through the warm engine compartment prior to entering the carb, as opposed to the lower induction air going straight to the carb without any warming effect. Different environments, but I have had much more carb ice with the lower induction in Minnesota than I ever had in Alaska with the upper. On the flip side, I know some high-time Beaver guys that swear there is no difference between the two when it comes to carb ice.

I've used the wing tanks on both floats and wheels quite a bit. As has been said here many times before: "What is the mission?" If you never plan on flying more than a couple hours and gas is readily available, then they are probably not required. If you are headed somewhere remote an hour or two away, you can put whatever you need in the tips, burn the front tank down and then transfer the wings in and land with almost full internals. Transferring up to 43 gallons from the wings is infinitely easier than doing the same from 5 gallon jugs. The problem with tips is that if they are used infrequently, the seals can dry out, and then when you go to use them, they either won't transfer or you can't shut them off.

As far as engine overhauls go, I heard when I was down in Tulsa that Covington is more than likely going to get out of the radial business in the near future. I visited Tulsa Aircraft Engines and talked with Rex, and he assured me they are in for the radial business for the long haul. They have an impressive cylinder graveyard out back...

54856

The Flight Manual (which is VERY complete for an aircraft of this vintage) specifies with lower induction to run sufficient carb heat continuously to maintain carb inlet temps above freezing. That’s what I did in Kodiak, never had any carb ice....in what’s arguably carb ice HQ. An air taxi outfit in Kodiak bought a Beaver, and parked it next to our airplane. One day the pilot came over and asked me about use of carb heat. I told him what the Flight Manual said, then asked if he’d read the manual....seems management hadn’t provided him with same. He’d been scaring the **** out of passengers by operating carb heat like you would in a Cessna. That carb heat system REALLY makes some heat, unlike the cabin heater.

Same operator asked me later how my cabin heat was. I relied that it wasn’t super, but worked fine. His response was that he runs full cabin heat on most flights, but only gets a tiny bit of heat from vents. I looked over at their plane and pointed out that their cabin heat system, which is an extension of the exhaust stack and external, was not installed. I vowed never to allow a friend to fly on that air taxi.

MTV

[dgapilot]

I used to run an R985 with an NAR-9C2 carburetor. It has an automatic mixture control. The manual for that airplane also said to run carb heat to maintain something like 32 degrees C. I think they designed it so the carb heat actually gave some control over the mixture beyond the aneroid in the carburetor.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[cafi19]

Ok...someone suggested that the wings may be structurally stronger with the wing tanks. Any thoughts there? If it has a 4 hour range that might be fine. I guess the thought about resale should be considered too....but if most people aren't using their wing tanks much maybe not a factor. I do like the look of the upper induction....but again...if it isn't an issue...I can sacrifice that for a solid plane.

Spent a bunch of time yesterday going through the list of ADs to familiarize myself specifically with the recurring ADs and at what frequency. There are a bunch for sure.

Great information folks. We greatly appreciate all of your feed back.

We are not afraid of a timed out engine....as has been said before....when you rebuild you know what you have. But...the price has to be right and it has to be factored in. That is where it gets difficult. The range is great.

[skywagon8a]

Ok...someone suggested that the wings may be structurally stronger with the wing tanks. Any thoughts there?
As a general rule of thumb when there is fuel in the tip tanks on any airplane, the answer is yes. Consider the lift on the wings must support the entire weight of the airplane. In so doing there is a bending moment on each portion of the wing. When the extra fuel weight is located at the wing tips that reduces the wing bending moments by the weight of the fuel times the distance of the wing tank from the center of the fuselage.

This is why some airplanes with wing tip tanks are allowed to increase their gross weight by the weight of the fuel in those tanks. Only when there is fuel in those tanks.

[Paul Heinrich]

ADs don’t tell the whole story. The status of SBs are equally important.

PM me an address and I will send you all my old paperwork.

[cafi19]

Besides the obvious Covid related issues....how difficult is it to re-register a Canadian plane in the US these days. I remember talking with someone years ago and it was a nightmare. Talked with someone more recently and it seems it was a 4 month process but that plane had been registered in the US in the past. We are looking at one right now that has not been registered in the US...appears (at first glance) to have all the ADs and SBs complied with. With the Canadian Covid restrictions, even if you are vaccinated you still have to quarantine there for 3 days so anyone know a good beaver mechanic that can do pre buys that is in Canada already in case we want to take a closer look at this one?

Thanks!

[aktango58]

For 'essential' travel, the quarantine might not apply, but person in Canada will have an easier time to move about. What region/area of Canada? It is a big place. If it is in the BC area Sea Land in Campbell River would get my nod. Those guys are the west coast go-to.


I have not imported a plane recently, but in reality moving a plane south is not that complicated, but takes time.

One of the advantages of a Canadian plane, especially one flown commercially, they require more documentation on everything, and I believe all Service buliuens are mandatory. Note: on a Beaver these are substantial- and may be why a Canadian plane is a good deal, the operator could be looking at a large investment to comply with SBs, selling and replacing might make sense to them.

Now, coming south- it takes time for Transport Canada to deregister. It takes time to get the annual completed, and ensure all modifications are legal in the USA. What you will know when complete is that the plane is really airworthy.

This is getting exciting!! Hope you find one that fits your wants!

[cafi19]

This post makes me excited!

cafi

[peterdillon]

We live in Manitoba and have connections in the beaver world if thats any help.

[Bayou Navigator]

Well? How bout an update Laura?

[skukum12]

https://alaskaslist.com/-3/posts/10_Transportation/59_Aircraft/606767_1955_De_Havilland_DHC_2_Beaver.html

Another one on alaskaslist.

[cafi19]

We need the jeopardy music here. We have one that we are interested in....but as you know....everything is complicated right now. We will let you know when we know something interesting. I appreciate all the feedback and encouragement. You all are the best!

cafi

[Scouter]

Laura here is a sneak peek at the May/June issue of Flying Magazine.Its a message to you and Steve to act now The pilot in the Beaver is from right here in Exeter, Maine. He moved to Seatle to chase a dream of flying planes like his grand dad did. Started washing planes at Kenmore, then lugging bags and so on. Now is one of ther pilots/instructors Hes a great kid, he took my daughter to the prom when she was in high scool. Pretty impressive Quinn Dillon, were all proud of you

jim
55131

[Paul Heinrich]

Stay away from the PZL Beaver that has been for sale forever. Also, I wouldn’t pursue one with the Baron wing mod. Beaver wing mods are totally unnecessary.

“Very” recent birdcage, prop inspections, engine hours, and AD/SB “retirements,” not just “compliance,” are paramount.

Don't be fooled by lipstick on a pig. And don’t buy one that has EVER been underwater.

[cafi19]

Yes. Don't like lipstick on my pigs for sure. Dont think I have seen PZL but if so...may have already eliminated it. A lot of the ones for sale are ready for overhauls. And while that wont eliminate it entirely....it would be nicer to have one ready to fly when we get it. It will already take a while to get the airworthiness stuff worked out, sounds like.

I am not familiar with the Baron wing mod. What does that entail and why undesirable?

Thanks for the info!!!

[OLDCROWE]

We have a friend with a flock of them, you need to come over and pick his brain.

[cafi19]

Does he have any nice ones that he is ready to part with? :-)

[OLDCROWE]

Does he have any nice ones that he is ready to part with? :-) I can ask, the family owns and operates a flying service in Canada.

[cubdriver2]

Does he have any nice ones that he is ready to part with? :-)

My god girl get a hold of yourself;-)

Glenn

[cafi19]

Ha!

[mvivion]

Yes. Don't like lipstick on my pigs for sure. Dont think I have seen PZL but if so...may have already eliminated it. A lot of the ones for sale are ready for overhauls. And while that wont eliminate it entirely....it would be nicer to have one ready to fly when we get it. It will already take a while to get the airworthiness stuff worked out, sounds like.

I am not familiar with the Baron wing mod. What does that entail and why undesirable?

Thanks for the info!!!


The Barron (I think that's how its spelled) wing mod is a BIG deal. Changes the angle of incidence of the wing, shape, and adds some "gadgets". This mod was developed to improve the "turning" characteristics of the Beaver wing. A lot of pilots killed themselves in tight turning situations (as in a canyon turn) by trying to turn tight without using flaps.

The flaps on a Beaver require that you reach down and select "flaps down" on the selector, then pump them down with a separate lever. That takes some time, so it's not something you do on the spur of the moment.

When I was checked out in the Beaver by Jack Corey, who'd flown most of the deHavilland "bush birds" a LOT, he made me turn and turn and turn that airplane, at altitude, with and without flaps. Without flaps, it was never pretty. With flaps, the thing turns like a Cub, really tight and very safe.

But, if you wait till you need to turn, there's a lot of monkey motion to get the flaps out....

I agree with Paul, you don't need the Barron wing, and it's probably going to represent a pretty big bump in price. That wing may improve stall characteristics some, but in my experience, the Beaver is a nice stalling airplane to begin.

Full disclosure: I've never flown a Barron wing.

MTV

[SJ]

This is great info, folks! We really appreciate all the texts, private messages, emails, etc!

What we really need to do is find someone who wants to downsize to a nice 55' C-180 :)

sj

[algonquin]

Our Beaver has the Barron Kits complete: wings, leading edges, droop aeilrons, leading edges, wing tips. Angles of both the wing and tail are changed. Also electric Hyd. pump for faster flaps. Stretched fuselage double cargo doors. Excellent slow flight ,45 KT on final no problem. The Turbine beaver has a PT-6 and can sit around all the time no problem at all. We fly less than 50 hrs a year. The SHP VARIES between 600 and about 900 depending on the series. The Otter mostly has other turbines than than the PT-6 and around 1000 hp.on the better mods. The bird cage inspection is going for over $30,000. So I’m told, not sure.

[algonquin]

Also forgot, Kenmore is good to do business with, not cheap, but good . Viking is also the same, but will help you also. We personally didn’t enjoy doing business with Mr. Olson , just us, disclaimer. He has a Hugh store of parts though. Great northern in Anchorage is another go source of maintenance infro. Hope this helps.

[Paul Heinrich]

With absolutely no disrespect towards stewartb’s opinion, I completely disagree with everything said in this post. Date night was one of the best perks. A full sized bed with summer satin or silk sheets or flannel if it’s cold is first class love nest travel. Or just use a bunch of couch cushions and let the wave action enhance the performance. And remember it’s not how deep you fish but rather how you wiggle your worm. Wave action does wonders. Also it comes with a built in 18” diameter toilet hole through the bottom for ladies bathroom breaks. Add a short taxi to clean water and you both can dive in and wash away any regret, stds, crabs, and whatever.

It’s a one man plane on floats and wheels. You don’t need a deckhand to catch or let you go. Turning it on wheels is remarkably easy. Main Fueling is done at belly button level and the tips can be fill by walking on the wing rivet lines, as can sweeping the snow off the wings.
Of course IMHO. An Otter is harder but not impossible as a solo.


Beavers are a handful for a private operator. Big and heavy. You need equipment or a crew to handle it. My bro-in-law had one for a while. A nice one, too. Way too much plane for an empty nester private pilot. I always liken my 180 to a Suburban and my Cub to a 4 Runner. A Beaver is like a WW2 deuce and a half. Loud, drafty, smelly, and slow. Not a great choice for date night unless your date is with 6 other big guys.

[mvivion]

Jack Corey told me once tha in his opinion, every seaplane pilot should learn to fly seaplanes in an Otter, or at the very least, a Beaver.

His theory was that too many pilots who learned to fly seaplanes in a Cub THINK they can manhandle a seaplane, but they’re wrong. Flying a bigger seaplane teaches you to finesse the plane on the water, and that’s a skill set that works equally well in any seaplane.

The Beaver is easily handled by one person, but it has to be finessed. Brute force and awkwardness will get you run over. Or worse.

MTV

[Paul Heinrich]

I agree Beavers are good training planes on floats, but for different reasons. A Beaver is incredibly stable, massive, and predictable. It takes a lot of mismanagement to screw something up on TO or ldg. It auto corrects minor foibles and warns you before the big ones.

Consequently, you are forced into learning how a floatplane should perform without making the mistakes that would otherwise scare ragwing pilots. After the lesson the pilot is told this is how it’s suppose to look and feel. Now you get your little plane to do the same thing.

Beavers are very forgiving. I would be more afraid that a Beaver lesson would make the pilot overconfident in a small plane.

Those of you who are in a big FBO or private flight club should rent a beaver for the summer and get everyone checked out and then go explore the Bush as far as the fuel will carry you.

[cubdriver2]

I agree Beavers are good training planes on floats, but for different reasons. A Beaver is incredibly stable, massive, and predictable. It takes a lot of mismanagement to screw something up on TO or ldg. It auto corrects minor foibles and warns you before the big ones.

Consequently, you are forced into learning how a floatplane should perform without making the mistakes that would otherwise scare ragwing pilots. After the lesson the pilot is told this is how it’s suppose to look and feel. Now you get your little plane to do the same thing.

Beavers are very forgiving. I would be more afraid that a Beaver lesson would make the pilot overconfident in a small plane.

Those of you who are in a big FBO or private flight club should rent a beaver for the summer and get everyone checked out and then go explore the Bush as far as the fuel will carry you.

Like a Stearman, pussycat as long as you keep it purring.

Glenn

[mvivion]

Paul,

Im talking about beaching in a strong current, docking in a wind, and current, etc.

MTV

[dgapilot]

I’ve never flown a Beaver on floats, biggest thing is a 206 for me. I found that airplanes on floats were easier than boat hulls in wind. At least the wing and tail generally are above the dock. Things like an LA-4 or Sea Bee with sponsons were much harder to dock. The LA-4 especially since it didn’t have reverse and the wings are so low.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Randyk]

Taxiing a Beaver up to the dock in the wind and/or current is usually easy. The hard part is getting out and securing it to the dock before it floats away. Scrambling out of the pilot door is a practiced maneuver that has the potential of being quite embarrassing and occasionally wet. Especially when the dock/shore is on the right side.

[dgapilot]

Taxiing a Beaver up to the dock in the wind and/or current is usually easy. The hard part is getting out and securing it to the dock before it floats away. Scrambling out of the pilot door is a practiced maneuver that has the potential of being quite embarrassing and occasionally wet. Especially when the dock/shore is on the right side.

Tell me about embarrassing and wet! On my seaplane check ride in the LA-4, I docked to a floating raft. When I pushed off, the raft went back instead of the airplane, and I went into the water!. This was in December upstate NY. It was COLD! Even with that, I got the rating.

[Troy Hamon]

Taxiing a Beaver up to the dock in the wind and/or current is usually easy. The hard part is getting out and securing it to the dock before it floats away. Scrambling out of the pilot door is a practiced maneuver that has the potential of being quite embarrassing and occasionally wet. Especially when the dock/shore is on the right side.

Depends on the floats and water rudders. The Aerocet floats have small water rudders that are completely inadequate to manage once the wind starts gettting above 25 knots. A bunch of the private operators have put on larger water rudders and as a result they have a lot more rudder authority. OAS won't do that unless there is an STC for the larger water rudders...which there isn't...so it can be pretty challenging for some operations.

[mvivion]

Depends on the floats and water rudders. The Aerocet floats have small water rudders that are completely inadequate to manage once the wind starts gettting above 25 knots. A bunch of the private operators have put on larger water rudders and as a result they have a lot more rudder authority. OAS won't do that unless there is an STC for the larger water rudders...which there isn't...so it can be pretty challenging for some operations.

Back in my day, I whined about the size of the EDO 4580 rudders to OAS Maint. When I came back to pick up the plane after 100 hr, voila! New big rudders! No mention, and didn’t ask.

Times change.

MTV

[Bayou Navigator]

Laura, I feel you are letting Steve drag his feet here. Crack the whip! We should be half way into the AWC by now.

[Bayou Navigator]

55326Here’s a day with the beaver. Work for 30 minutes to get the monster out of the hangar, then pull 20 blades through to get rid of hydraulic lock, add a gallon of oil, sump 5 tanks, assess the oil leaking from everywhere, add 10lbs to a tail wheel that looks like it came off a train, climb 2 flights of stairs, say a few choice words to cover the oil on your jeans, pump the wobble pump, reach down and pump the primer, say a few more choice words to cover the fuel all over your jeans, push the mixture forward, crack the throttle, hit the master, hold the starter for 3 blades and flip the mags. Now wait what seems like an eternity for the oil pressure to start coming up only to notice the oil temp gauge is busted, say a few more choice words, pull the mixture, shut off the mags, flip the master, climb down 2 flights of stairs, more oil on jeans and now on shirt, throw the empty oil gallon jug at hangar to release some pressure, spend 30 minutes getting monster back in hangar, get in car, go home and listen to how this one broke this one’s lego toy.

[ak49flyer]

Most of us would give up rather important anatomical components to have your problems...

[SJ]

55326Here’s a day with the beaver. Work for 30 minutes to get the monster out of the hangar, then pull 20 blades through to get rid of hydraulic lock, add a gallon of oil, sump 5 tanks, assess the oil leaking from everywhere, add 10lbs to a tail wheel that looks like it came off a train, climb 2 flights of stairs, say a few choice words to cover the oil on your jeans, pump the wobble pump, reach down and pump the primer, say a few more choice words to cover the fuel all over your jeans, push the mixture forward, crack the throttle, hit the master, hold the starter for 3 blades and flip the mags. Now wait what seems like an eternity for the oil pressure to start coming up only to notice the oil temp gauge is busted, say a few more choice words, pull the mixture, shut off the mags, flip the master, climb down 2 flights of stairs, more oil on jeans and now on shirt, throw the empty oil gallon jug at hangar to release some pressure, spend 30 minutes getting monster back in hangar, get in car, go home and listen to how this one broke this one’s lego toy.

And this may be why the feet are dragging....

sj

[cafi19]

I can't honestly blame SJ. He is a peach! Maybe we are just not fat enough cats to enter into this dream world. The timing is good and the timing is bad. Lots in Canada...but you just cant see them before you buy them. Hmmm....that sounds like fun.

Then...once you buy it and fly it (assuming that you can with the ADs) then you decide it's time to sell it....it could take a while, tying up those assets for longer....and paying the high insurance costs all the while. It is still on the table....but we are taking our time and thinking through all the plusses and minuses.

I am super skiddish right now though.

cafi

[Troy Hamon]

Back in my day, I whined about the size of the EDO 4580 rudders to OAS Maint. When I came back to pick up the plane after 100 hr, voila! New big rudders! No mention, and didn’t ask.

Times change.

MTV

Yes, that would be nice. But OAS seems to have fully transitioned to only super-duper-certificated airplanes and processes. They will not consider anything that is not fully documented via STC at minimum. No field approvals. Mostly it works fine, but for a larger water rudder, nobody else seems to think this is an issue worthy of raising. So they all have bigger water rudders. Small issue in the grand scheme except for a few days in a few places...

[mvivion]

Yes, that would be nice. But OAS seems to have fully transitioned to only super-duper-certificated airplanes and processes. They will not consider anything that is not fully documented via STC at minimum. No field approvals. Mostly it works fine, but for a larger water rudder, nobody else seems to think this is an issue worthy of raising. So they all have bigger water rudders. Small issue in the grand scheme except for a few days in a few places...

It figures. I was sternly cautioned when I picked up that plane with the larger rudders that there was a good reason EDO didn't install larger water rudders on those 4580 floats. With a load, those bigger rudders would permit you to get into a situation you really didn't want to be in.

As always, it was expected that I'd use some judgement. Only scared myself a couple times.

MTV

[BC12D-4-85]

Sometimes someone will grind down the L<>R rudder stops to get more......action. Once the front portion of the rudder gets water pressure from excess taxi speed it can swing on its own to the new stop. Spins a circle when not wanted. Was told by a friend.

Gary

[Bayou Navigator]

Most of us would give up rather important anatomical components to have your problems...

I was not describing a problem, but rather the fruitful joys of beaver ownership.

[ak49flyer]

I was not describing a problem, but rather the fruitful joys of beaver ownership.

Exactly- hence my response:lol:

[aktango58]

55326Here’s a day with the beaver. Work for 30 minutes to get the monster out of the hangar, then pull 20 blades through to get rid of hydraulic lock, add a gallon of oil, sump 5 tanks, assess the oil leaking from everywhere, add 10lbs to a tail wheel that looks like it came off a train, climb 2 flights of stairs, say a few choice words to cover the oil on your jeans, pump the wobble pump, reach down and pump the primer, say a few more choice words to cover the fuel all over your jeans, push the mixture forward, crack the throttle, hit the master, hold the starter for 3 blades and flip the mags. Now wait what seems like an eternity for the oil pressure to start coming up only to notice the oil temp gauge is busted, say a few more choice words, pull the mixture, shut off the mags, flip the master, climb down 2 flights of stairs, more oil on jeans and now on shirt, throw the empty oil gallon jug at hangar to release some pressure, spend 30 minutes getting monster back in hangar, get in car, go home and listen to how this one broke this one’s lego toy.

If only there was a substance that could be put on a plane and oil would come off... we could call it 'soap'. And if only people would use the mythical 'soap' on occasion... In fact, isn't there something about cleaning the plane and inspecting the skin on occasion?

Yes, I have cleaned the beaver's belly. It is embarrassing to have a plane dripping oil from everywhere. Sounds cool, but in reality it is ugly. Only takes 40 or so minutes if you keep up on it.

That said, you think it is easy pulling into a dock all the time? Not every place is open with headwind and against the current, sometimes you get a current coming out from under the dock pushing you out and a wind on the tail twisting you away and into the boat ahead.

On the ground, one person can not move it. A big tug, 4 wheeler needs lots of weight to keep from slipping. Stupid to think they are easy.

That said, with just a little planning, they are a kick! Some of the best flying Lyn and I have done was in the Gullwing coming across the country.

If Kirby can set you up with and Ike plane, just buy it! Ike will tell you the skinny, and be honest. He will be better than a pre-buy, I bet he knows every rivet and gusset by name on every bird!!

As an investment, a solid beaver is probably as good as any. If you have a place that you can rent it for students, there will be lots of interest. Many people want to fly one. If you offer it, they will come.

[RaisedByWolves]

If only there was a substance that could be put on a plane and oil would come off... we could call it 'soap'. And if only people would use the mythical 'soap' on occasion... In fact, isn't there something about cleaning the plane and inspecting the skin on occasion?

Yes, I have cleaned the beaver's belly. It is embarrassing to have a plane dripping oil from everywhere. Sounds cool, but in reality it is ugly. Only takes 40 or so minutes if you keep up on it.

That said, you think it is easy pulling into a dock all the time? Not every place is open with headwind and against the current, sometimes you get a current coming out from under the dock pushing you out and a wind on the tail twisting you away and into the boat ahead.

On the ground, one person can not move it. A big tug, 4 wheeler needs lots of weight to keep from slipping. Stupid to think they are easy.

That said, with just a little planning, they are a kick! Some of the best flying Lyn and I have done was in the Gullwing coming across the country.

If Kirby can set you up with and Ike plane, just buy it! Ike will tell you the skinny, and be honest. He will be better than a pre-buy, I bet he knows every rivet and gusset by name on every bird!!

As an investment, a solid beaver is probably as good as any. If you have a place that you can rent it for students, there will be lots of interest. Many people want to fly one. If you offer it, they will come.

Just wait till you’re cleaning the belly after running a b17 for the first time in a few years. Talk about acreage


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Steve Pierce]

Just wait till you’re cleaning the belly after running a b17 for the first time in a few years. Talk about acreage


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I was at an airshow sporting the new white shirt from the show when a BT13 needed a jump start. Battery is right behind the exhaust on the right side. She fired up and I prematurely went to remove the jumper cables while it was still burping oil out the exhaust pipe. Instant work shirt. ;)

[Steve Pierce]

Just wait till you’re cleaning the belly after running a b17 for the first time in a few years. Talk about acreage


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I was at an airshow sporting the new white shirt from the show when a BT13 needed a jump start. Battery is right behind the exhaust on the right side. She fired up and I prematurely went to remove the jumper cables while it was still burping oil out the exhaust pipe. Instant work shirt. ;)

[cubdriver2]

My best oil story. Back in 99 I flew my Pa11 out to Grassroots flyin in Brodhead Wi. I got there early and why wondering around a red TravelAir biplane flew in and parked. It was dripping oil from stem to stern. Pilot took his gear out of the front seat and threw it on the ground. One big garbage bag got dumped and it was full of old rags.Pilot started cleaning off oil so I grabbed a handful of rags and started from the back wiping off oil, it was everywhere. Took us over an hour and when we got done he said jump in the front and let's go make it dirty again. Awesome low level field and river run for almost an hour. Later that night the pilot and I were sipping beers by the fire and I asked his name. Hi I'm Robbie Bach, Richard Bach's son

Glenn

[Steve Pierce]

I swap wings on Stew Mcpherson's Luscombe. Richards wingman in the Bi-Plane book.

Worst oil story was break loose an oil line on a Corsair upstream of the oil tank. From memory I think it was 30 gallons or so.

[mvivion]

I always laugh when the subject of oil comes up with regard to radial engines. The old argument that if a radial isn't using oil, there's something wrong with it....etc.

The R-985 in the Beaver has an oil tank that sits between the pilot and copilot's feet/knees. That tank holds, if memory serves, about 6 gallons of oil. Let's compare that to an O-320: The 985 has three times the displacement, and about three times the rated power. The max oil quantity of the O-320 is eight quarts, or two gallons....the 985 carries three times that. So far, so good.

Now, if a 320 uses say, a quart every ten to fifteen hours, why wouldn't a 985 use about a gallon over the same period?

And, as we all know, a LITTLE bit of oil thrown makes a HUGE mess. It's all proportional, basically.

In the Beaver I flew in Kodiak, I always carried a 1.5 gallon jug of engine oil. Sort of like carrying a quart or two in a Super Cub. One winter, our maintenance folks needed to do some work on my airplane, so I flew it up to Anchorage for the work. They handed me the keys to a newly refurbished Beaver that'd just been completely re-worked in the Seattle area, including an overhauled engine.

When I arrived in Kodiak with that plane, I noticed it had a single quart can of oil in the baggage compartment. I had to laugh. But, over the next few weeks, I found myself adding just a quart of oil every once in a while. That engine was really tight.

The locals familiar with radials told me they wouldn't trust that engine....sorta jokingly. But, it ran fine, and very clean.

A couple months later, I flew that plane back to ANC and picked up my regular ride. Back to a 1.5 gallon jug.

And, a well lubed belly.

MTV

[DCB]

My 985 was running so well at TBO that I sent it to Tulsa for rebuild instead of risking the unknown origin of an exchange engine. Rex did such an amazing job that it was almost 50 hours of running before a drop of oil appeared on the belly. I have a couple hundred hours on the engine now and it uses a quart in about 10 hours...about the same as my Cub!

[dgapilot]

I always laugh when the subject of oil comes up with regard to radial engines. The old argument that if a radial isn't using oil, there's something wrong with it....etc.

The R-985 in the Beaver has an oil tank that sits between the pilot and copilot's feet/knees. That tank holds, if memory serves, about 6 gallons of oil. Let's compare that to an O-320: The 985 has three times the displacement, and about three times the rated power. The max oil quantity of the O-320 is eight quarts, or two gallons....the 985 carries three times that. So far, so good.

Now, if a 320 uses say, a quart every ten to fifteen hours, why wouldn't a 985 use about a gallon over the same period?

And, as we all know, a LITTLE bit of oil thrown makes a HUGE mess. It's all proportional, basically.

In the Beaver I flew in Kodiak, I always carried a 1.5 gallon jug of engine oil. Sort of like carrying a quart or two in a Super Cub. One winter, our maintenance folks needed to do some work on my airplane, so I flew it up to Anchorage for the work. They handed me the keys to a newly refurbished Beaver that'd just been completely re-worked in the Seattle area, including an overhauled engine.

When I arrived in Kodiak with that plane, I noticed it had a single quart can of oil in the baggage compartment. I had to laugh. But, over the next few weeks, I found myself adding just a quart of oil every once in a while. That engine was really tight.

The locals familiar with radials told me they wouldn't trust that engine....sorta jokingly. But, it ran fine, and very clean.

A couple months later, I flew that plane back to ANC and picked up my regular ride. Back to a 1.5 gallon jug.

And, a well lubed belly.

MTV

Oil quantity was determined underCAR 4 to be one gallon for each 25 gallons of fuel, or one gallon for each 75 hp (except take off) which ever was greater. My Howard had an 8 gallon tank. I seemed to go through about 3/4 of a quart an hour, but it would leak (into the snot box) about a half gallon a week when not in use. I carried a 2 gallon jug of 25W60 in the baggage all the time. More for ballast to get more of an aft loading than anything else.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Paul Heinrich]

My first Beaver flight was instructive. Having started the engine I remembered I hadn’t first checked the oil level, so I leaned over and opened the oil dipstick cap. It took about 2 seconds for the co-pilot footwell to fill with about a gallon of clean 100 weight straight mineral oil. The cleanup took much longer and I never made that mistake again.

[gdrean]

I had a passenger say his left foot was hot and wet. Either he somehow hit the oil cap and it opened or it wasn't fully closed. Quite the mess. He still wears the stained shoes when he flies with me. To remind one of us to check the oil cap I guess.

[aktango58]

Back to the flap lever discussion- getting flaps down...

Every training I have EVER taken drums into your head to fly with the selector in the DOWN position. When you reach over and put a pump in, the flaps will go down.

If not, you will find yourself wishing for flaps. I know of an Otter that went to the ground on base to final, got in a sinker and pilot put in flaps, only to find the lever was in up, and it killed his lift.

Lift flaps- put the lever back to DOWN position, every time

[mvivion]

I had a passenger say his left foot was hot and wet. Either he somehow hit the oil cap and it opened or it wasn't fully closed. Quite the mess. He still wears the stained shoes when he flies with me. To remind one of us to check the oil cap I guess.

I was assigned a "VIP Flight" in Kodiak. Two big wigs from the Department of Interior and our Regional Director, who was a good guy, but not an aviation type.

Took off in the Beaver, Regional Director in the copilot seat, and about twenty minutes out, out of the corner of my eye, I saw him reach over by his left knee and twist and lift the oil filler cap and dipstick. A big glop of very black and nasty looking W_100 Aeroshell went kerplop on his left pant leg, right at his knee.

I was just sort of stunned that someone would open that, but he very calmly put the cap back on, and secured it.....then calmly looked out the window as if nothing had happened. One of the guys in the back seat was literally in hysterics, laughing his butt off.....he came on the intercom and said "So, Keith, do we need to go back to Kodiak and find a laundromat?" Keith took the ribbing well, I thought.

After we landed, he asked me what that cap was for......I explained and he said "Okay, thanks". That was the last time I brought it up with him, but I'm guessing his Washington based compatriots in the back seat reminded him of it a few times.

After that, my pre flight passenger briefing included telling the person in the right seat NOT to touch that oil filler cap.

MTV

[hotrod180]

55418

[mvivion]

55418


Engine oil was just part of it. Our Maintenance guys HATED seeing my Beaver arrive for a 100 hour. I basically coated that airplane with LPS, mostly LPS 3. Floats, gear, everything. The plane lived in salt water a lot. So, to actually inspect the thing, the mechanics had to clean all that stuff off.....lots of solvent and a huge mess to clean up.

Soon as I got it back to Kodiak, the LPS can came out and back at it....It didn't pay to get too close to that plane wearing good clothes.

MTV

[dgapilot]

Engine oil was just part of it. Our Maintenance guys HATED seeing my Beaver arrive for a 100 hour. I basically coated that airplane with LPS, mostly LPS 3. Floats, gear, everything. The plane lived in salt water a lot. So, to actually inspect the thing, the mechanics had to clean all that stuff off.....lots of solvent and a huge mess to clean up.

Soon as I got it back to Kodiak, the LPS can came out and back at it....It didn't pay to get too close to that plane wearing good clothes.

MTV

So no white shirt with epaulets for you?

[RVBottomly]

Thought of you, SJ. This was parked in front of Interstate Aviation in Pullman WA, yesterday.

55420

[SJ]

55428

[ak49flyer]

:lol::pop:

[aktango58]

55428

If you need Bill Rusk and I to bring it down for you, let me know... our training is having a bit of an icy start. Hope lakes open soon!

[Bayou Navigator]

55428

Pic or you’re full of it.

[SJ]

I owe an explanation of my "pending" post, and planned to do it before now but things got busy.

I am very proud of all of the effort that Laura put in learning about Beaver ownership, and we are both incredibly appreciative of all the advice we recieved about them from all of you on this thread, and the many private messages, emails, texts, and phone calls. Thanks to you all!

While we fully expected this to be an expensive proposition, we decided that we are just not big enough players to comfortably swing it - hangar space, AD's, Canadian conversions, resale, gallons of oil, and tons of fuel, it all added up and we said "uncle".

So what is pending, is a piece of property we have a contract on instead - no, not with a runway unfortunately, but some elbow room which is something Laura has always wanted.

Thanks again to all of you, this is a great thread for anyone considering a DHC-2! You are all the best!

sj & lj

[cubdriver2]

I think we need a new catagory in the forum index.
" I want to date Jennifer Aniston but not sure she will like me. Can you help?"

Glenn

[40m]

I think we need a new catagory in the forum index.
" I want to date Jennifer Aniston but not sure she will like me. Can you help?"

Glenn

Glad to help, I'll keep the J4 flying while you heal from Bev's beating!:bang

[SJ]

I think we need a new catagory in the forum index.
" I want to date Jennifer Aniston but not sure she will like me. Can you help?"

Glenn

HA!

sj

[Bayou Navigator]

I owe an explanation of my "pending" post, and planned to do it before now but things got busy.

I am very proud of all of the effort that Laura put in learning about Beaver ownership, and we are both incredibly appreciative of all the advice we recieved about them from all of you on this thread, and the many private messages, emails, texts, and phone calls. Thanks to you all!

While we fully expected this to be an expensive proposition, we decided that we are just not big enough players to comfortably swing it - hangar space, AD's, Canadian conversions, resale, gallons of oil, and tons of fuel, it all added up and we said "uncle".

So what is pending, is a piece of property we have a contract on instead - no, not with a runway unfortunately, but some elbow room which is something Laura has always wanted.

Thanks again to all of you, this is a great thread for anyone considering a DHC-2! You are all the best!

sj & lj

WOW! I would’ve lied, like, forever.

[SJ]

WOW! I would’ve lied, like, forever.

We also figured with you being so close, we would just come over and fly yours... :-)

sj

[Dave Calkins]

Steve. Finally someone makes a really great decision in 2021

[aktango58]

You are not in Kansas anymore, so flying houses are a bit less common...

Elbow room property, does that mean a cub strip or heli pad?

Beavers are a big bite. If you knew you had work for it, or you had all the money you wish you had, maybe!!

Enjoy the property, pictures?

[flywhatever]

Yeah Mike those were the days, I always wanted to get a pic of you in the piston beaver, me in the stock turbine beaver, and the Pinocchio beaver, but alas we were always working too hard...

I worked a Beaver for several years in Kodiak. It was on amphibious floats. Actually, the floats were the vast majority of maintenance on that plane. The P and W 985 is a great engine, with proper pilot technique. Consistent and thorough warm up and respect of limits is key to keeping that engine happy. Kenmore long ago significantly increased their average time between overhaul by mandating warm ups.
otherwise very reliable engines. Some use a bit of oil, but I’ve flown really tight ones.

The airframe is arguably one of the toughest, most durable ever built. There’s a reason that lots of Alaska coastal air taxi operators went to Cessna 206s, but many have now gone back to Beavers. Load haulers, but they tolerate the work much better.

Consider the average total time of virtually all Beavers.....the one I flew was “low time” when I flew it, at 7000 hours or so. That was in the 80s. It was sold then and went to an air taxi. It’s still flying air taxi in Kodiak....a year round gig, btw.

Theyre tough in other words. I was devastated when management replaced that Beaver with a new 206.

MTV

[cafi19]

55535555365553955538

Here you go....We might have to come up with a good beaver name for the place (even if the street is a bird name). If all goes well....we will close on June 1st, almost a year to the day that we closed on the current house. That's a record for us I think.

Greatly appreciate all the help in this. It was really hard NOT to choose a beaver....but I think we would have kicked ourselves having done it. Sigh! Who knows, maybe someday we will try it again.

cafi

[cubdriver2]

Very nice, but a pool might be more maintenance then a beaver ;- )

Glenn

[40m]

Very nice, but a pool might be more maintenance then a beaver ;- )

Glenn
That's no pool that's a beaver pond.

[SJ]

Very nice, but a pool might be more maintenance then a beaver ;- )

Glenn

TRUE! I mainted two pools for a hotel when I worked there... I swore I would never own one! YIKES

[SJ]

that's no pool that's a beaver pond.

ha! :)

[cafi19]

It's a saltwater pool which is supposedly less difficult to maintain and it is just a wee little thing so.... I think they call it a dipping pool. We don't have the lake anymore and I don't hold up well in the heat....so this is the next best thing.

cafi

[Steve Pierce]

Yea, all those trees are gonna be the maintenance part. They make good composting bins until you get enought dirt to fill them in. Don't ask how I know. ;)


Congrats, looks like an awesome place. How long is the bike ride to downtown and the airport?

[skywagon8a]

55536 cafi
Is that a pipe line right of way crossing the upper third of the property? Perhaps an old railroad bed?

[SJ]

Is that a pipe line right of way crossing the upper third of the property? Perhaps an old railroad bed?

It's a small power line easement.

[SJ]

Congrats, looks like an awesome place. How long is the bike ride to downtown and the airport?

It's about 1 mile from Sugar Creek (58AR), 4 miles from the square, and 6.5 miles to KVBT.

sj

[Bayou Navigator]

621356213462136
You can expect to do crap like this.